Alternate History Thread III

I can comment on this too, which i'll do after i finish reading it!

Edit: If by Chongzhen you mean the emperor who commited suicide near Beijing, i believe he had a son who ended up evacuating Beijing OTL and became the last Ming Emperor in Nanjing. He's considered weak and easily influenced, like his father. Then again, history never look favourably on the last emperor of a dynasty...

EDIT2: Or did i belive wrong? hmm internet sources say that the south was full of princes who wanted power for themselves...
 
If by Chongzhen you mean the emperor who commited suicide near Beijing

That's the one.

i believe he had a son who ended up evacuating Beijing OTL and became the last Ming Emperor in Nanjing.

Prince Fu, correct? Are you sure he was his son? There isn't much about him on Wikipedia, but I think I already found something elsewhere in the Internet...

He's considered weak and easily influenced, like his father.

Erk. His father was anything but weak and easily influenced, rather he was on the opposite extreme. Very paranoid, short-tempered, reckless and ambitious, kept killing people.

EDIT:

Or did i belive wrong? hmm internet sources say that the south was full of princes who wanted power for themselves...

Those are the people that I mostly don't want to hear about - they aren't his direct descendants, though they were of the Ming dynasty, and there is plenty enough information about them anyway. But he definitely did have sons.

Oh, and nevermind about Prince Fu, he seems to be his cousin.
 
Well, Chongzhen could be considered easily influenced too, most of his killings were caused by the (pro-manchu) eunuchs who tells him to kill generals who are "betraying" the nation...... That's partly why he became so paranoid as well, because he trusted his eunuch that everyone is out to get him. As for the alt his...

fortunately, the all-powerful eunuch Wei Zhongxian, who had brought down Sun Chengzong, was himself no more; the new Emperor, Chongzhen, got rid of him and of his allies immediately, determined to govern for himself and to root out all treason and corruption;
This part is probably the most far-fetched part of the alt his, as satisfying as it would to see it take place. AFAIK Chongzhen trusted the eunuch above everyone else, and that's why OTL happened as it did.

As for the reinforcements that you said were provided, i honestly doubt the Ming Dynasty at the time were capable of waging an offensive war against the Manchu... they barely had enough to supply their defense, let alone going on an offense to the extent that you wrote.

Lastly, what's going to happen to the general now? I'd assume that you would have him killed, since that's the style of Chongzhen? The sad part is that if he is ordered to die, he'll likely choose to die than rebel...
 
He was paranoid, but I don't think he trusted the eunuchs too much neither.
 
Maybe in the very long run, but I do have some general plans for the next eighty years or so, and its more like the opposite within that time period...

You'll see. ;)
 
Ugh...so...how specific should I go with stats? It's hard considering there is little to no divulgence on specific military stats :p
 
Actually OTL wise Wei Zhongxian was dismissed from court by the Chongzhen Emperor and later committed suicide so I guess there’s no problem there at all since Wei’s influence was mostly confined to Chongzhen’s elder brother. In addition, the Chongzhen Emperor also publicly announced that he would support Yuan but OTL wise he was still executed ;) That aside, the ending about the members of the Jin itself is a bit problematic. The Jurchens/Manchus were quite notorious for their ah… death before surrender and it’s strange about how the members of the Later Jin Dynasty surrendered instead of all well, killing themselves.

On the matter of Chongzhen’s sons, aside from finding out he had, I think, two sons who he didn’t order to suicide, there’s pretty much nothing else I was able to find. Yes, I even went and asked my grandpa to read his Chinese history book, no names or their personality.

It was by the 1600s the general consensus that the Ming Dynasty had lost the Mandate of Heaven. The numerous floods, famines, and peasant revolts didn’t exactly help its image. I agree with thomander’s assessment, the Ming Dynasty didn’t exactly have the capability to go on an offensive in Manchuria while China proper was beset by rebellion. The Neo-confucianists view was very strong up to the end of the Ming and it’s perhaps more likely that Chongzhen would try and seek a suitable peace with Huang Taiji after the Ming capture of Liaoyang and the other strategic cities on the region.

Of course, if the Ming began having actual success against the Jurchens there is a slight chance that the Ming could maintain more control over China Proper with some nicely done propaganda but then again it would lengthen their northern frontiers…

All in all, this alt-hist could happen. And personally speaking, I’m sure Yuan is more then capable of using brute force at crushing the rebels for a while ;) Then again, the Ming Dynasty I’m afraid is not exactly my forte….
 
Ugh...so...how specific should I go with stats? It's hard considering there is little to no divulgence on specific military stats :p
Welcome to the U.S.S. Make-****-Up, son. :p We used to call it Enterprise but decided for a bit more truth in advertising.
 
