2015 State of the Union Address

[Light Cleric]

Nixon would have certainly been impeached, which is why he resigned.

As for impeaching Bush, I dunno, you'd have to ask the Democrat party leadership about that.

Personally I think it was silly to impeach Clinton and have that whole investigation and it ended up blowing up in their faces politically; they would have been better off leaving him crippled like he was before Gingrich and his lego person hair got overzealous. But there's still an easy way to not get in trouble for lying to a grand jury.

why the hell does literally every political thread on CFC devolve into this kind of thing

 

[JollyRoger]

Clinton was impeached by a bunch of guys who resented Monica's having the fun they wish they could have had.

 

[FriendlyFire]

Again, he was not impeached for an affair. He was impeached because he lied to a grand jury. What he lied about is utterly irrelevant.

Of course Newt Gingrich was having yet another extra marital affair at the very same time. I am sure that is also "utterly irrelevant" but non the less .... hypocritical ? amusing ? very smart political move ?

 

[bhsup]

Did Newt lie under oath to a grand jury about it? Didn't think so. Also, btw, for the record I have made it clear how I feel about Newt and McCain and other politicians who cheated. It's why I wrote in Mitt in 2008 instead of voting for McCain. So why are you pestering me about this anyway? What does any of it have to do with Obama's speech?

 

[JollyRoger]

Clinton didn't either. He answered the questions technically truthfully based on the way words were being defined for purposes of the testimony under oath.

 

[onejayhawk]

Because he is a timid overthinker who hopelessly looked for consensus? Lots of reasons.

My point is that perhaps the purpose of his speech was not "lets get this done" but "here is a bunch of great stuff the GOP will never do, sucks don't it." He has little to lose now with these "bold" policy ideas because he does not have to do anything other than sit back and watch it not happen. It's for the 2016 candidate to run on.

I give you hopeless.

Concensus, not since he was elected to the Senate. He doesn't even work with Democrats.

The purpose of the speach is usually chest thumping. This year was no exception.

J

 

[FriendlyFire]

Did Newt lie under oath to a grand jury about it? Didn't think so. Also, btw, for the record I have made it clear how I feel about Newt and McCain and other politicians who cheated. It's why I wrote in Mitt in 2008 instead of voting for McCain. So why are you pestering me about this anyway? What does any of it have to do with Obama's speech?

I would have preferred the greatest US General produced since Grant, General David Petraeus to not have resigned over an extra marital affair.

Seriously, cant the Republicans critise Obama over something of real substance ?
Theres plenty of other problems with Obama administration but this is the least of them.

 

[Flying Pig]

Clinton didn't either. He answered the questions technically truthfully based on the way words were being defined for purposes of the testimony under oath.

While that all 'part of the game', should it be? I mean, you don't have any obligation to give evidence against yourself, but that's designed to stop people torturing you, not to help clever people with a law degree weasel out from under less clever people with law degrees.

 

[Light Cleric]

I would have preferred the greatest US General produced since Grant, General David Petraeus to not have resigned over an extra marital affair.

Seriously, cant the Republicans critise Obama over something of real substance ?
Theres plenty of other problems with Obama administration but this is the least of them.

Well I mean, that's kind of at least half the point of this thread. The whole thing isn't substance, it's just show. I don't see what's wrong on calling them on something silly like this when the point is that it's silly.

SOTU is treated as big deal here, nationally televised primetime speech on every network and cable news channel, advertised and hyped on Youtube etc and then instead we have silly stuff like this.

 

[ReindeerThistle]

Lies, damn lies, and statistics. The 2015 #SOTU in one line.

 

[gay_Aleks]

You make it sound as if it's something different from the rest of the year.

 

[Gori the Grey]

Turns out the big story was not what Barack said, but what Michelle wore.

What message was she trying to send by wearing an outfit that had appeared in The Good Wife?

 

[gay_Aleks]

That the political system is rotten and we totally need a monarch?

 

[JollyRoger]

While that all 'part of the game', should it be? I mean, you don't have any obligation to give evidence against yourself, but that's designed to stop people torturing you, not to help clever people with a law degree weasel out from under less clever people with law degrees.

Clinton was dealing with questions from lawyers. They both knew how the terms were defined by the court for the purposes of the deposition. Paula Jones' lawyers should have asked more specific questions if they wanted knowledge of activities they fell outside of the court definitions.

 

[Zkribbler]

 

[Zkribbler]

The SOTU is constitutionally mandated but an actual speech is not. Heck, some presidents used to write letters and that would meet the requirement.

SOTU speeches began with the invention of television.

["Hey! I get to be on TV!" ]

 

[gay_Aleks]

Well, mass media sure did make the SOTU speeches far more wide-spread. Radio, too.

It's an entertaining thought that Lincoln would write a SOTU speech and then a cavalry regiment would go all around the North and spread it around.

 

[onejayhawk]

That the political system is rotten and we totally need a monarch?

Let's elect one for four years.

J

PS Nah.

 

[Antilogic]

SOTU speeches began with the invention of television.

["Hey! I get to be on TV!" ]

The history there is a bit more complicated. The original state of the union messages were letters personally read to Congress during the Washington and Adams administration, but Jefferson mailed his in both because of its connection to the king's speech to the opening session of parliament and because he was a terrible public speaker by most contemporary accounts.

Throughout the rest of the 19th century, this practice continued. Although a few presidents such as Teddy Roosevelt would make public speeches (aka the bully pulpit) on subjects connected with his annual letter to Congress, it was Woodrow Wilson who switched back to delivering the speech in person to a joint session of Congress. Since then, the practice has been updated for the radio era and the television era, with new optics, invited guests, stylistic changes, etc.

 

[FriendlyFire]

Clinton was dealing with questions from lawyers. They both knew how the terms were defined by the court for the purposes of the deposition. Paula Jones' lawyers should have asked more specific questions if they wanted knowledge of activities they fell outside of the court definitions.

While legally a blow job is different to a sexual relationship, that kinds cheating to say that Clinton didnt lie. Giving how Republicans are very forgiving of sex scandles should have no problem with simply admonishing Clinton.
Clinton cover up made it worse. Anyways the Republicans were looking for any reason for impeachment no matter what.