Universal Suffrage for males... why did it happen ?

Hrothbern

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My best analysis in my country is that universal suffrage for males did NOT happen because of some bottom up peoples movement.

It started in its proto-phase with giving suffrage to males that owned property, a business, paid tax above a census... and gradually grew to more and more males, until 100% completion in 1917.

Looking at that development and the political decisions in my country, I think it can be summarised into a political struggle between the elite political parties, where granting more suffrage was mostly part of their mutual rivalry to get more power.

Any thoughts on how that happened in other countries ?
 
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Democratization also correlates with enlightenment notions of political power residing in the people, which correlates with the rise of nationalism in the wake of the French revolution, and levee en masse. Even in ancient Greece and Italian city states more democratic polities tended to lean more on the general populace as the center of their military force. Is it just a coincidence, I'm not sure.

Edit: I'm pretty sure classical commonwealth thinkers emphesized that true citizens with political rights are those that serve in the military.
 
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Democratization also correlates with enlightenment notions of political power residing in the people, which correlates with the rise of nationalism in the wake of the French revolution, and levee en masse. Even in ancient Greece and Italian city states more democratic polities tended to lean more on the general populace as the center of their military force. Is it just a coincidence, I'm not sure.

Edit: I'm pretty sure classical commonwealth thinkers emphesized that true citizens with political rights are those that serve in the military.

yes
levee en masse, getting soldiers, is a good point !
Nobility no longer owned peasant soldiers like in Medieval time, and could not deliver them anymore as a kind of tax to their high nobility, kings.
And that means fundamentally that every citizen paid his own tax (tax census suffrage) by his contribution in the levee en masse, and should get voting rights back.
The first "country" in the world giving universal suffrage to males was the principality of Luik (Liège) in Belgium in 1792 during their independance revolt (citizen soldiers for a citizen stake in power).
 
Not sure universal suffrage “for males” is any universal suffrage. Universal suffrage is also a damn grey area. Men have had something similar to “universal suffrage for males” since 1866 in Sweden. Women were not allowed to vote until 1919. Convicted criminals were not allowed to vote until 1937. Swedish Romani people not until 1959. The mentally ill or disabled not until 1989.

I believe all the work up to women’s suffrage was basically grassroots movements. The liberal party formed in 1900 and held petitions and collected lists of names like liberals do. The Social Democrats formed in 1880s and held general strikes and protest rallies like Social Democrats do and I’ll let you guess which way was more effective. However, together they won a non conservative majority first time in 1920.

The age of enlightenment in the 1600-1700s had a great long term effect as well but universal suffrage has in practice always been what I guess you mean by bottom up peoples movement. At least in Sweden.
 
My best analysis in my country is that universal suffrage for males did NOT happen because of some bottom up peoples movement.

It started in its proto-phase with giving suffrage to males that owned property, a business, paid tax above a census... and gradually grew to more and more males, until 100% completion in 1917.

Looking at that development and the political decisions in my country, I think it can be summarised into a political struggle between the elite political parties, where granting more suffrage was mostly part of their mutual rivalry to get more power.

Any thoughts on how that happened in other countries ?

I think that was the case in the UK too.
The Great Reform Act took power away from the Tory land-owning elite and gave the vote to the property owning middle-classes who supported the pro-free trade reformist Liberals.
Later acts to extend the vote were often supported by Tories who hoped the working-class man would vote against the pro-business Liberals or that rural voters would vote for their social superiors.
Women's Suffrage was more of a grassroots movement but there was still division between those who supported votes for all women and those who were happy with the idea of just votes for propertied women.
 
Not sure universal suffrage “for males” is any universal suffrage. Universal suffrage is also a damn grey area. Men have had something similar to “universal suffrage for males” since 1866 in Sweden. Women were not allowed to vote until 1919. Convicted criminals were not allowed to vote until 1937. Swedish Romani people not until 1959. The mentally ill or disabled not until 1989.