In addition, the Chongzhen Emperor also publicly announced that he would support Yuan but OTL wise he was still executed

Which is where things diverge, ofcourse. Not really sure if my PoD would work that well, but IMHO it could, all things taken into consideration.

The Jurchens/Manchus were quite notorious for their ah… death before surrender and it’s strange about how the members of the Later Jin Dynasty surrendered instead of all well, killing themselves.

I presumed that most of them would either do that or fight on in steppes, but I rather doubt that literally all would do that. Some may not do so in time and will be killed by the Ming instead! :p Still, thanks for the input. But what about the other Jurchen nobles?

It was by the 1600s the general consensus that the Ming Dynasty had lost the Mandate of Heaven. The numerous floods, famines, and peasant revolts didn’t exactly help its image. I agree with thomander’s assessment, the Ming Dynasty didn’t exactly have the capability to go on an offensive in Manchuria while China proper was beset by rebellion. The Neo-confucianists view was very strong up to the end of the Ming and it’s perhaps more likely that Chongzhen would try and seek a suitable peace with Huang Taiji after the Ming capture of Liaoyang and the other strategic cities on the region.

Of course, if the Ming began having actual success against the Jurchens there is a slight chance that the Ming could maintain more control over China Proper with some nicely done propaganda but then again it would lengthen their northern frontiers…

a) Am not saying that it didn't have lots of problems, but it still tried to fight in OTL, and succesfully did so until the rebellions got too overwhelming - which was only in the early 1640s, until then the rebellions were rather more sporadic and no real threat to the dynasty as such.

b) They tried to go, and they actually DID go on such offensives in the past time and again, and after beating off the attack on Beijing (slightly changed from OTL) things actually seemed to be turning in their favour; however, the execution of Yuan had very grave consequences for this, as he was in charge of the whole Liaoning counteroffensive, but also because his death greatly demoralised both the Ming armies and the Joseon court. So if he lives, he would be able to go on with his plan for the recovery of Liaoning; he would also be able to revive the coalition early on, as opposed to Korea being overran again in 1637 and China crumbling by 1644.

c) Liaoning was by then the heart of the Jurchen empire. All the administrative centres and the highly useful Chinese population (including specialists and officials) were concentrated there. So the recovery of Liaoning automatically means the death of the Jurchen Empire. There is no need to press further into "Manchuria"; all the Ming would have - and want - to do is reclaim the pre-war border, which isn't hard if they strike hard and fast enough, as Liaoning isn't a very big province. Sounds reasonable to me both strategically and ideologically. As for holding on to it...

d) If you think the Ming Dynasty is still going to do badly, then just you wait and see what I have in store for them! :p
 
More of a general idea than an actual POD, but:

- Gorbachev, for whatever reason, never becomes General Secretary of the USSR.
- Ideally Andropov and Chernenko don't either.
- A Communist hardliner with some degree of vitality becomes General Secretary instead.
- Glasnost and perestroika obviously do not occur. Perhaps Chernobyl doesn't happen. Soviet credibility and control are weakening, but not uncontrollably.
- The Soviet invasion of Afghanistan becomes easier to maintain as a result.
- By skill (better reaction and deployment of Spetsnaz, study of American experience in Vietnam, so on) or luck (butterfly), the Soviet Union manages to stabilize the Afghan situation and gain a measure of superiority over the insurgency.
- The only way to truly stop the insurgency for good is to neutralize its forward bases in Pakistan. The new Secretary General, being a hardliner, decides to do so.

I would presume this would ratchet up American involvement in assisting Pakistan (obviously), and quite possibly Chinese as well (they not being fans of the USSR either) and meanwhile, India, being a huge consumer of Soviet military equipment, isn't particularly buddies with Pakistan or China either...

Meanwhile, Bin Laden and other Islamic groups opposed to the Soviet intervention, have quite the target to attack. NATO and the United States go on high-alert and this gets the Warsaw Pact rather quite jumpy...

... What happens?
 
Why not a healthier Andropov, really? Pretty much all the hardliners, including a certain Mr. Molotov, agree(d) that he was their last best hope; he was both competent and ruthless without being too reckless, and for what time he was in power he tried to reverse the stagnation and purge the senile wing of the party. The only problem was that he himself came to power too late. So, as I said, make him healthier and he would be quite ideal. Plus as I already said he had the general willingness to confront the various problems head-on; so pushing for some strong and fast measures to finish the Afghan War would be quite in-character for him.

alex994, could you look up some information on a Crown Prince named Ci Lang? Some Chinese history forum says that he was the son of Chongzhen, but I haven't been able to find anything apart from that (and the fact that he was apparently kidnapped by Li Zicheng).
 
