ALC Game 17: Russia/Peter

[hotstuffjsn]

Losses are enevitable at some point. I always enjoy reading these threads and it's refreshing to see that even the best of players can still lose a game once in awhile. Will you play as Peter again or jump to the next leader?

 

[uncarved block]

Condolences on the loss, but as has been noted elsewhere, a bad start can screw you on the higher levels.

As for BtS games: I'm going to assume you've read all the warnings about the improved AI tactics when it comes to war, and have more than one obsolete unit protecting your homeland cities More importantly, there are three new map types, two of which sound promising as replacements for Fractal-- "Big and Small" and "Medium and Small", which create continents (either medium or large), mixed with smaller islands. They sound a lot more varied than the Continents map, but without the wild variability of Fractal. I know you're hesitant to change maps, out of consistency, but it would provide an opportunity to highlight the improved AI navies I've been reading about, and perhaps the Colonies option as well.

All speculation right now, just thought I'd point out the new options.

 

[Sisiutil]

Losses are enevitable at some point. I always enjoy reading these threads and it's refreshing to see that even the best of players can still lose a game once in awhile. Will you play as Peter again or jump to the next leader?

I think I'd like to reboot the thread as Peter. A combination of a tough start for me, a dream start for a neighbouring AI, and some mismanagement on my part led to this result. I don't feel like I had a game where I really let Peter shine, so I'd like to continue this thread but with a new BtS-based Peter game.

Condolences on the loss, but as has been noted elsewhere, a bad start can screw you on the higher levels.

As for BtS games: I'm going to assume you've read all the warnings about the improved AI tactics when it comes to war, and have more than one obsolete unit protecting your homeland cities More importantly, there are three new map types, two of which sound promising as replacements for Fractal-- "Big and Small" and "Medium and Small", which create continents (either medium or large), mixed with smaller islands. They sound a lot more varied than the Continents map, but without the wild variability of Fractal. I know you're hesitant to change maps, out of consistency, but it would provide an opportunity to highlight the improved AI navies I've been reading about, and perhaps the Colonies option as well.

All speculation right now, just thought I'd point out the new options.

Interesting map options, they may be fun to try out.

If the AI is now better at attacking your weak points, that would make a large empire harder to manage, requiring more units in more cities--at least enough to fend off an invading stack.

I would imagine you could still get away with protective interior cities with a single obsolete unit, but it sounds like you'd have to bulk up more forces in border and coastal cities--after all, the AI would have to go through or by those in order to get to your interior. I'm used to leave a couple of units in non-border cities, even if their coastal. Sounds like that could be dangerous in BtS.

 

[DragonHawk]

I think I'd like to reboot the thread as Peter. A combination of a tough start for me, a dream start for a neighbouring AI, and some mismanagement on my part led to this result. I don't feel like I had a game where I really let Peter shine, so I'd like to continue this thread but with a new BtS-based Peter game.

If I may suggest, wouldn't it be better if you start a new thread instead continuing this one ? You are starting the first BTS game (albeit with the same leader) wouldn't you want a fresh thread for it? This would also put all the baggages (+the tough game) related to this thread behind

We can call it ALC Game 17b: Russia/Peter (BTS)

 

[Sisiutil]

If I may suggest, wouldn't it be better if you start a new thread instead continuing this one ? You are starting the first BTS game (albeit with the same leader) wouldn't you want a fresh thread for it? This would also put all the baggages (+the tough game) related to this thread behind

We can call it ALC Game 17b: Russia/Peter (BTS)

Hmm, not a bad idea. Thanks! I'd probably not record this game as a loss in the Bullpen, though, since I'm going to give Peter another shot.

 

[sigmakan]

If you win this time around you can call it a 'tie'

 

[uncarved block]

OK, I got lucky and just got a copy of BtS and loaded it right now. Haven't played more than a couple turns (errands to run), but made a "Big and Small" map and checked it out in Worldbuilder. (Sorry, no screenshot.) Looked excellent-- a good mix of continents big enough to support a decent empire, with lots of funky islands surrounding them. Lots of potential for canal cities (or forts!), and definitely a map where you'll want a good navy. I'll generate and check out two or three more later, but the early indications look very positive.

 

[Elrohir]

I think we got the same RNG roll.

Ragnar declared war two turns into the round and took Rostov and then Moscow with--oh, the ignominy of it--a combined force of Catapults, Longbowmen, and Horse Archers.

He took two of my cities with Longbows and HAs, fer cryin' out loud!

Oh, he also built the Great Library. Just to rub my nose in it.

Well, I know when I'm beat. Starting next to the BetterAI Viking when he has 3 gem tiles and marble in his capital's BFC is just not fair. Or at least, not fun.

