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What do you miss the most from previous versions of Civ?

Discussion in 'Civ6 - General Discussions' started by Snarf054, Jul 4, 2019.

  1. Chefofrats

    Chefofrats Chieftain

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    The only things I really miss are not related to the gameplay itself.

    The first is the Replay feature after a game ends. It felt epic to see how my empire grew over millenia. The timeline introduced in RF does not really make up for the lack of a proper, map-based replay.

    The other is the city view, bringing a more human dimension to an empire-building game.

    One thing I do not miss at all and would hate to see in the game again - the ridiculous stacks of doom so many people around here seem to love. It was just such a primitive and cheesy way of waging war, reducing it to what was basicly a zerg or a schwartz-size contest:
     
  2. Tarry

    Tarry Chieftain

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    National Wonders

    The End of Game Replay Map showing how things grew.
     
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  3. rockhpi

    rockhpi Chieftain

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    +1 for the end of game replay map that let you see how civs expanded and fell.
     
  4. Lord Lakely

    Lord Lakely Unintentionally a feminist.

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    Yeah the replay is the only thing that comes to mind. I also miss the cottage => hamlet => town => village tile improvement. I really like the idea of improvements and buildings that get better over time by being worked, not through technological advancements.
     
  5. KayAU

    KayAU Chieftain

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    I don't miss the stacks of doom either. I tend to prefer more tactical battles. While Civs 5 and 6 have moved in that direction, there are other games which have done it in ways which I find more enjoyable. An early example is Conquest of the New World. The system was too simple for something on the scale of Civilization, but it did capture some tactical concepts (flanking, charging, leader and unit experience, combined arms) in a way I found enjoyable. Other examples of more advanced systems are Fallen Enchantress and Age of Wonders 3, which are a lot of fun. I guess you could argue against tactical battle systems which take you out of the world map, but I think it is worth it for the added gameplay. I also think it could be implemented in a seamless way, where the camera would zoom in on the contested tile, and subdivide the grid to make a battle map. Of course, there would also be an autoresolve button, and an option to always autoresolve.

    EDIT: Speaking of Age of Wonders 3, I just noticed that it is free on Steam right now. If you don't already have it, I highly recommend it. It is pretty amazing.
     
    Last edited: Jul 11, 2019
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  6. Morningcalm

    Morningcalm Keeper of Records

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    I miss the diplomacy from Civ IV, which made more sense and didn’t feature crazy or ridiculous AI moves, I also miss the building and religion sounds from Civ IV, the Rock and Roll wonder movie, the quotes from Civ IV and Civ V, the quotes in Civ V upon getting into a new era, the Civ V war music, the Civ V music explanations from the composer on his website, the Civ V leader backgrounds, the Civ V leader interactions not being cutscenes but real time animation with real time reactions and statements, the unique city-state music from Civ V, the differing menus of Civ IV and Civ V expansions, the Civ IV scenarios, the Civ IV cottages that improved gold yield in a sort of “level up” system (which made their being looted really devastating). I miss the Civilopedia being accessible from the main menu screen.

    I could go on but that’ll do for now. In my view, Civ VI has strong ideas but skimped on execution, especially in its visual design being inconsistent—blue plastic UI and toy-like unit icons do not mix well with the more dignified and cool parchment map exploration effect.
     
    Last edited: Jul 11, 2019
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  7. Moxx

    Moxx Chieftain

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    The replay feature was a huge disappointment to not be included. I don't know about anyone else but a standard speed game will usually take me like 4-6 hours spread over 2-4 sessions so seeing the whole game replayed was such a nice feature in prior versions. Plus you get to see what the AIs did during the parts of the game when you didn't have visibility on them.

    I miss some of the tile improvements from prior games to add some diversity to worker improvements on regular tiles. I feel the 3 options ( Mine + Farm + Lumber Mill ) get old quick. Could use Workshops , Cottages , etc to add ways to increase other yields on tiles with no special resources. The unique Improvements were a great addition though.
     
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  8. RohirrimElf

    RohirrimElf Chieftain

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    The AI being a challenge. (Getting beaten on emperor difficulty)

    Also i prefer stacks of doom to one unit per tile, until the AI can handle it.
     
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  9. MonkeyPaw

    MonkeyPaw Chieftain

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    Demographics!
     
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  10. WillowBrook

    WillowBrook Lurker

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    I forgot to mention the demographics and top cities screens, and lists of richest, largest, most advanced, etc. Although you can figure out most of the latter, but the flavor is nice.
     
  11. ChocolateShake

    ChocolateShake Chieftain

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    Those were great, I would look forward to seeing those lists. I'm wondering if they could be modded in.

    I miss wonder movies, and the power and theme of wonders in general. I think they should try and make the wonder movies we have now more like the gifs they had on twitter. Quotes are nice, but I think adding more information would really enrich wonder-building and make it feel more rewarding. I'd love to learn more about the wonders in the game, of course the civilopedia is there but I think it's better for quick facts and historical flavor to be brought back into the open.
     
