Wonder Elimination Thread

[Tabarnak]

Corrected.

Angkor Wat 18
Big Ben 22
Chichen Itza 26
Cristo Redentor 18
Eiffel Tower 20
Himeji Castle 25
Machu Picchu 15
Notre Dame 19
Pentagon 22
Sistine Chapel 21
Statue of Liberty 22
Stonehenge 30
Sydney Opera House 5
Taj Mahal 18
Forbidden Palace 21
Great Library 19
Great Lighthouse 18
Great Wall 10
Hagia Sophia 21
Hanging Gardens 11
Kremlin 16
Louvre 20
Oracle 21
Porcelain Tower 21
Pyramids 29

Himeji Castle is so great compared to Sydney Opera House. From a warmonger player.

 

[drubell]

Angkor Wat 18
Big Ben 22
Chichen Itza 26
Cristo Redentor 18
Eiffel Tower 20
Himeji Castle 25
Machu Picchu 15
Notre Dame 19
Pentagon 22
Sistine Chapel 21
Statue of Liberty 22
Stonehenge 30
Sydney Opera House 5
Taj Mahal 18
Forbidden Palace 21
Great Library 19
Great Lighthouse 18
Great Wall 10
Hagia Sophia 21
Hanging Gardens 9
Kremlin 16
Louvre 20
Oracle 21
Porcelain Tower 21
Pyramids 30

I see how Pyramids can be a better draw than Stonehenge. I rarely build them (at that point I'm putting up my National College and then someone else takes the Pyramids). I don't usually put up more than four cities and rarely go conquest or else Pyramids would be much better than Stonehenge. So I think as a wonder itself, it's versatile for any condition.

Hanging Gardens also has never really impressed me. If I want to grow my city I can let it grow naturally. I've never played a game and thought "man, I really need +1 pop in these cities, maybe I'll build a wonder for it."

 

[madtemplar0]

Angkor Wat 18
Big Ben 22
Chichen Itza 26
Cristo Redentor 18
Eiffel Tower 20
Himeji Castle 25
Machu Picchu 15
Notre Dame 19
Pentagon 22
Sistine Chapel 21
Statue of Liberty 22
Stonehenge 31
Sydney Opera House 5
Taj Mahal 18
Forbidden Palace 21
Great Library 19
Great Lighthouse 18
Great Wall 8
Hagia Sophia 21
Hanging Gardens 9
Kremlin 16
Louvre 20
Oracle 21
Porcelain Tower 21
Pyramids 30

I never use the Great Wall, but Stonehenge is so great.

 

[HarryLime]

Angkor Wat 18
Big Ben 22
Chichen Itza 26
Cristo Redentor 18
Eiffel Tower 20
Himeji Castle 25
Machu Picchu 15
Notre Dame 17
Pentagon 22
Sistine Chapel 21
Statue of Liberty 23
Stonehenge 31
Sydney Opera House 5
Taj Mahal 18
Forbidden Palace 21
Great Library 19
Great Lighthouse 18
Great Wall 8
Hagia Sophia 21
Hanging Gardens 9
Kremlin 16
Louvre 20
Oracle 21
Porcelain Tower 21
Pyramids 30

I can't get over the fact that Notre Dame only gives you the same happiness bonus as a theater. And the SoL is one of the only wonders that gives much needed hammers and can make a late game specialist economy shine.

 

[Save_Ferris]

Angkor Wat 18
Big Ben 22
Chichen Itza 26
Cristo Redentor 18
Eiffel Tower 20
Himeji Castle 25
Machu Picchu 15
Notre Dame 17
Pentagon 22
Sistine Chapel 21
Statue of Liberty 23
Stonehenge 32
Sydney Opera House 5
Taj Mahal 18
Forbidden Palace 21
Great Library 19
Great Lighthouse 18
Great Wall 8
Hagia Sophia 21
Hanging Gardens 9
Kremlin 14
Louvre 20
Oracle 21
Porcelain Tower 21
Pyramids 30

The Kremlin's effects aren't really better for defense than building up tons of units. And Stonehenge is necessary for culture, as it can double culture if made early on.

 

[TopGearFanatic]

Angkor Wat 18
Big Ben 22
Chichen Itza 27
Cristo Redentor 18
Eiffel Tower 20
Himeji Castle 25
Machu Picchu 15
Notre Dame 17
Pentagon 22
Sistine Chapel 21
Statue of Liberty 23
Stonehenge 32
Sydney Opera House 5
Taj Mahal 18
Forbidden Palace 21
Great Library 19
Great Lighthouse 18
Great Wall 8
Hagia Sophia 21
Hanging Gardens 9
Kremlin 14
Louvre 18
Oracle 21
Porcelain Tower 21
Pyramids 30

Chichen Itza, because extra Golden Age turns are awesome. Don't care too much for the Louvre as it gives me the two artists.

