When Genocide is Permissible


I had not heard of him, but it does not surprise me that he was a white supremacist. Most conservatives are very pro-Israel, and white supremacists are the only subgroup who don't, AFAIK.

It should go without saying that I don't associate with white supremacists, although I've never met one that I know of anyway.

Looks like ISIS is gearing up to massacre 40,000 Yazidis in Iraq.

Got em pinned down on Mount Sinjar with people dying of thirst now.
http://www.theguardian.com/world/2014/aug/06/40000-iraqis-stranded-mountain-isis-death-threat

Appalling.
 
Looks like ISIS is gearing up to massacre 40,000 Yazidis in Iraq.

Got em pinned down on Mount Sinjar with people dying of thirst now.
http://www.theguardian.com/world/2014/aug/06/40000-iraqis-stranded-mountain-isis-death-threat

This is positively pathetic. A small organization scares off the much larger Iraqi army, kills thousands of people, prepares to kill tens of thousands, and even seizes oil supplies, and the Iraqi government, the Kurds, the Turks, the US, and everyone else is unable or unwilling to do anything about it. It's simply breathtaking what they can get away with. It's like nobody is even trying to stop them. It's Sierra Leone-scale criminal incompetence.
 
This is positively pathetic. A small organization scares off the much larger Iraqi army, kills thousands of people, prepares to kill tens of thousands, and even seizes oil supplies, and the Iraqi government, the Kurds, the Turks, the US, and everyone else is unable or unwilling to do anything about it. It's simply breathtaking what they can get away with. It's like nobody is even trying to stop them. It's Sierra Leone-scale criminal incompetence.

Eh, you can be sure the Turkish gov would LOVE to 'do something about (the oil-fields) it', so it has to be assumed the power-play now is actively stopping them, else the tanks would be in Iraq since last month.

Another reason to assume that this 'Isis' is a facade of more serious players in the region, and likely the US -gov or other interests- in the end (i don't really see the Saudis doing something like this on their own).
 
So you not only defend attacks on civilians, but also refuse to put any responsibility on those actually dropping the bombs. This doesn't make your position appear any better.
So Israel has to sit back and allow rockets to be fired at will against them. Why didn't I think of that? I would hate to live under your rule because it means that you are not going to do the very best to defend your own citizens because it also means doing your best to eliminate threats. The fact of the matter is that no country on the planet has done as much as possible to protect civilian lives as Israel and ignorant people like you can simply complain from your safe position and accuse Israel when you don't have no clue about the situation. If you are fired upon you are allowed to respond to the threat. If you aren't able to respond to the enemy whenever they attack you then you might as well just surrender.

BTW do you consider President Obama a war criminal?
 
[...] The fact of the matter is that no country on the planet has done as much as possible to protect civilian lives as Israel [...]

All other countries killed upwards of 1000 civilians last month :yup:

Or is it that they were trying, so if they were not trying they would have killed tens of thousands in a single month? How good of them.
 
How many countries are being attacked? All of them of course. Wait. You have no clue what you are talking about. You know the context is in a fighting situation.

Why kill 10.000
when we can kill
1000?

2517237-9812730190-drEvi.gif
 
Is President Obama a war criminal?

What does that have to do with anything? Neither of us are even American. Please stop trying to deflect attention from your support for killing civilians, and denying the responsibility of those dropping the bombs.

I do love arm chair critics who think they know everything about war especially urban warfare.

We are lucky to have an expert like you with us then. :D Now, I think I will try to protect your civilian life. I believe the first step is to drop a big bomb on your head, no?
 
This is positively pathetic. A small organization scares off the much larger Iraqi army, kills thousands of people, prepares to kill tens of thousands, and even seizes oil supplies, and the Iraqi government, the Kurds, the Turks, the US, and everyone else is unable or unwilling to do anything about it. It's simply breathtaking what they can get away with. It's like nobody is even trying to stop them. It's Sierra Leone-scale criminal incompetence.

The problem is that people are too preoccupied with the usual 'Boo-you know' refrain to really care about ISIS.
 
The problem is that people are too preoccupied with the usual 'Boo-you know' refrain to really care about ISIS.

I think people in the west don't want to hear about Iraq, because they heard enough about it following the invasion and the the years after that, not because of Palestine.
 
Do you know that he ordered a drone strike that killed 13 people, women and children included? NATO once killed hundreds of civilians in an attack. Based on yours and others there is simply no way for any nation to fight back against enemy forces because when you do civilians will die. I mean the Allies killed 20,000 civilians on D-Day. Are you going to call every one of them a war crime?
 
I think there is a good expression in English for what you are doing. Whataboutery.
 
