ALC Game #22 Take 2: Arabs/Saladin

[NintendoTogepi]

Good game.

Just...

TOO. LONG.

 

[TM Moot]

Well, you got there (in the end ).

Well played fella.

I voted for an early religion grab in Take 1 (which didn't work out), but I still would of gone for an early religion in Take 2. I generally go for Poly first if I start with Mysticism, but then again I'm only a monarch player.

Keep up the good work Sis, these ALC's are always informative. When's the next one?

It's not soccer, its football....

 

[semirami]

Nevertheless, this game--the first ALC as a Protective leader--has proven instructive, so I'm hoping that the next ALC with a Protective leader (#27 with Churchill, I believe) will show me being a little more comfortable with the trait.

I believe this is the third ALC as a Pro leader. Did you forgot Toku and Gilgamesh?

 

[kniteowl]

You finished just in time so you can patch the game before your next ALC... well you should at least wait to check what bugs the new Patch comes with.

I haven't played Civ4 in a long time... I still come on the forums... I remember trying many different ways to leverage Protective like the Feudalism Slighshot and other Archery/Gunpowder units to leverage the trait but none of them were full proof and were generally quite risky on higher levels.

I hear on the forums some people use Protective as a Peace time trait by going for Peaceful victories while Minimizing Military Defence because your require less Defensive units becuase of your Protective Promotions and if you do get declared on you can watch the AI suicide their SODs on your CG3 Defenders.

As for the Arabian UU... I find it akward becuase most of the time, by the time I reach Guilds I already have horses and Iron and if I don't. I tend to to War in the Classical Era in order to acqure those resources for my Knight UU. Like with the Byzantines (did I spell that right?) lol.

I reckon the Arabian UU should of replace the Horse Archer, it may not be historically accurate (but then again neither is the Keshik UU lol) but at least it'd be fun and useful beelining HBR for my resourcesless fast-moving UU Conquering left and right.

The Arabian UB is alwys useful, especially cultural victories helping you Pop Religion with your GPs. If it's not useful for that then at least it helps your economy with all those Shrines but there is always the risk of not getting the religion or your missionaries failing to spread that religion.

 

[Winth]

Yay! Congrats!

As for sports. Rugby is awesome. Because they know how to leverage their Protective gear... which soccer can't do. But that doesn't quite matter, because soccer also owns.

A win/win situation.

 

[Zanttu]

GG Sis. Hope to see the next one soon.

OFF-TOPIC:
Ice-hockey is the best sport in the world. It requires skills as soccer, is rough as football, and it is faster than any of those other games. The only reason for why soccer is more popular than hockey is that soccer is easier to play. You just need a ball.

P.S. This is just my biased opinion, and I want no responses to it.

 

[Der Graf]

...had I known that my continent would lack any religions for such a long time, but hindsight is 20/20.

And that's why this one was taking you so long or didn't get your full attention, methinks.
Usually, with Sally you'd grab a religion (or two or three ), get organized, build priests (and temples and monasteries), convert your people, breed GProphets via madrasas, build the shrines, get rich and lateron wise with building the Sankore University while your Protective Longbows will keep your cities save (long enough, hopefully).

In short, Sally imo crys for a religious economy.
I'd say this was definitely a game with a big handicap (ALC 22- The unreligious Saladin ) and therefore winnig this one wasn't too easy.

But you did it - again

So...who's up next ?

 

[r_rolo1]

Nice game, and very diferent from the other one. I don't think that religion had much to do with it but clearly moving over Zara soon was a good catch .

Waiting for the next one...

 

[Pieman]

So...who's up next ?

Honest Abe.

 

[Stuck in Pi]

Yeah Sis! Of course, with the 3.17 patch, you'll be unable to attack with seige from sea...

 

[r_rolo1]

Spies were invented for something.....

 

[Crowqueen]

Well done, Sis, a good read and a good game. Not so hot on figuring out whether it was a great one or not, but still, you are an entertaining and compelling writer so I am glad you will be doing us a few more soon as well as updating Princes of the Universe.

As they say in Magic The Gathering - GOOD GAME!

 

[kazapp]

but clearly moving over Zara soon was a good catch

Your definition of "soon" clearly differs from mine, but other than that, good game - great writeup, Sisiutil!

And now over to some unsubstantiated patch bashing...