  12. Kaan Boztepe

    Kaan Boztepe Chieftain

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    outposts , single tile improvements outside your terratory for resources that would need to be defended
    tile improvements getting better by being used and not by technology automatically ( still technoılogy should be required but also the fact that it was used for at least some turns before it is automatically upgraded )
    more zoom out options for the main screen
    replay at the end was such a nice feature
    i also liked the throneroom , made me have a sense of accomplishment
    demographics and the historians informing me on the status in the world
    AI was never good , it was always giving the AI free stuff to make up for it. This time they do it only at the start that is why everyone thinks that AI is worse. They should consider giving AI more stuff during the lifetime of the game at various intervals at deity difficulty at least
    that maintenance cost of buildings and units was actually important
    sea routes being more important
    national wonders were really good, would also make players start to think more strategically. not just simply build more cities always and forever

    Also since it is mentioned so often in this thread never ever again stacks of doom please for the love of god and everything that is holy
     
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  13. Casualty of war

    Casualty of war Chieftain

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    You can "stack." Corps and Armies, Fleets and Armadas. Anything deeper is highly abusable. I know, I did.

    The end of game replay map is only entertaining if you're playing Domination or Wide, and Civ 6 does not promote Wide.

    I miss We Love the King Day. Who doesn't love being loved?
     
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  14. Gedemon

    Gedemon Modder Moderator

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    I suppose that part was based on the reddit post from a developer recently quoted here, but IIRC civ4 used the same difficulty mechanism as civ5-6.

    the code source is available for 4 and 5, if one want to compare.

    IMO what's "highly abusable" by a human vs the AI is the combination of 1UPT and 2 tiles fire range.

    the production advantage at higher difficulty level is kind of nullified by the impossibility for the AI to concentrate more troops than the human in the same area, and ranged units give the coup de grâce to prevent AI units to suffer for too long.

    Yet I don't miss the civ4' Stacks of Doom, it's just that 1 combat unit per tile is worst for the current AI (and for moving around your own units)

    now, it could be made better at handling the current mechanism, with development time, but if they can't afford it, they really should start to think on how to change the rules instead.

    ho, BTW, you all know that we can't mod the AI to be better at tactical level ATM, but the funny thing is that civ6 is so hardcoded for 1UPT that we can't even mod in stacks, or, to be more accurate we can with a bit of UI modding, but the real joke is that when you mod this only the human player can use stacks, and, then, yes, "highly abusable" become an understatement !
     
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  15. acluewithout

    acluewithout Warlord

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    I suspect this is a big part of the problem. I’m also not sure the AI is really able to handle stacking support type units either, eg rams and great generals.

    1upt is not going anywhere. Too many people - me included - prefer it because it feels more tactical and at the same time less gamey. Personally, I would be extremely reluctant to buy a version of Civ that went back to stacks of doom[0].

    But I think maybe one day FXS need to think about the mix of units and the whole RPS thing. I don’t have any real suggestions[1] - it’s all castles in the air, really - but I’m not sure there should be a distinction between Melee (guys with clubs) and AC (guys with pointy sticks), I’m not sure there should really be “ranged” units, and I’m not sure Seige tactics, Military leadership and supply lines / logistics are best represented by having additional units.

    I think simplifying unit types (less unit types, but maybe more control over how you specialise them or Military strategy generally)[1][2] and getting rid of two tile ranged attacks would massively help the AI and let it be more competitive while keeping 1upt.

    [0] It’s basically the only thing that’s stopped me getting into Civ IV.

    [1] Although, as Victoria pointed out to me, maybe getting rid of RPS could make combat much more grinding and static.

    [2] Has anyone noticed how FXS has played around with Policy Cards providing a Strategic Layer to the game, but it doesn’t seem to really click? Like, you get the whole Oligarchy bonus which is this cool way to buff Melee and AC v other unit types, but can be a bit of a faff to get. There’s the logistics card (totes amazballs). Then what? Well, extra scout experience (I starting using it more after I saw Carl use it in a game - it’s quite lame though, because all my scouts die or I just explore with great admirals), extra wall defence (I think I’ve used that once, and it didn’t help much because I was already screwed), extra gold for raiding (awesome, but abusive), that one dark age combat bonus card (very powerful on defence and incredible with Cav). What else? Umm. I guess loyalty from garrisoned units? That can be handy during conquest, but that’s more about managing your economy. Same as the unit maintenance card.
     
  16. Virdrago

    Virdrago Wandering

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    Being able to change your civ and leader's name. Maybe today I feel like playing as the Songhai, Iroquois, Maya or Assyria...
     
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  17. Abaxial

    Abaxial Chieftain

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    It has yet to work for me.
     
  18. Lord Lakely

    Lord Lakely Unintentionally a feminist.

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    Culture bombing only works on tiles within workable range of your city. It doesn't apply to tiles that are 4 hexes or further away from the city centre.
     
  19. Abaxial

    Abaxial Chieftain

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    That will be it then. In Civ V this was not the case.
     
  20. Duuk

    Duuk Doom-Sayer Supporter

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    Basically, the argument between 1UPT and Stacks of Doom is "Can the AI handle 1UPT" and the answer is a resounding "No". The AI cannot handle creating a good mix of units, strategically moving and coordinating them to the battle front, which may require shifting them around each other through a "carpet of doom", adjusting their RPS mix, getting the right ones in the right place, etc.

    The AI cannot handle playing Panzer General Civ, so the game is better suited to a system where units can be bulk stacked in some manner. Which is why I keep bringing up the CTP2 army system that allowed 12 units (of any tiype) to be formed into a single cohesive army, they moved and attacked as a single unit, and used their unit types (siege, flanker, ranged, melee, special) for effect. It worked like a charm.
     
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