What is the US up to with regard to Iran?

[Hrothbern]

In the good old days, when I was young, internet and modern drones
uninvented, there were radio controlled model aircraft and shotguns.

Occasionally a model aircraft enthusiast club would have
a, dubiously legal/illegal, contest with a grouse shooting club.

The model aircraft would be sent up, sometimes, with ink or
paint loads, and the shooters would try to shoot them down.

What happened was that if the model aeroplanes were too high,
they were out of range of the pellets, but couldn't bomb the shooters.
If they came down too low, they were generally shot down.

Perhaps shooting down drones should be an Olympic sport.

 

[Commodore]

The US government? Because they never lie?

I'll take our GPS data over their hand-drawn maps any day of the week. Just because you don't like Trump doesn't change the fact that when compared to a regime like Iran, the US is a shining beacon of truth and trustworthiness.

 

[red_elk]

 

[hobbsyoyo]

https://abcnews.go.com/Politics/pre...3853570&cid=clicksource_4380645_null_hero_hed

Apparently Trump ordered a strike on Iran recently on the advice of Pompeo and Bolton but his instincts pulled him back at the last minute.

I wonder if this is more fake news like and posturing like when Bolton showed off a note that said '10,000 troops to Colombia'. My gut reaction on hearing this was that Bolton thought he'd be cheeky and leak a fake story like this to stir the pot. Because that's how our diplomacy functions at this point in time - all we do is stir the pot for the sake of stirring.

I'll take our GPS data over their hand-drawn maps any day of the week. Just because you don't like Trump doesn't change the fact that when compared to a regime like Iran, the US is a shining beacon of truth and trustworthiness.

Just because I disbelieve the US government doesn't mean I believe the Iranians.

 

[TheMeInTeam]

The GPS data provided by inherently honest regime!

With a long history of proven honesty about such attacks on its track record, no less!

I also don't believe the Iranian government, because they're not exactly paladins going around saving people themselves. What to do when two nations with such histories point fingers at each other?

 

[Hrothbern]

With a long history of proven honesty about such attacks on its track record, no less!

I also don't believe the Iranian government, because they're not exactly paladins going around saving people themselves. What to do when two nations with such histories point fingers at each other?

Watch
and hope that it does not cause death, destruction and people driven away from their little piece of peace, their homes.

 

[uppi]

I'll take our GPS data over their hand-drawn maps any day of the week. Just because you don't like Trump doesn't change the fact that when compared to a regime like Iran, the US is a shining beacon of truth and trustworthiness.

Right...
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Unite..._and_the_Iraq_War#Colin_Powell's_presentation

 

[Hrothbern]

Let's not forget in this situation that one of the objectives of Trump is to disconnect the EU from Iran.

 

[Socrates99]

Let's not forget in this situation that one of the objectives of Trump is to disconnect the EU from Iran.

Trump's objective is to just undermine the legacy of Obama. I've pretty much made it clear how little I think of Obama but normalizing relations with longtime enemies like Iran and Cuba were some of the best things Obama did.

Trump himself has fairly well exhibited his disinterest in a hot war with Iran in his statements about the drone being shot down. He likes making bellicose and aggressive rhetoric but I don't think he really wants to be George Bush number 3.

 

[Hrothbern]

Trump's objective is to just undermine the legacy of Obama. I've pretty much made it clear how little I think of Obama but normalizing relations with longtime enemies like Iran and Cuba were some of the best things Obama did.

Trump himself has fairly well exhibited his disinterest in a hot war with Iran in his statements about the drone being shot down. He likes making bellicose and aggressive rhetoric but I don't think he really wants to be George Bush number 3.

Just as Trump does not like anything from Obama, he does not like anything from continental Europe.
And yes... Obama is closer at his chest for personal and domestic political reasons. But a EU helping the economy of Iran is still a nuisance for him.

If the Iranians get so escalated that Iran loses the political and from there economical support of the EU, he has a double win.
To "help" Iran making "mistakes" he does not need a full war.

EDIT
oh... on that location of that drone... it will be interesting to see where in the sea the debris of that drone are dragged up.
In territorial waters or not.

 

[Kyriakos]

Drones are scary.
At some point I'd like to research if any have been used in actual individual (non-army) violent crime.

I generally view them as flying miniature Ed209s.

 

[uppi]

EDIT
oh... on that location of that drone... it will be interesting to see where in the sea the debris of that drone are dragged up.
In territorial waters or not.

And how are you going to know the true position of that debris? Any debris Iran will recover will obviously be found in their territorial waters and any debris the US will recover will obviously be found in international waters. No matter the position of the debris or whether it was actually part of the drone in the first place.

 

[Hrothbern]

And how are you going to know the true position of that debris? Any debris Iran will recover will obviously be found in their territorial waters and any debris the US will recover will obviously be found in international waters. No matter the position of the debris or whether it was actually part of the drone in the first place.

yes,
I used the word interesting

You would expect that with such an spy-drone, there is a lot of super secret stuff on board, that the US does not want to fall into the hands of Iran.
From there:
If most of the debris is in international waters, the US will like to recover it and in those international waters be able to recover it.
If most of the debris is in territorial waters, the US will only be able to recover it at risk of further escalations from trespassing the border.

So although debris shown by Iran does not tell us much... in case the US is not able to produce debris... that does tell us something.
Hard evidence ?
No
And the US can always say they were not interested in recovering debris of their super secret drone.

 

[Broken_Erika]

Meanwhile ocean currents will scatter debris far from where it was shot down.

 

[Hrothbern]

Meanwhile ocean currents will scatter debris far from where it was shot down.

Yes
Those sea current maps will already have been put on some desks. Currents parallel to the shoreline ? Could be, IDK.
The sea is not very deep there in the strait, somewhere 50-150 meter.

here some maps I found on the incident:
The strait is roughly 50 kilometer wide (East-West) at the location shown (is 50/1.85= 27 nautical miles wide). Territorial waters start at 12 nautical miles from the coast

 

[Berzerker]

that might have been near the coastline during the ice age

and the Garden of Eden

 

[Kyriakos]

that might have been near the coastline during the ice age

and the Garden of Eden

It doesn't have to be "near" the coastline to be within territorial waters. Usually those extend to (at least) 12 nautical miles.

 

[Estebonrober]

Good people on both sides amiright?

 

[innonimatu]

But a EU helping the economy of Iran is still a nuisance for him.

If the Iranians get so escalated that Iran loses the political and from there economical support of the EU, he has a double win.
To "help" Iran making "mistakes" he does not need a full war.

But the EU is not giving any economic support to Iran, and precious little political.

 

[Zkribbler]

... compared to a regime like Iran, the US is a shining beacon of truth and trustworthiness.

Wasn't the US just touting it's pictures of the limpet mines used supposedly used to attack the tanker? Then the tanker's owner pointed out that (a) limpet mines are attached below the water line and the damage was above the water line, and (b) his crew reported seeing projectiles flying at the tanker.

The Trump administration lies about everything.