I suppose that'd work too but what few sources I have'd bothered to look at indicate that the historical concensus of his actual work in the position is one of vaguely humanitarian reform (as opposed to his work previously). Everybody seems to have their own pet theory on how exactly his job would have turned out but I guess that's all for the better. I guess giving him a healthier background would work.

That still begs the question though: if Andropov has at least 10 more years of life (80 instead of 70--up to 1994), turns Afghanistan around, and starts bombing Pakistan, what does that entail for the rest of Eurasia, and the world? Clearly Islam would mobilize against the Soviet Union but what are the odds of China and India joining in on opposing sides? If they do, whose side does the West pick, if indeed any? Particularly with Reagan around, it seems a dangerous cocktail.
 
Clearly Islam would mobilize against the Soviet Union

Not so clearly... The Muslim popular movements would, as would Iran I suspect. That might lead to an interesting situation with Iraq, btw; Saddam Hussein might just try and defect to the Soviet side in exchange for support against Iran (the war is still ongoing, after all, while Khomeini was quite openly anti-Communist).

but what are the odds of China and India joining in on opposing sides?

Extremelly likely, ofcourse. China and USA have both been traditionally supporting Pakistan, so I'd imagine that is what they will do now, especially if the Soviets and the Indians begin actively cooperating against it.
 
Well, my personal reading of the events in Afghanistan and a possible invasion of Pakistan is that Islam would not mobilize against the Soviet Union. In Afghanistan there was a small and reckless group of muslim fighters who traveled there to fight the Soviet invasion, but in reality there was no muslim state that gave any degree of support to Afghanistan, and same would go for Pakistan. Pakistan has always been a pro-US state, much unlike the rest of the Muslim world, and Pakistan's ties with the muslim world have been shaky at best. On the other hand, Soviet Union was the main supplier of weapons to muslim nations, and the main power that backed the muslim states against Israel and the United States. I believe that non-Arab muslim states might support Pakistan, but predominantly Arab states would remain neutral, perhaps not huge fans of the idea of a Soviet Pakistan, but they would not give up their only supwerpower sponsor while Israel and the US still maintained strong ties.
 
das said:
Not so clearly... The Muslim popular movements would, as would Iran I suspect. That might lead to an interesting situation with Iraq, btw; Saddam Hussein might just try and defect to the Soviet side in exchange for support against Iran (the war is still ongoing, after all, while Khomeini was quite openly anti-Communist).
Stormbringer said:
Well, my personal reading of the events in Afghanistan and a possible invasion of Pakistan is that Islam would not mobilize against the Soviet Union.
The popular movement is what matters. As has been demonstrated lately, the government and the people can be two quite seperate things. Muslim countries are more or less armed by the Soviet Union (with mostly second-hand gear as well, excepting Syria; Iraq being in American pockets and Egypt having been semi-alienated after the normalization of relations with Israel), true, but I do not think radical elements wills stand by while a fellow Islamic country (estranged or not) is invaded by "Godless Communists."

Essentially, I believe it would spark the formation of terrorist networks similar to what we see today, only earlier, with the primary battleground being Pakistan. Essentially there could quite easily be a Jihad against the USSR, which, possessing as it did a very large Muslim population in Central Asia, could very quickly become problematic.

Also, I doubt the Soviets could easily beat what Reagan gave to Iraq, honestly.

Stormbringer said:
In Afghanistan there was a small and reckless group of muslim fighters who traveled there to fight the Soviet invasion, but in reality there was no muslim state that gave any degree of support to Afghanistan, and same would go for Pakistan.
Incorrect.

Wikipedia said:
The mujahideen were significantly financed, armed, and trained by the United States Central Intelligence Agency (CIA) during the Carter and Reagan administrations, Saudi Arabia, the People's Republic of China, several European countries, Iran, and Pakistan (during the Zia-ul-Haq military regime).
[...]
Olivier Roy estimates that after four years of war, there were at least 4,000 bases from which mujahideen units operated. Most of these were affiliated with the seven expatriate parties headquartered in Pakistan, which served as sources of supply and varying degrees of supervision. Significant commanders typically led 300 or more men, controlled several bases and dominated a district or a sub-division of a province. Hierarchies of organization above the bases were attempted. Their operations varied greatly in scope, the most ambitious being achieved by Ahmed Shah Massoud of the Panjshir valley north of Kabul. He led at least 10,000 trained troops at the end of the Soviet war and had expanded his political control of Tajik dominated areas to Afghanistan's northeastern provinces under the Supervisory Council of the North
Keeping in mind that these are simply Mujahadeen. Pakistan would afford its own tribal population, military, and whomever else they could recruit. Faith tends to run thicker than money in this particular geographic region.