 

[Randall Turner]

Angkor Wat 18
Big Ben 22
Chichen Itza 27
Cristo Redentor 18
Eiffel Tower 20
Himeji Castle 25
Machu Picchu 15
Notre Dame 17
Pentagon 22
Sistine Chapel 21
Statue of Liberty 24
Stonehenge 32
Sydney Opera House 5
Taj Mahal 18
Forbidden Palace 21
Great Library 19
Great Lighthouse 18
Great Wall 8
Hagia Sophia 21
Hanging Gardens 9
Kremlin 14
Louvre 18
Oracle 21
Porcelain Tower 19
Pyramids 30

Downvote the Porcelain Tower because it's giving me something I can get easier with my own Great Scientists (or just a bunch of RA's).

Upvote the Statue of Liberty because its global effect can just get huge late-game. (But there's a lot of good wonders, upvoting is easy, downvoting is going to get hard.)

 

[Bezurn]

Angkor Wat 18
Big Ben 22
Chichen Itza 27
Cristo Redentor 18
Eiffel Tower 20
Himeji Castle 26
Machu Picchu 15
Notre Dame 17
Pentagon 22
Sistine Chapel 21
Statue of Liberty 24
Stonehenge 32
Sydney Opera House 5
Taj Mahal 18
Forbidden Palace 21
Great Library 17
Great Lighthouse 18
Great Wall 8
Hagia Sophia 21
Hanging Gardens 9
Kremlin 14
Louvre 18
Oracle 21
Porcelain Tower 19
Pyramids 30

Upvote Hemji Castle because of 3 factors - 2 GE points, 4 culture, and awesome defensive capabilities for your empire

Downvote Great Library due to the fact the liberty can fulfill the same goal by grabbing and early great scientist and either use for free tech or the more powerful early academy in the NC city.

 

[vexing]

Angkor Wat 18
Big Ben 22
Chichen Itza 27
Cristo Redentor 19
Eiffel Tower 20
Himeji Castle 26
Machu Picchu 15
Notre Dame 17
Pentagon 22
Sistine Chapel 21
Statue of Liberty 24
Stonehenge 32
Sydney Opera House 5
Taj Mahal 18
Forbidden Palace 21
Great Library 17
Great Lighthouse 18
Great Wall 8
Hagia Sophia 21
Hanging Gardens 9
Kremlin 14
Louvre 18
Oracle 21
Porcelain Tower 19
Pyramids 28

why spend 220 hammers to speed up workers by 50% when you could spend 210 hammers and build three workers?

cristo+ because it speeds up cultural games by a huge number of turns.

 

[NicTeos]

no maintanance for 3 worker and being able to build stuff faster like building railroad ( into new conquered land) ( it's maybe better on larger maps).

Angkor Wat 18
Big Ben 22
Chichen Itza 27
Cristo Redentor 19
Eiffel Tower 20
Himeji Castle 26
Machu Picchu 15
Notre Dame 17
Pentagon 22
Sistine Chapel 21
Statue of Liberty 24
Stonehenge 32
Sydney Opera House 5
Taj Mahal 18
Forbidden Palace 21
Great Library 17
Great Lighthouse 18
Great Wall 6
Hagia Sophia 21
Hanging Gardens 10
Kremlin 14
Louvre 18
Oracle 21
Porcelain Tower 19
Pyramids 28

Great Wall don't stop the enemy hordes. Also the effected area is quite small ( on large maps ). I guess for 350 hammers I can build a defense army.

Hanging Gardens bring for 200 hammers 3 hapiness for free ( no maintanance ), but maybe I don't want always the +1 population. It's great at begin, when there are hardly other option to get your pop happy. Maybe it isn't that good than other wonders, but I see them at the middle. Give the Gardens a chance!

 

[Randall Turner]

no maintanance for 3 worker and being able to build stuff faster like building railroad ( into new conquered land) ( it's maybe better on larger maps).

Doing the math here... I've got 17 workers at 5.5gpt maintenance, equivalent without pyramids is 25.5 workers (but the +50% isn't quite right, I've also got Citizenship for +25, so I'm not getting +50% really...) 17*1.75/1.25 == 23.8 equivalent, differential is 6.8 * 5.5gpt == 37.4 gold per turn.

I've had more, I've had less. <shrug> But Vexing plays games where 3 workers is half your workforce. The usual answer - depends on play style.

 

[vexing]

Vexing plays games where 3 workers is half your workforce.

i actually rarely have more than 3 workers. i prefer small and tall, or puppeting AIs who've already built their improvements.

 

[jagdtigerciv]

Angkor Wat 18
Big Ben 22
Chichen Itza 28
Cristo Redentor 19
Eiffel Tower 20
Himeji Castle 26
Machu Picchu 15
Notre Dame 17
Pentagon 22
Sistine Chapel 21
Statue of Liberty 24
Stonehenge 32
Sydney Opera House 3
Taj Mahal 18
Forbidden Palace 21
Great Library 17
Great Lighthouse 18
Great Wall 6
Hagia Sophia 21
Hanging Gardens 10
Kremlin 14
Louvre 18
Oracle 21
Porcelain Tower 19
Pyramids 28

Chichen Itza provides such a bonus over such a long time and comes at an earliest enough time in the game to make a noticeable difference when you need it the most.