I believe all the work up to women’s suffrage was basically grassroots movements. The liberal party formed in 1900 and held petitions and collected lists of names like liberals do. The Social Democrats formed in 1880s and held general strikes and protest rallies like Social Democrats do and I’ll let you guess which way was more effective. However, together they won a non conservative majority first time in 1920.

The age of enlightenment in the 1600-1700s had a great long term effect as well but universal suffrage has in practice always been what I guess you mean by bottom up peoples movement. At least in Sweden.

I did not use universal suffrage including women because there are so many countries where it took so much longer to get in that gender respect universal suffrage.
The same with suffrage for criminals, mentally disabled etc.
At the moment suffrage was there for all male, irrespective of income and wealth the landslide in democratic power towards the traditional elites is there.

I do think WW1 played a role because there came in some countries a general instability for the ruling class.
In the phase before WW1 socialist movements for sure played a role. But much of their power, their credits to spend so to say, was aimed at improving workers conditions by the direct struggle between employees and employers.
So, nothwithstanding suffrage incl for women was on their banner, was the influence on suffrage from the socialists because they were powerfull ? Or because they were convenient for the sitting elites in their own rivalry ?
 
My best analysis in my country is that universal suffrage for males did NOT happen because of some bottom up peoples movement.

It started in its proto-phase with giving suffrage to males that owned property, a business, paid tax above a census... and gradually grew to more and more males, until 100% completion in 1917.

Looking at that development and the political decisions in my country, I think it can be summarised into a political struggle between the elite political parties, where granting more suffrage was mostly part of their mutual rivalry to get more power.
You can prove that virtually anything is the product of elite machinations if you look exclusively at the legal mechanisms by which it was achieved. Simply because there wasn't a vast column of peasants marching on the capital doesn't mean those elite decisions were not a response to popular pressure. After all, if the poor had no interest in voting, what political advantage could have been gained by extending the franchise?
 
You can prove that virtually anything is the product of elite machinations if you look exclusively at the legal mechanisms by which it was achieved. Simply because there wasn't a vast column of peasants marching on the capital doesn't mean those elite decisions were not a response to popular pressure. After all, if the poor had no interest in voting, what political advantage could have been gained by extending the franchise?

There is a difference between the poor benefitting to vote, and the poor organising themselves to vote, directly on topic or indirectly by joining for (also) that reason for example a socialist movement.
But when the elite of a socialist movement decides to put suffrage in its banner, and their followers do not mind, are happy with it, it is not a direct movement for suffrage.

I made the post to find out how it went in other countries. I know, think to know, how it went in my country, and I summarised that in my conclusion for NL.
Going more into detail of that development in NL:

The big step happens in 1848, when we got a parliamentary monarchy on the wake of the liberal revolt. This was good for 10% of the males having the right to vote.
But this 1848 step was most of all correcting that we got back "our Dutch Republic" that was run over by Napoleon.
Those "liberals" were already in charge in the last 100 years of the Dutch Republic.
That stupid Restauration, where the monarchies of Europe divided among themselves the power again after Napoleon, was a big regression for the Netherlands. We got back an absolute Monarchy, that we had not have since 1568.

