Vassals
- Thread starter Putmalk
- Start date
I am making some adjustments to what you need to do to be eligible to break independence from your Master (assuming you are capitulated, of course). Everything will be documented in the Overview above.
These are OR requirements (only one needs to be satisfied)
1. We currently own 75% of the number of cities that we had when the vassalage started (Master didn't protect us)
2. We currently have 300% of the population that we had when vassalage started (we are growing fine without the Master and can pursue our own interests)
3. We currently own 60% of the number of cities our Master owns AND 60% of the population our Master has (the Master isn't overwhelming stronger than us).
These are OR requirements (only one needs to be satisfied)
1. We currently own 75% of the number of cities that we had when the vassalage started (Master didn't protect us)
2. We currently have 300% of the population that we had when vassalage started (we are growing fine without the Master and can pursue our own interests)
3. We currently own 60% of the number of cities our Master owns AND 60% of the population our Master has (the Master isn't overwhelming stronger than us).
sjefferson23
Chieftain
I've only been playing using the community patch for the last couple of days (I don't know how I lived without it!) so apologies if I've simply missed information somewhere but is there any way to disown states you've made you vassal? In my current game I have 3 vassals and just wondered whether I will have to wait for them to request independence.
It would be nice to see vassals share some of their resources with their master too or levy troops that require a resource and they supply the resource, i.e. they supply a swordsman and the 1 iron required is taken from their resources.
Excited by the prospect of that vassal overview screen.
It would be nice to see vassals share some of their resources with their master too or levy troops that require a resource and they supply the resource, i.e. they supply a swordsman and the 1 iron required is taken from their resources.
Excited by the prospect of that vassal overview screen.
I've only been playing using the community patch for the last couple of days (I don't know how I lived without it!) so apologies if I've simply missed information somewhere but is there any way to disown states you've made you vassal? In my current game I have 3 vassals and just wondered whether I will have to wait for them to request independence.
It would be nice to see vassals share some of their resources with their master too or levy troops that require a resource and they supply the resource, i.e. they supply a swordsman and the 1 iron required is taken from their resources.
Excited by the prospect of that vassal overview screen.
What a great point. Masters should be able to grant independence to a vassal whenever they want. I'll add that to the "Management" screen. You will be able to liberate after 25 (50?) turns of Vassalage.
sjefferson23
Chieftain
Perhaps a civ that has capitulated requires more turns and one that has voluntarily placed itself in vassalage for its master to disown it? But that might be overthinking it.
Nah, I think of it like this: 50 turns to force a commitment by the Master to honor the vassalage, and not abuse it for a cheap diplomatic boost (because liberation will grant you a large diplomatic modifier with the civ you liberated). I'm trying to make it as not abusable as possible.
While you're working on diplo stuff, take a look at the code I wrote for requesting liberation via trade as well. It may need adjusting based on what you're working on.
While you're working on diplo stuff, take a look at the code I wrote for requesting liberation via trade as well. It may need adjusting based on what you're working on.
I checked it out, the CvDealAI::GetRevokeVassalageValue() stuff right?
Yeah, and also the Diplo event that makes the AI ask other players to do it (it has some code tied to it). I just figured it should all be standardized based on your new modeling.
Also, that Lua window is nice. I wish I didn't suck at Lua.
I might have to ask you to look at my monopoly and corporation window.G
Yeah, and also the Diplo event that makes the AI ask other players to do it (it has some code tied to it). I just figured it should all be standardized based on your new modeling.
Also, that Lua window is nice. I wish I didn't suck at Lua.
G
Noooooo I hate Lua UI. At lot of it is Firaxis copy-paste and FireTuner editing until I get things the way I deem acceptable.