Sydney because of the very opposite of the above statement.

 

[Randall Turner]

i actually rarely have more than 3 workers. i prefer small and tall, or puppeting AIs who've already built their improvements.

Well, 17 is pretty heavy, but for large maps (not huge), 20+ cities is normal late game and nukes keep your guys busy, they're worse than railroads for workload. <shrug>

 

[TimeWeaver]

Angkor Wat 18
Big Ben 22
Chichen Itza 28
Cristo Redentor 19
Eiffel Tower 20
Himeji Castle 26
Machu Picchu 15
Notre Dame 17
Pentagon 22
Sistine Chapel 21
Statue of Liberty 24
Stonehenge 33
Sydney Opera House 3
Taj Mahal 18
Forbidden Palace 21
Great Library 17
Great Lighthouse 18
Great Wall 4
Hagia Sophia 21
Hanging Gardens 10
Kremlin 14
Louvre 18
Oracle 21
Porcelain Tower 19
Pyramids 28

My vote of the day, once again I bring down the great wall, coz defending oneself in this game is reasonably easy already. And this time Stonehenge gets my upvote, since +8 in culture that early is a godsend.

 

[The_Quasar]

Angkor Wat 18
Big Ben 22
Chichen Itza 28
Cristo Redentor 19
Eiffel Tower 20
Himeji Castle 26
Machu Picchu 15
Notre Dame 17
Pentagon 23
Sistine Chapel 21
Statue of Liberty 24
Stonehenge 33
Sydney Opera House 3
Taj Mahal 18
Forbidden Palace 21
Great Library 17
Great Lighthouse 18
Great Wall 2
Hagia Sophia 21
Hanging Gardens 10
Kremlin 14
Louvre 18
Oracle 21
Porcelain Tower 19
Pyramids 28

Pentagon usually comes at a time I'm looking to upgrade several units, so very useful.

The Great Wall comes at a time where so many other things need the hammers more.

 

[TM Moot]

Angkor Wat 18
Big Ben 22
Chichen Itza 28
Cristo Redentor 19
Eiffel Tower 20
Himeji Castle 26
Machu Picchu 15
Notre Dame 17
Pentagon 23
Sistine Chapel 21
Statue of Liberty 24
Stonehenge 33
Sydney Opera House 3
Taj Mahal 18
Forbidden Palace 21
Great Library 17
Great Lighthouse 18
Great Wall 0 GONE
Hagia Sophia 21
Hanging Gardens 10
Kremlin 14
Louvre 18
Oracle 21
Porcelain Tower 19
Pyramids 29

'Mids - helpful in so many ways
GW - need better tactical AI to make it worthwhile

 

[Ravellion]

Angkor Wat 18
Big Ben 23
Chichen Itza 28
Cristo Redentor 19
Eiffel Tower 20
Himeji Castle 26
Machu Picchu 15
Notre Dame 17
Pentagon 23
Sistine Chapel 21
Statue of Liberty 24
Stonehenge 33
Sydney Opera House 3
Taj Mahal 18
Forbidden Palace 19
Great Library 17
Great Lighthouse 18
Hagia Sophia 21
Hanging Gardens 10
Kremlin 14
Louvre 18
Oracle 21
Porcelain Tower 19
Pyramids 29

Big Ben because of the same reasons as earlier - low opportunity cost, and huge amounts of gold saved throughout he game.

The Forbidden Palace needs a lot of cities before it even outperforms the Notre Dame. If you are going for that many cities, you are doing a conquest type victory, and might as well conquer this marginal wonder from some AI.

 

[filli_noctus]

Angkor Wat 18
Big Ben 23
Chichen Itza 28
Cristo Redentor 19
Eiffel Tower 20
Himeji Castle 27
Machu Picchu 15
Notre Dame 17
Pentagon 23
Sistine Chapel 21
Statue of Liberty 24
Stonehenge 33
Sydney Opera House 1
Taj Mahal 18
Forbidden Palace 19
Great Library 17
Great Lighthouse 18
Hagia Sophia 21
Hanging Gardens 10
Kremlin 14
Louvre 18
Oracle 21
Porcelain Tower 19
Pyramids 29

No changes to my vote from last time.
Sydney opera house - too late to be useful
Himeji Castle - best defensive structure in the game

 

[Arilian]

Angkor Wat 18
Big Ben 24
Chichen Itza 28
Cristo Redentor 19
Eiffel Tower 20
Himeji Castle 27
Machu Picchu 15
Notre Dame 17
Pentagon 23
Sistine Chapel 21
Statue of Liberty 24
Stonehenge 33
--- Sydney Opera House 0 ---
Taj Mahal 18
Forbidden Palace 19
Great Library 17
Great Lighthouse 18
Hagia Sophia 21
Hanging Gardens 10
Kremlin 14
Louvre 18
Oracle 21
Porcelain Tower 19
Pyramids 29

Big Ben because of the same reasons as earlier - low opportunity cost, and huge amounts of gold saved throughout he game.
Sidney Opera house - just too late...

BTW OP should have start 10 point all it will take too long an players will loose interest.