Well... those liberals, the progressive faction, pushed for increasing the % of voters step by step, supported by socialists in the end of the 19th century, but were hindered by the Conservatives, partially conservative liberals and partially Protestants, who favored the House of Orange in a stronger role. The same split-up as during the two centuries of the Dutch Republic. More Liberals in the cities, more Conservatives, Orangists in rural areas.
However, what changed with Napoleon was the general education for all citizens. And the Liberals wanted this education to be secular and not Christian, and had so much control on the government that there was only money for secular schools and universities. The christians needed to raise their own church tax to pay for christian schools, to control the cultural education of their children. With the increasing duration of education by law, this became more expensive.
Perhaps this sounds all silly seen from another country but this school funding battle dominates Dutch politics from 1815 to 1917.
In 1917 the progressive Liberals and the Socialists (also secular in profile) made the deal with the protestant conservatives that suffrage for all males was accepted in exchange for the state paying for christian schools. In 1919 this became universal suffrage, despite resistance from the conservative christians (the man is the sovereign Lord of the family).
The way I write it up is having the Socialists in a side role, but that does not mean that that they did not contribute. It only comes in the last phase.
In 1870 women start to discuss emancipation, in 1889 the VVV is founded, the woman's suffragettes, and it was founded as a broad autonomous movement, that wanted to be no part of any other movement or political party. One issue and support from all segments of society. The main activities were directed at emancipation of women in all aspects of life. Emancipation. The right to vote just one of the targets.
In the early 1890ies the Socialists sought support of the VVV for suffrage for male in exchange for suffrage for women, but could not accept the full package of the VVV. In practice the Socialists were not that emancipated. More than the conservative christians ofc, but less than the progressive Liberals.
So we have around 1900 meanwhile a census vote right that allows 50% of all males to vote, progressive women bashing their (progressive) husbands, and a workers class, male (and female), having no right to vote.
It is at about this point in time that the Socialist movement and parties in NL start really making a fist to get suffrage for all males. Perhaps also noteworthy that it is the moderate SDAP, SocialisticDemocraticLabourParty, that had voting rights high in the banner and organised around 1910 the Red Tuesdays for that goal, and NOT the more radical Socialist party SDB from which the SDAP splitted off in 1894.
The other big strategic change that takes place is that the VVV splits in two movements. The VVV keeps getting voting rights in its banner. The new NBV put voting rights in postponed "mode", and focused on emancipation only to "preprare" women for the time that voting rights for women "made sense". The NBV covered the more conservative Liberals and moderates.
All in all this split up worked very good for the woman's emancipation and its power accumulation, because their emancipation efforts became wider accepted and covered meanwhile the whole society in a non-political party fashion. The Socialists covered as party the workers women, and only the christian women were not covered. (leading in that end-phase to get the christians on board for voting rights in exchange for state paid christian schools).

Against this background of societal developments there is ofc a lot of politics as well (too much for this post to describe all that as function of the increased % of voting rights and the potentials from higher % voting rights), and until 1900 the progressive Liberals are the winners in these intra-parliaments rivalries, and sadly enough, when they reached their two goals, male suffrage in 1917 and universal suffrage in 1919, they were not rewarded by the voters... because after all, most of the Dutch population was still christian raised and the major part of that, the lower educated, not that progressive and with 100% suffrage that took effect.
For most of the next 70 years, until 1990, the christian political parties dominated the Parliament, and the best governments were mostly christian-socialist coalitions.

Perhaps the Netherlands is simply too progressive Liberal and woman emancipated for the Socialists (of that time) to have had a chance to develop enough grassroot power in time to have played a bigger role.
 
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In Finland universal male and female suffrage was granted after the Russian empire (of which Finland was an autonomous part of) lost the war against Japan in 1904-05. In the turmoil following the lost war and the poor conditions of Russians generally, the czar was forced to institute liberal reforms in order to get the liberal's loyalty against the more revolutionary socialists. In Russia they create the duma with class determining votes needed to pass, but in Finland by the recommendation of a Finnish delegation, the czar instituted universal suffrage for men and women over the age of 21. Before that Finland had basically a medieval representative parliament of burgers, peasants, priests and the nobility. All male of course.
 
Perhaps this sounds all silly seen from another country but this school funding battle dominates Dutch politics from 1815 to 1917.
School funding battles are front and center in my province right now. Our new government wants to repeal the changes made by the previous government, which has the faith-based, publicly-funded schools sighing in relief that they won't have to allow GSAs (Gay/Straight Alliance clubs) if they don't want to, and if they discover any of their students join one (if they allow them), the teacher is expected to notify the parents - regardless of whether or not the kid has come out to the parents, and regardless if it would be safe for the parents to even know.

