v 26, and above ALL Bugs/Crashes reporting thread

[Lexotan_sedlex]

The tec Stargazing give me a extra priest. I think is old code.

 

[Dancing Hoskuld]

Hello,

The icon of Priesthood and Scriptures is the same.

Cya.

yes we know - we need sme more icon art.

The icon of resource Resin is the same icon of resource Lhama.

if you man in the city screen they are the same, it is probably because we are missing many of the 16X16 tga format icons for that screen.

My hunters and my rogue in auto patrol and auto hunt attacks even if the odds are very low. I put 75 of minimal odds and them are attacking with 10% odds.

You will need to post a save game highlighting this to help us fix it.

The tec Stargazing give me a extra priest. I think is old code.

That does sound odd - Hydro?

 

[Lexotan_sedlex]

The Resin plant picking camp is improving automatically in 23 turns in plantation even if the tec of resin plantation is not developed yet.

 

[Dancing Hoskuld]

Auto hunt and auto pirate Boats have gone back to thinking terrain damage is a good thing and sitting on reefs and coral until they sink.

 

[Koshling]

Auto hunt and auto pirate Boats have gone back to thinking terrain damage is a good thing and sitting on reefs and coral until they sink.

I'm still looking for a save gam illustrating these issues so I can fix...

 

[Dancing Hoskuld]

I'm still looking for a save gam illustrating these issues so I can fix...

The last save I posted had it happening, I think. The pirates who are so facinated by the croc in the lake they can't get to spend a lot of time getting damaged to the north east. When I removed the croc in WB they started to spend more time in the reefs. It maybe that they just aren't healing themselves after they get damaged. I have noticed a few of the AI scout/hunter units doing the same thing.

 

[Thunderbrd]

The tec Stargazing give me a extra priest. I think is old code.

Yeah... probably a left over first free prophet tag use. I have on my list a project that will remove the need for that tag at all.



@Koshling: Well... they're building healers now. A LOT of healers in fact! The AI cities we can see are flooding themselves (more healers than other kinds of units combined) in direct response to the attempt to get them to recognize the threat of disease. This includes in cities where there currently is no Disease Property increase as it is.

I'll have some BBAI logs with my OOS reports for you there tonight.

 

[Koshling]

Yeah... probably a left over first free prophet tag use. I have on my list a project that will remove the need for that tag at all.



@Koshling: Well... they're building healers now. A LOT of healers in fact! The AI cities we can see are flooding themselves (more healers than other kinds of units combined) in direct response to the attempt to get them to recognize the threat of disease. This includes in cities where there currently is no Disease Property increase as it is.

I'll have some BBAI logs with my OOS reports for you there tonight.

BBAI logs are unlikely to help. What is needed is a save game where a city decides to build a healer even though there is no disease

 

[Koshling]

Two problems:-

1) Saltwater crocs and other sea animals should not be spawning in fresh water lakes. This may be a problem with the map script since the lake is both Tropical Coast and Fresh Water - perhaps we need to more terrains "Fresh Water Coast" and "Deep Fresh Water"?

2) My pirate ships on auto pirate are trying to get that croc in the lake near Hittite. In general auto pirate seems to be "hunt animals" first including explore and then pirate action. If I wanted them to hunt and explore I would have given them the hunt command not the pirate command.

Which pirate ships appear to be after the croc? The only ones I see nearby are the stack of 3 a bit north up the coast, and they are all headed further north...

Edit - ok I think I understand it - they are not fixated with the croc at all. What happens is that they start off near the city, and pick a target plot some way up north (about 3 turns away) [to blockade I think but not sure]. On the way they hit the reef and take damage. The next turn they see that they are damaged, cannot heal where they are, so retreat back into safe territory by the city to heal. Once they are healed the cycle begins again...
...this isn't trivial to fix, but I'll see what I can do.

 

[Lexotan_sedlex]

Dyes are duplicate in list of resources.

I guess i solve the cause of problem of plantations build even if you dont have calendar and orchads.
The problem is i developed orchads, but not calendar yet, maybe the mod is considering only orchads to prerequisite to build plantation if your city is working that tile.

My works cant build plantation, but if the city works the tile, in 23 turns a plantation spread out.

 

[Dancing Hoskuld]

Dyes are duplicate in list of resources.

Are you using the SVN version or the patched v26 version?

I guess i solve the cause of problem of plantations build even if you dont have calendar and orchads.
The problem is i developed orchads, but not calendar yet, maybe the mod is considering only orchads to prerequisite to build plantation if your city is working that tile.

Fruit resources that used to require calendar to get plantations now get orchards instead at the earlier tech. Other plant resources like sugar still require plantations and don't get orchards. There was one resource that was defined to both but I fixed that. Olives and Grapes are still special with their own top level improvements at different techs.

My works cant build plantation, but if the city works the tile, in 23 turns a plantation spread out.

This is normal improvement upgrade behaviour. There is noting I can do to change it except reduce the time it takes to upgrade when worked. Which I have done for v27. The only difference between the two improvement is the amount of , and you get from the plot.

Which pirate ships appear to be after the croc? The only ones I see nearby are the stack of 3 a bit north up the coast, and they are all headed further north...

Edit - ok I think I understand it - they are not fixated with the croc at all. What happens is that they start off near the city, and pick a target plot some way up north (about 3 turns away) [to blockade I think but not sure]. On the way they hit the reef and take damage. The next turn they see that they are damaged, cannot heal where they are, so retreat back into safe territory by the city to heal. Once they are healed the cycle begins again...
...this isn't trivial to fix, but I'll see what I can do.

Edit so it is just a coinsidence of terrain that I loose all 5 pirates without battle.