But I know I also mishandled the start, so poor Peter did not get his due.

So here's what I propose.

I hit the stores today looking for BtS, but it wasn't on the shelves yet. (Sheesh. For Harry Potter, they get the stock out right away and stay open until midnight!) I'll keep checking. When I finally find it in a day or so, I say I restart a game with Peter with the new expansion pack, and we'll really show the BetterAI why they call him Peter the Great.

Sound good?

Ragnar declared war on me too, and dragged Qin into it a few turns later. I think you got it a little harder than I did, actually - I managed to fight off Ragnar's initial stack. But with Qin's trireme pillaging all my seafood, and Ragnar landing Berserkers around my empire, it was obvious that I couldn't pull it off, so I just quit. When you have warriors defending most of your cities, and everyone is five or six techs ahead and attacking with Berserkers, the game is lost.

A restart with BTS sounds like an excellent idea.

 

[jerVL/kg]

Tough break! Hopefully the official BTS-BAI will be a little more fairly balanced...

Can't wait to see "Peter's Revenge" -- the new features and random events in BTS sound like a lot of fun.

 

[manu-fan]

But Sisutil,

Don't forget to put up the proper 5th report showing how Ragnar crippled you. It will show others what the Better AI does etc.

And count me in for a vote of doing the next one as Peter again using BTS in a separate thread.

Cheers.

 

[Uncle Istvan]

I can't wait for BTS, but, because I use a mac, I must wait until some beneficient soul puts out the game for us mac users. Until then, I live vicariously through Sisiutil.

 

[The Bowman]

This just sucks. Do NOT tell me I wasted reading through all these pages just to end up with a quitter! lol

 

[MangleMeElmo]

This just sucks. Do NOT tell me I wasted reading through all these pages just to end up with a quitter! lol

Dude, the game was OVER! No one recovers from losing their capitol and two other cities so early in the game. No one, not even aelf, the patron deity of thread games. Well, maybe aelf could, but still.... I think Sisiutil should show us exactly what went wrong, because losses are more educational than victories.

 

[rtfischbeck]

You may also want to consider continents once you have BTS. It's much more random now, with about half the time you're on a small continent with one other civ. The continents are also less likely to be 2 long blobs.

 

[uncarved block]

Upon further review, "Big and Small" will probably not replace Fractal for the ALCs. All the starting locations I saw were too far away from the islands to provide any choices early, and the continents are so big that you're lucky if the next civ is even 15 tiles away. Any early UUs would be tough to exploit, and it would be very easy to end up with a tech whore like Mansa out of reach until it was too late.

On the plus side, it looks like the expansion kicks serious a$$, with a lot of little surprises that I hadn't heard about (though I haven't looked that closely): Stonehenge and the rest doesn't obsolete until Astronomy now, and Blitz and Commando aren't available until Military Science. Charge will be a common promotion instead of a novelty. Espionage works great, and was fairly easy to use the first time around. But we'll all be finding out about these things soon enough . . .

 

[Tyrael]

I can't wait for BTS, but, because I use a mac, I must wait until some beneficient soul puts out the game for us mac users. Until then, I live vicariously through Sisiutil.

May I suggest a REAL computer?

 

[StuntedAzrael]

I also vote that Sisutil posts his analysis of the game and why did he lost. This will be educative for everyone.

 

[cabert]

I can tell you why he lost :
- he didn't really go SE = slow teching
- he didn't attack ragnar soon enough

 

[JujuLautre]

I for, one, don't expect the next game to be played with BTS. Mostly for the following reasons:
- Sisiutil (and actually lots of us) will hardly have any good experience with BTS unless he first plays games on his own to "get the feeling"
- BTS still sees a little buggy (poison water & fomenting unhappiness anyone? If I'm correct, it appears in the BST bug forum it IS a bug; and perhaps I missed some others)

Just to share my thougths actually; I will obv accept anything (even if I don't have my BTS copy for now; who said to be french in Japan is cool? ), and thanks again Sisiutil for all the efforts he puts into these threads for everyone

 

[Yeekim]

Sisiutil, it was the first time I really checked an ALC thread. Dunno why I (regrettably) have not followed these before - I find your storytelling talent enjoyable

Perhaps because, as an aspiring Monarch player myself, I was hoping to learn more from aelf's Immortal Challenges.

Which brings me to my point: man, you got whipped like a n00b
While I very much agree with cabert's elegantly short analyses ... is this the BetterAI we saw at work? I don't have it myself.. What is your track record with previous ALC-s?

Anyway...better luck next time!

NB! For honesty's sake: Ragnar has made me quit quite a few games as well.