The previous government made GSAs mandatory for all schools receiving public funding and any that didn't comply would have provincial funding pulled. A long list of faith-based schools were not in compliance and the deadline was later this year.

And so the fight has heated up again as to why these schools that are not part of either the public system or the Catholic system are even getting government funds in the first place.

My own MLA (Member of the Legislative Assembly) is a former member of the Catholic school board and this mess is now her responsibility. She's the one responsible for potentially making some kids' lives miserable.

And on an interesting side note, there's a federal private member's bill in the works to lower the voting age to 16 (something I approve of; I was ready to vote at that age). It likely won't get passed, but it's not the first time an MP has drafted something to lower the voting age. The rationale is that to persuade people that voting is important, they should let the kids vote while they're still in school and have the chance to learn about how the whole democratic system works. After all, they're the ones who are affected by decisions made by adults - most of whom haven't been in school for 10+ years when they make these decisions.
 
And on an interesting side note, there's a federal private member's bill in the works to lower the voting age to 16 (something I approve of; I was ready to vote at that age). It likely won't get passed, but it's not the first time an MP has drafted something to lower the voting age. The rationale is that to persuade people that voting is important, they should let the kids vote while they're still in school and have the chance to learn about how the whole democratic system works. After all, they're the ones who are affected by decisions made by adults - most of whom haven't been in school for 10+ years when they make these decisions.

I am in favor for 16 year voting age.
I would start with doing that for local elections (the municipalities), get feedback from society, expect it to be positive, and then move on for voting rights for 16+ for the national elections.
My experience when talking with young people is that they are often much more serious in preparing themselves for a well-informed choice than many "adults" think.
School time is learning time... open mind time.
It is their future.
I have when lucky only 20 years left... they a whole life.

Austria does it already for 16+.

The school battle no longer dominates our politics, but it has never gone completely.
Yes or no non-religious teachers, yes or no gay teachers, etc, etc, etc.
Since Trump the strictest christian political party SGP (very small) here in NL has gone on the profiling offensive.
 
My only reservation about a lower voting age is that it could further politicize schools, like teachers unduly influencing, or more realistically, outside factions trying to frame things in that way to score points.
 
My only reservation about a lower voting age is that it could further politicize schools, like teachers unduly influencing, or more realistically, outside factions trying to frame things in that way to score points.

yes
that is a good point
Once you have a bit of polarising on your schools, this is partially passed on.
How counterproductive that is depends on country and region and mitigations.
 
I must say, a part of me is most intrigued by the concept of universal suffering for males......:ack::whipped: :mischief:
 
My best analysis in my country is that universal suffrage for males did NOT happen because of some bottom up peoples movement.

It started in its proto-phase with giving suffrage to males that owned property, a business, paid tax above a census... and gradually grew to more and more males, until 100% completion in 1917.

Looking at that development and the political decisions in my country, I think it can be summarised into a political struggle between the elite political parties, where granting more suffrage was mostly part of their mutual rivalry to get more power.

Any thoughts on how that happened in other countries ?

I'd say in Germany it was different. The first (proto-)national elections that had (sort of) universal suffrage for men were the elections for the National Assembly after the 1848 revolution. I think that qualifies as a result of a peoples movement, even if the laws were obviously drawn up by members of the elite. After the revolution and the provisional government were crushed shortly later, parts of their ideas were picked up by Prussia under Bismarck to form Germany on the terms of the Prussian nobility. Universal suffrage was one of these ideas that were co-opted in order to strengthen support for the Prussian idea of a German nation and against Austria. So when Germany was founded, it included universal suffrage for men from the get-go and there were never national elections without that. In the end, political parties were not involved, because it was just imposed by the monarchy.
 
Perhaps this sounds all silly seen from another country but this school funding battle dominates Dutch politics from 1815 to 1917.