But since you like it so much, here's another pic
Things I want to include in Vassal Overview:
- Current tech research c5science: Completed /
Required) -
Ideology -
Tourism -
Net Happiness (or 
) -
GPT - Culture
AI behavior ideas:
- AIs that like you and are doing well monetarily will tax you at negative rates (master loses money)
- AIs that are doing badly monetarily will tax you regardless
- AIs will consider vassals they like more when determining to give free gifts (like techs)
- AIs that hate their vassals will tax them at higher rates
- AIs that REALLY like you may consider you for vassal liberation, if they don't consider you a huge threat.
No, it was always intended that military power is the means to enforce your revolution but the actual ability to do is determined by your growth / failure for your master to fulfill their end of the bargain.
What do you mean by "negative behavior"?
Ok, so if they are not happy, they should revolt against their master.
I mean those behaviour ideas that you mentioned above, for example. Taking a vassal should have counterpart benefits if the conditions are met.
The first idea seems to be a bit contradictory. You need to take care of the vassals, but when they do well, you lose money?
That behavior is already implemented.
But it will receive a "sanity check".No, the idea is the Master can choose to tax their vassals or support them (I'm floating the idea that you commit these changes every 20 or so turns). Masters that like their vassals can choose to support them for a diplomatic boost, but I was trying to say the AI shouldn't consider this unless they are well off monetarily (AIs with negative GPT should not be giving money away).
It is completely optional to support your vassals, but doing so may prevent them from revolting (I'm gonna experiment with a Vassal "happiness" which will replace the current system for determining when to revolt.
Noooooo I hate Lua UI. At lot of it is Firaxis copy-paste and FireTuner editing until I get things the way I deem acceptable.
But since you like it so much, here's another pic
Things I want to include in Vassal Overview:
- Current tech research
AI behavior ideas:
- AIs that like you and are doing well monetarily will tax you at negative rates (master loses money)
- AIs that are doing badly monetarily will tax you regardless
- AIs will consider vassals they like more when determining to give free gifts (like techs)
- AIs that hate their vassals will tax them at higher rates
- AIs that REALLY like you may consider you for vassal liberation, if they don't consider you a huge threat.
i Like this a lot!! thank u Putmalk (and Gazebo)
waiting to try this!!
VampireSeraphin
Chieftain
- Joined
- Nov 19, 2015
- Messages
- 69
Noooooo I hate Lua UI. At lot of it is Firaxis copy-paste and FireTuner editing until I get things the way I deem acceptable.
But since you like it so much, here's another pic
Things I want to include in Vassal Overview:
- Current tech research
AI behavior ideas:
- AIs that like you and are doing well monetarily will tax you at negative rates (master loses money)
- AIs that are doing badly monetarily will tax you regardless
- AIs will consider vassals they like more when determining to give free gifts (like techs)
- AIs that hate their vassals will tax them at higher rates
- AIs that REALLY like you may consider you for vassal liberation, if they don't consider you a huge threat.
Are these values going to be the amounts of culture/faith/etc... contributed to the master? Or the total production of the vassal?
Crimson13
Prince
- Joined
- Jul 11, 2012
- Messages
- 373
Speaking of negative behavior, how about the ability to take artifacts/relics/art/all that jazz from vassal-ed civs? I imagine that the civ in question wouldn't like the master to do so barring possible exceptions? Like if a war happened and the civ in question had art in a city that seemed like it would be attacked or is being attacked maybe the civ would ask their master to keep it safe?
It does feel slightly OP which is why I'm a little hesitant about it...
It does feel slightly OP which is why I'm a little hesitant about it...
Would it be possible to force vassals to convert religion and ideology of the master? If so, religion conversion can work like tax system, you would have, say four tiers from no pressure to heavy, but at the cost of increasing unhappiness. And ideological conversion can automatically happen upon capitulation, or sth like 10 turns after that, still costing unhappiness -and maybe spawn rebels to make it harder? All that would be modified by policies/tenets, deepen the religion&ideology system quite a bit. I'm sure it's way harder than it looks like though
Those are just their personal yields so you can see how they're doing.
Don't know if I'm gonna consider going that route. I think it would be extremely difficult to make an interface for that, and that is too out of scope for my ideas. Thanks for brainstorming though!
