Whats left?
- Thread starter SunTzu
- Start date
Seems Osama and co had gone underground into caves and other underground bases. The bombs were being used to destroy those underground shelters.
Graeme the mad
Certified Maniac
The caspian sea
starlifter
Deity
- Joined
- Jun 17, 2001
- Messages
- 4,210
The probable course of action is to continue the attacks and airspace control, and if nothing changes of significance by next spring, begin an general ground occupation on a wide scale and physically root out not only the bin Laden people, but the Taliban. The oncoming winter is a consideration in a general ground assault. 
Logical but will the American people be able to stomach that? A ground occupation like that will likely produce a lot of American casualties. Also will the neighbouring Muslim countries (Uzbekistan, Pakistan etc) allow American ground forces to pass thru on their way to Afghanistan? 
Simon Darkshade
Mysterious City of Gold
Wait! This news just in: They've spotted a camel, and a couple of Tali-vans on the road, doing a grocery run for Mullah Omar 
Dogberry_Old
****** of the Pack
Logistics & regional politics are the most important things in any ground assault .. be it "all-out" or otherwise.
As things are going now, the political clock does not favor the good-guys. The Bush/ Blair team & the military need to make some very fundamental decsions & they need to make them quickly. The idea that a long-drawn out air-campaign in that neck-of-the-woods .. with the inevitable civilian casualties, useful for Taliban propaganda, the already prefigured "pauses" ( Ramadan & god knows what else ) ... which will give the enemy time to regroup, count noses & communicate .... make this idea a real loser. Meanwhile tens of thousands of Afganis starve in the countryside...another great deal for the Coalition.
It is all very easy to talk "war & sacrifice" to the cameras.. but taking real as opposed to imaginary risks is entirely another. I am deathly afraid that the normal Washingtonian Spin/ Hot Air / Bull**** cycle is settling in, in some quarters.
In my view we ( us..the US ! ) needs to take Kabul & we need to do it soon...and then clear a Kabul-Khyber Pass- Jalalabad corridor for humanitian relief .. and just maybe some supplies for our troops. Then we will be holding
at least one political trump card.. the King can call his Jirga & hopefully the political situation can better itself. Risky ? ... yes indeed, but better than a steadily deteriorating regional political situation that might have our hands tied by spring.. if not worse.
Dog
As things are going now, the political clock does not favor the good-guys. The Bush/ Blair team & the military need to make some very fundamental decsions & they need to make them quickly. The idea that a long-drawn out air-campaign in that neck-of-the-woods .. with the inevitable civilian casualties, useful for Taliban propaganda, the already prefigured "pauses" ( Ramadan & god knows what else ) ... which will give the enemy time to regroup, count noses & communicate .... make this idea a real loser. Meanwhile tens of thousands of Afganis starve in the countryside...another great deal for the Coalition.
It is all very easy to talk "war & sacrifice" to the cameras.. but taking real as opposed to imaginary risks is entirely another. I am deathly afraid that the normal Washingtonian Spin/ Hot Air / Bull**** cycle is settling in, in some quarters.
In my view we ( us..the US ! ) needs to take Kabul & we need to do it soon...and then clear a Kabul-Khyber Pass- Jalalabad corridor for humanitian relief .. and just maybe some supplies for our troops. Then we will be holding
at least one political trump card.. the King can call his Jirga & hopefully the political situation can better itself. Risky ? ... yes indeed, but better than a steadily deteriorating regional political situation that might have our hands tied by spring.. if not worse.
Dog
Cunobelin Of Hippo
Site Pachyderm
As Starlifter said, fighting on the ground in winter-bound Afghanistan is probably not an ideal situation. I suspect they'll maintain constant satellite monitoring to watch up for any military buildup, but other then that, will probably just keep hitting terrorist camps/taliban troop camps.
And those damn camel brigades.
Something must be done
And those damn camel brigades.
Something must be done 
Any of you smart guys know the story behind this nifty liitle bit igenuity? How it went from did not exist even on paper at the start of desert sheild to in inventory at the start of desert storm? A shorter time then the manufacturing process usually take for the type of case hardened stell use for armor pernetrating bombs.
joespaniel
Unescorted Settler
I don't know for sure, but Saddam's German built super-bunker HQ was probably the inspiration for that nice bomb.
:rocket:
:rocket:Huitzilopochtli
Chieftain
50000 pound bombs?
is that supposed only to hit military facilites?
How can you surgically sort out terrorist from a land mine crippled kid with cruise missiles?,,,
I heard that the so-called "smart bombs" really have a hard time distinguishing between military barrack and a civilian hospital.
It's so easy to be behind our screens discussing death like it was so much a computer game,, an elaborate media display that pops up in our tv and pc screens like it was some hollywood super heroe movie. The western "goodies" vs the arab "baddies"...
For us on this side (this side understood as anyone very far from the battlefield) it is nothing but hearsay and speculation.. For many arabs it's been facing a much grimer, deadlier reallity..
What happened on novemeber 11 brought "reallity" to US shores. Just what the rest of the world had been living for a long time, but condensed in 1 hour.....