Do you know that he ordered a drone strike that killed 13 people, women and children included? NATO once killed hundreds of civilians in an attack. Based on yours and others there is simply no way for any nation to fight back against enemy forces because when you do civilians will die. I mean the Allies killed 20,000 civilians on D-Day. Are you going to call every one of them a war crime?

1)13 people are not really on the same level of magnitude number wise as 1000 people.

2)At least refer to a specific nato campaign you have in mind.

3)So Israel's bombing is now analogous to D-Day? 'K...
 
So Israel has to sit back and allow rockets to be fired at will against them. Why didn't I think of that? I would hate to live under your rule because it means that you are not going to do the very best to defend your own citizens because it also means doing your best to eliminate threats. The fact of the matter is that no country on the planet has done as much as possible to protect civilian lives as Israel and ignorant people like you can simply complain from your safe position and accuse Israel when you don't have no clue about the situation. If you are fired upon you are allowed to respond to the threat. If you aren't able to respond to the enemy whenever they attack you then you might as well just surrender.

Why do you resort to binary "all-or-nothing" conclusions? I don't think anyone here is saying that Israel should sit back and do nothing about the threat of rocket fire from Gaza.

That said, consider that the rockets fired from Gaza aren't resulting in hundreds of deaths of Israeli citizens. Partly due to the nature of the rockets themselves, and also Iron Dome. It's been a modest success, intercepting rockets that could have threatened Israeli citizens. That's awesome, and I'm glad the system is working*.

*EDIT: The rest of my post is definitely crossing a grey line, as there is quite a robust debate over the effectiveness of IronDome. I certainly don't know who has the right numbers, but here's sentiment that I find compelling:
Uzi Rubin said:
How can it be that more than 2,200 rockets of all kinds have been fired at Israeli population centers since July 8, but there have been so few casualties? Just one person has been killed by a Grad rocket, and he was hit in an open desert area not protected by Iron Dome.

Postol theorizes that it is Israel’s civil defense system that does the work — that people, warned in time by sirens, take cover and are saved. Yet this does not explain why so few rocket strikes are registered in the large population centers that Iron Dome is designed to protect. Of the hundreds of rockets fired at the city of Ashdod to date, for example, only 12 hit residential areas.
Source: http://blogs.reuters.com/great-debate/2014/08/05/iron-domes-success-in-israel-is-ironclad/


The few rockets that haven't been intercepted were determined to be not worth intercepting as they'd land in unpopulated areas. Sounds like a good cost/benefit calculation to me.

So Israel is routinely intercepting these "threats", neutralizing them, yet still sees the need to accept hundreds and hundreds of innocent civilian casualties in order to eliminate a threat that's already being handled nearly perfectly. That's the immorality here, this is the reason Israel is harming itself more than it's harming Gaza.

If there were no Iron Dome I'd likely agree that the IDF has a moral obligation to the citizens of Israel to prempt a rocket launch, even if that means some innocent bystanders happen to die in the assault. But the way things are now, Israel doesn't need to bomb a hospital, school, or apartment building just because a rocket was launched from the courtyard. Because that rocket will be neutralized before it is able to inflict any (non-monetary) harm on Israel.

Yet they kill the civilians anyway.

That's the problem - Israel's response is entirely disproportionate to the threat. The threat of rockets is very low owing to Iron Dome and the nature of the rockets themselves.
 
Rocket attacks kill fewer Israelis than peanut allergies, but I don't see any calls to bomb Jif factories into oblivion. Funny, that.
 
I think people in the west don't want to hear about Iraq, because they heard enough about it following the invasion and the the years after that, not because of Palestine.

People in 'the west' (US and UK) hate to hear about Iraq because it calls for acknowledging responsibility. As horrible as the Hussein regime might have been, kicking it over has not made things demonstrably better...in fact it's pretty easy to argue that it has made most things worse.
 
OK, cool. Just remember that ad hominem replies don't address the arguments these guys make. So calling someone an anti-Semite is totally irrelevant to the task of debunking his claim.

http://www.theatlantic.com/national...r-apologist-and-holocaust-revisionist/245518/
http://www.tabletmag.com/scroll/32734/john-mearsheimer-has-got-a-little-list
http://www.tabletmag.com/jewish-news-and-politics/40064/mainstreaming-hate

Rocket attacks kill fewer Israelis than peanut allergies, but I don't see any calls to bomb Jif factories into oblivion. Funny, that.

Rocket attacks kill fewer people than peanut allergies while their launching sites are being systematically bombed. Also, peanut allergies don't traumatize millions of people and shut down half of a country. Or plan massacres on Rosh Hashanah.
 
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