 

[Bandobras Took]

I'd just comment that once you hit gunpowder, Protective was helping out whenever you built a gunpowder unit. I don't think you flubbed the opening as such (if you had really flubbed the opening, you wouldn't have wiped out your continent), but I can easily understand that waiting to war is not your cup of tea. Cool game.

 

[sylvanllewelyn]

21 hours is a lot of time for a game, considering you did not actually engage in modern/future era warfare. Maybe a specialist (then hybrid) economy takes more time to manage, I don't know. I felt that the key turning points of the game are

- your use of watermills. Yeah, that's it - food and production.
- getting rifling before everyone else

You definitely use protective the best way possible. It's the worst trait - what did you expect? Now Churchill... I don't know. I'd prefer Khmer, because so many people say the UU's crap and the UB's mediocre. But I love them.

 

[huerfanista]

Yeah Sis! Of course, with the 3.17 patch, you'll be unable to attack with seige from sea...

If they're going to take that away, they should have at least given naval bombardment collateral damage.

 

[Tyrant Roger]

A new patch is out. Are you going to add it? That would seem like the thing to do since it is available to all.

 

[Sisiutil]

I really think that one thing you did pretty poorly was mobilizing your army. When you did go to war, you came in with completely overwhelming odds, which is great! Dont get me wrong on that, but usually, you could have gone to war much earlier without it, and still easily win. You said yourself that the AI beats you at everything, but never at war. Even with vastly inferior odds, you could still pull off a victory.

In my defense, let me just say that I've taken on Monty in an inter-continental invasion before, with an incredible tech advantage (Infantry and Tanks vs. Rifles and Cavalry). And got my stack wiped out by him throwing wave after wave of Cavalry at the one city I initially captured. So, once bitten, twice shy, I suppose; I was taking no chances this time around. If I'd been invading someone else at the same tech level, I might have attacked earlier with fewer units.

A new patch is out. Are you going to add it? That would seem like the thing to do since it is available to all.

Very probably, yes. First, though, I want to read up on the changes that have been made.

EDIT: Okay, I read through the changes. Obviously the biggest change is the new inability of siege weapons to attack off of ships. So much for the Sirian Doctrine! Combined with the increased EP cost to causing a city revolt, that will make intercontinental invasions tougher and increases the importance of Flight and possibly Carriers as well (so you can use Fighters to cause some initial damage).

The other most significant changes, IMHO:

• Machine Gun and Anti-Tank air interception chance: gives you a relatively contemporary counter to Airships.
• Increased barbarian ship spawn: increases the importance of Metal Casting for Triremes early on, and possibly the importance of Chemistry later (assuming that more barbarian Privateers appear--we'll see).
• Increased city revolt cost--as I said above, this is clearly designed to make city conquering a little tougher.
• Improved worker threat assessment: will this make it tougher to steal workers? Again, we'll see.

 

[Mukuu]

In my defense, let me just say that I've taken on Monty in an inter-continental invasion before, with an incredible tech advantage (Infantry and Tanks vs. Rifles and Cavalry). And got my stack wiped out by him throwing wave after wave of Cavalry at the one city I initially captured. So, once bitten, twice shy, I suppose; I was taking no chances this time around. If I'd been invading someone else at the same tech level, I might have attacked earlier with fewer units.

I do agree with that. Monty can do some... strange things. But I wasnt just talking about Monty, without looking, I remember it being pretty noticeable against Zara. But hey, like you said, sometimes, better safe than sorry. With protective, I like to build a slightly smaller SoD, get the Great Wall, and let the enemy come at me first, then walk through them. Then again, I tend not to like protective to much (BUT, Tokugawa makes for some very nice gunpowder units late game. 4 promotions with a barracks in the city is not a bad deal!).

Intercontinental invasions get really tricky, with 3.17, they are quite a bit more expensive, quite a bit. Strategy for them is going to need to get another look. But, I also would have gone into Monty with 3X more troops than I think I need. Nothing kills an invasion like a lack of troops, and its much harder to reinforce another continent.

Even if it wasn't Monty, I think you still would have gone in with those numbers, for a couple reasons.

1. Your not worried about score or time, while they are nice factors to take into consideration, your not trying to maximize your score by any means. Thus, it is always better to secure the victory, instead of taking a risk.

2. Everyone loves a good massacre! I would have preferred it if it was Isabella, but Monty works just fine.

 

[CivCorpse]

Move the scoutwarrior 1E to see if there is anything good. Oooops getting ahead of myself? Who is the next leader?