That is not at all strange. The major fight between liberals and conservatives all around southern Europe started in the 18th century and was very much centered on control of education by the Church. The Jesuits were disbanded in the late 18th century as a consequence of the "liberals" of the time centralizing power in the state. These were the top "public servants" of the crown, the noblesse de robe of the ancient regime. Many would go on to support the French Revolution's ideas, and later would fight on the liberal side in civil wars to put an end to the remnants of the old aristocracy and its support base in the religious institutions. To put down (and replace) the old aristocracy they had to enact social changes, and for that they had top wrestle control over education. The Liberals were, though most people do not realize it, already in control in the 18th century, setting up the beginnings of the modern centralized states. Absolutism was the "liberal" side during that time. Or, if you find that shocking, planted the seeds of liberalism.
 
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There is a difference between the poor benefitting to vote, and the poor organising themselves to vote, directly on topic or indirectly by joining for (also) that reason for example a socialist movement.
But when the elite of a socialist movement decides to put suffrage in its banner, and their followers do not mind, are happy with it, it is not a direct movement for suffrage.
You're still taking political leaders actions in a void: citing the fact that the franchise was expanded through gradual, legislative reform that this was a purely elite-driven project. You take it for granted that popular pressure can only manifest itself through insurgent movements, as if politicians exist in some sort of parliamentary pocket-dimension and never interact with the broader population, as if they do not depend on the support of party organisations and of organised interest groups at a national, regional and local level. History is not cleanly divided into elite action and popular revolt.
 
@Traitorfish What you mention recalls me of a recent polemic among historians about when exactly the influence of the church declined in the 18th century, and why. Some have pointed out that at the beginning of the process the aristocracy ceased placing its younger sons and daughters in jobs inside the Church. Social change somehow predated political change: the church then became expendable and its economic influence and social influence cut down.
The thing it, it is still a debate on moves done by the elites. The "lower" population, the mass of the population who was still rural in much of Europe, was on the side that resisted change, and is usually is on that side. It was certainly on that side in opposition to the liberals in the 19th century. It always had to be dragged kicking and screaming (and shot at and bayoneted) into "modernity". In England this happened a long time earlier but the situation was similar: Henry VIII abolished the monasteries and the plebeians rebelled against him and were put down.

Much as it would be nice to believe that movement is commanded from below, the weight of the evidence points to the influence of the decisions taken above.
 
What you mention recalls me of a recent polemic among historians about when exactly the influence of the church declined in the 18th century, and why. Some have pointed out that at the beginning of the process the aristocracy ceased placing its younger sons and daughters in jobs inside the Church. Social change somehow predated political change: the church then became expendable and its economic influence and social influence cut down.

The founding of universities, a couple of centuries earlier (in urban areas), by nobility and towns also diminished the grip, influence and usefulness of the church on knowledge and education of the younger nobility and nouveau riche.

You're still taking political leaders actions in a void: citing the fact that the franchise was expanded through gradual, legislative reform that this was a purely elite-driven project. You take it for granted that popular pressure can only manifest itself through insurgent movements, as if politicians exist in some sort of parliamentary pocket-dimension and never interact with the broader population, as if they do not depend on the support of party organisations and of organised interest groups at a national, regional and local level. History is not cleanly divided into elite action and popular revolt.

I will come back on this.
Not easy for me to get that straight in my head.
If you take "elite" as a more neutral word (so not clique), then that elite is connected to the rest, with all kinds of feedbacks also from stakeholderships and needed buy ins. But much more as a governmental orientated elite before 1800-1850-1900 depending on country.
 
Income tax didn't really exist until the 19th century. People expect stuff when they pay tax, see USA. Political elites slowly expanded power to relieve social tensions in places like England. Later countries like NZ were used as social laboratories. When the world didn't end when one group got the right to vote the expanded it to include others. It took a while for the idea of the loyal opposition to sink in.
 
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