 

[Koshling]

Edit so it is just a coinsidence of terrain that I loose all 5 pirates without battle.

Yup, I think so. Fix incoming...

 

[Lexotan_sedlex]

the descripition of metal casting is outdated.

 

[AIAndy]

I cannot find any evidence of a bug here. When I sell the fire pit in Paris no building processing is triggered (as one would expect since it's already inactive), and no change to the displayed properties occurs (it might well do the next turn, but if so I don't think this is why - just coincidence).

Actually there is a bug there (and it might also influence some AI decisions in a bad way).
CvCity::getTotalBuildingSourcedProperty uses getNumBuilding((BuildingTypes)iI) to see if a building is there but that one does not exclude obsolete buildings. When you sell the obsolete building, no building processing is done so the cache is not cleared which is why you don't see a change until the next time a building is processed.
This needs to be changed to getNumActiveBuilding.

EDIT: I will fix that shortly.

 

[Lexotan_sedlex]

Are you using the SVN version or the patched v26 version?

I always use the last svn.

 

[Hydromancerx]

yes we know - we need sme more icon art.

Here is an icon/button for scriptures. (see attachment)

That does sound odd - Hydro?

Yeah. Must be left over when Kemetisim was at Stargazing tech. Other old religious techs should be checked too.

 

[Il Principe]

I build a wall in one of my cities, and I got a wonder video like popup.

And as you can see in the screenshot, the picture for it looks a lot like it should realy belong to Wall Street, not the wall that protects my city from intruders

 

[Dancing Hoskuld]

@Koshling an example of a stack avoiding roads where it can when moving so that it takes as long as possible to get to its destination. See the stack south of Gaza.

I build a wall in one of my cities, and I got a wonder video like popup.

And as you can see in the screenshot, the picture for it looks a lot like it should realy belong to Wall Street, not the wall that protects my city from intruders

That would be because people were lazy. The movie name for Hadrian's Wall and Wall Street was the same Walls.bik. When I moved the Hdrian's Wall stuff into core I changed the name of the bik file forgetting that the first walls you build also give you the movie from Hadrian's Wall.

easy to fix, I think.

Edit wrong, it is in Hydros files somewhere. @Hydro please change the movie for walls to ART_DEF_MOVIE_HADRIAN_WALL. Thanks.

 

[Koshling]

Yeah... probably a left over first free prophet tag use. I have on my list a project that will remove the need for that tag at all.



@Koshling: Well... they're building healers now. A LOT of healers in fact! The AI cities we can see are flooding themselves (more healers than other kinds of units combined) in direct response to the attempt to get them to recognize the threat of disease. This includes in cities where there currently is no Disease Property increase as it is.

I'll have some BBAI logs with my OOS reports for you there tonight.

I've just fixed (not yet pushed to SVN) a bug that caused it to build property-mitigating units (healers in this case) when the property was already WAY out of control (there's not really much point in trying to fight it with units if it's so far out of control that you won't see any impact without building lots).

However, I can't find any evidence of a bug that causes it to build disease control units at city disease values already at or below 0, so if you can reproduce that I really need a savegame so I can step through the code concerned.

More widely (@Hydro mostly, but others may have views too), I am concerned that 'legitimate' builds of healers may STILL cause the AI to overbuild dramatically over time. The scenario that concerns me is this:

Initially your cities are small and there isn't much disease, so it can be controlled fairly easily by buildings or perhaps a single unit.

As the city grows, buildings do not keep pace with the rate of disease from population (to a greater extent than is true for crime I think - both available buildings and the amount of disease they counteract compared to era-by-era equivalents for crime). As a result the AI will keep finding itself (basically every time the city grows with occasional gaps as new buildings come on line) in a situation where building one more healer will bring things under control. Consequently it will do so. The problem is that at each decision point it just needs a single unit so it looks cheap, but what it cannot see is the long term trend, which will mean that by the middle ages it'll likely need 20 healers per city or something, which would destroy its economy.

This doesn't happen for crime because the rate of crime production is fairly well balanced against the amount you can fight it with buildings and improving units as your tech improves.

My concern is that disease is less well balanced currently, and this progressive one-more-healer-will-solve-it situation is likely to arise as a result.

By comparison building sources for negative crime (in aggregate) seem to exceed those for disease in most eras. Similarly unit upgrades and promotions to help fight crime seem more prevalent than healer unit upgrades and promotions. This is compounded by the fact that all the effects of disease take place (currently) in the range 0-100, whereas crime scales out to nearly 1000.

My suggestions would be:

1. We may need some balancing work done on healer-line/disease-fighting buildings
2. Healer unit promotions do NOT include extra disease-fighting like their crime fighting counterparts do - surely they should
3. Since disease takes its fullest effect at only 100, we should probably not be feeding in 4/population like we are for crime that scales up to 1000. 1 or 2 per pop seems more appropriate (note that the disease-fighting buildings are mostly -1 or -2 with very few larger ones at least until the modern era, which seems like another argument for lowering the per- pop input amount)
4. Until we do some or all of the above it might be better to turn off the disease AIWeight entirely and just accept that the AI will always have rampant disease (essentially because there isn't really a choice anyway, so players will too, at least until roughly the modern age)

 

[Koshling]

@Koshling an example of a stack avoiding roads where it can when moving so that it takes as long as possible to get to its destination. See the stack south of Gaza.

That path is clearly wrong, but I cannot reproduce it. When I load the game and select that stack it displays the correct path (and as I sweep the end point around it continues to display correct paths for all nearby target plots).

Does it reproduce for you from a fresh load of that save? If so do you have any BUG options that might be affecting things? (terrain damage is on for me, as is use AI pathing, not sure what else would influence it)