And some of that horrible worldwide "reallity" (a lot of it actually) sponsored by the US.
Life has skin
Pablo Neruda
is that supposed only to hit military facilites?
How can you surgically sort out terrorist from a land mine crippled kid with cruise missiles?,,,
I heard that the so-called "smart bombs" really have a hard time distinguishing between military barrack and a civilian hospital.
It's so easy to be behind our screens discussing death like it was so much a computer game,, an elaborate media display that pops up in our tv and pc screens like it was some hollywood super heroe movie. The western "goodies" vs the arab "baddies"...
For us on this side (this side understood as anyone very far from the battlefield) it is nothing but hearsay and speculation.. For many arabs it's been facing a much grimer, deadlier reallity..
What happened on novemeber 11 brought "reallity" to US shores. Just what the rest of the world had been living for a long time, but condensed in 1 hour.....
And some of that horrible worldwide "reallity" (a lot of it actually) sponsored by the US.
Life has skin
Pablo Neruda
joespaniel
Unescorted Settler
The GBU-28 is a long skinny low drag armor piercing bomb. It did not exist at the start of desert sheild. The casing from AP bomb are not made overning, it ready fro production the pysical process for making case hardened steel take months. (the main armor plates for the Iowa class battleships spent around 2 years in 1000degree plus ovens with carbon baking into their faces) . And there was not even a factory existing to make the long casings. AAP and balistic caps were in stock and being produced, but the largets AP casing was IIRC for a 1600lb bomb. Where do you instantly get lots of long case hardened tubes in a diameter to match one of you existing AP caps. Well, the army had just retired dozens of 6" artilery pieces. load them up with bang. Fix the AP and ballistic caps to the front, fit the detonater and a guidance module to the back, and voila! A low drag trans-sonic AP bunker buster deployed in 5 months instead of 3 years.
joespaniel
Unescorted Settler
I did not know that. Gee, this forum is so informative and educational!
Good story, Lefty.
Do they now custom make them, or still 'recycle' artillery tubes?
Good story, Lefty.
Do they now custom make them, or still 'recycle' artillery tubes?
Smart Bombs don't distinguish between what targets are, like military facilities and civilian facilities. they are guided by the pilot of the plane or by IR or Laser. You don't tell the bomb to go find an AAA site, and it doesn't go there by itself. You lock onto the target using IR, Laser or ?Rader? <---i believe thats a type of guidance in use...
Ashoka
Reluctant Warrior
Ah.. but now the US is using AC130s...
Not as good as the A-10 "Warthog"... but almost a scary. As this seems to have become a battle of propaganda and intimidation (no surprise there - terrorists favoring those tactics) I think the Coallition forces are going to have to up the ante with the military intimidation. Less killing, more scaring the sh*t out of Taliban and supporters.
Ashoka
Not as good as the A-10 "Warthog"... but almost a scary. As this seems to have become a battle of propaganda and intimidation (no surprise there - terrorists favoring those tactics) I think the Coallition forces are going to have to up the ante with the military intimidation. Less killing, more scaring the sh*t out of Taliban and supporters.
Ashoka
Huitzilopochtli
Chieftain
I see, so a fighter pilot sorts out between a bunker and a hospital.. I wonder what happens if the bunker is actually next to a civilian facility, will the bomb only burn down the bunker?
Your description of how a "smart bomb" works out seems complete. But then I guess the explanation rules out such precsion when using cruise missiles.. What can be said about their "selective" desctructivness (I would appreciate answers since im far from being a military buff).
When i said reallity I mean't something like this:
http://members.aol.com/bblum6/American_holocaust.htm
This is not an arab site, so I guess you wont be calling it a terrorist site joe.
Do enter at your own risk, doing so opens up an FBI file on you.
Machoc mictlampa
y quihualittozque
ymihiyo, yntlatol in tepilhuan?
Perhaps in the region of the dead
would there be proffesed
the breath and words of princess?
Chichicuepon of Chalco
Your description of how a "smart bomb" works out seems complete. But then I guess the explanation rules out such precsion when using cruise missiles.. What can be said about their "selective" desctructivness (I would appreciate answers since im far from being a military buff).
When i said reallity I mean't something like this:
http://members.aol.com/bblum6/American_holocaust.htm
This is not an arab site, so I guess you wont be calling it a terrorist site joe.
Do enter at your own risk, doing so opens up an FBI file on you.
Machoc mictlampa
y quihualittozque
ymihiyo, yntlatol in tepilhuan?
Perhaps in the region of the dead
would there be proffesed
the breath and words of princess?
Chichicuepon of Chalco
I expect they are still recycling, ther were hundreds of 6" tubes available, and only dozens of bunker busters have been dropped.
Dogberry_Old
****** of the Pack
give us a phonetic pronunciation of your name ? It's Aztec ? Was it one of the Aztec Gods ? Go ahead & spout off about it a little... & anything else along those lines that you might want to add. I would not mind being educated a little about these things.
Dog
Dog
joespaniel
Unescorted Settler
I never said all arabs are terrorists, nor all terrorists arab.