Invading one Muslim country effectively crippled the Soviet Army in OTL. This scenario presumes they do better, obviously, but they're also invading two instead of just one. This will only increase Western support, and likely that of certain Middle Eastern states (such as Saudi Arabia) as well. The Soviet Union isn't such a great ally if they appear to be setting out to conquer the Persian Gulf.

Besides, what's to stop the Middle East from just picking up copies of the exact same weapons from China (like they are now) or just buying European instead of American (they being not so well predisposed to Israel)?
 
Ok guys (especially Symphony), here is the ruleset I think really represents a modern game pretty good. Anything that should be left out or added though?

Spoiler :
National Statistics
Every nation will have a set of statistics (abbreviated as “stats”) that will give some information about the nation. This information is used to help the player play that nation and to help compare nations against one another. Generally, the information gives an indication of the nation as a whole, its economy, the size of its military, its political type, and some information on the industry and education in the nation. You directly control some parts of the nation, such as the military, what projects your nation is working on, stability (to an extent) and education of your people. Other things you can only influence, such as the economy, trade, how industrialized your nation is. I decide when things change, and I update them every update, as needed. For NPCs, things generally don’t change that much, unless you influence them, but you can read more about that in the NPC section.

I am going to give you an example of the stats, then go through and explain what each part means in more detail. I am going to experiment with using a number system to describe things between 1 and 10. I hope this won’t over simplify the game, but rather give the reader a quick and accurate idea of that statistic. In almost every case, 1 will mean low, or bad, and 10 will be high, or good. More on this later. One last thing, please keep in mind if you notice anything wrong with anybody’s stats, please e-mail me so I notice it and can correct it.

Here is an example of what a Nation’s stats will look like:

Nation: Imperial Grand Republic of Goober (Gooberopia)
Player: Goober
Government Type: Authoritarian Dictatorship (10)
Economy: Shattered (2/-1/0/15)
Military: MOBILIZATION
Army: 10,000 Regulars, 5,000 Special, 1,500 Tanks
Navy: 1 Aircraft Carrier, 20 Battleships, 5 Destroyers, 3 Frigates,
Air Force: 20 Fighters, 30 Bombers, 10 Interceptors
Size: 5
Industrialization: 4
Education and Health: 8
Stability: 2
Trade: 1
Current Projects: Armageddon (2/6, 1/3)
Completed Projects: Life (DONE!)

Nation and Player:
These are really simple; they simply tell the name of the Nation and of the Player. I usually will use the name that you choose for the nation, but I might put a more descriptive name in brackets beside it. In my example, the nation has an official long name that it calls itself, and then a shorter name that people recognize it by. For instance, the Republic of China is typically called Taiwan. For the player name, I use the one that you registered with CFC, but I might put a nickname beside it.

Government Type
The purpose of this is to tell people what kind of a Government you have, generally the more info the better. I prefer “Parliamentary Monarchy” to “Democracy”, etc., just to be descriptive. The number in brackets afterwards is between 1 and 10. It’s purpose it to tell you what kind of government is in charge of the nation politically. 1 means extreme leftist, or communist, and 10 means extremely conservative. In my example, well, Gooberopia is a dictatorship, which also happens to be extremely conservative politically.

Changing between Government types is generally a complicated and tricky affair, which usually involves a loss in stability. It can involve bloodshed, such as a Fascist dictatorship overthrowing a left-wing Democracy. It can lead to civil war, whatever the case, it is a tricky manoeuvre. For a democracy, it will involve the Constitution or Basic Laws of the country being changed, which is politically difficult, but it can be done easily. Generally, Democracies tend to be less corrupt and more efficient then Communism or Fascism. Of course, you are ultimately in charge of that.

Example Government Descriptions:

Fundamentalism, Fascist Dictatorship, Communism, DemoCommunism, Totalitarian Communism, Monarchical Communism, Multiparty Democracy, Theocracy, Monarchy, Constitutional Monarchy, Parliamentary Monarchy, 2-Party Democracy, DemoFascism, FundoSocialism.

Economy
Economy is simply a measure of how well the economy of the nation is performing. It describes the flow of goods and services and demand and supply for the nation, to use some economics terms. The system I use might look complicated, but it is fairly simple once you understand it. Generally, it consists of a verbal description, and then numerical details about how the economy is performing. How your economy is doing is very important to your nation, especially democracies, so this section is important. The economy of the nation will have a massive impact upon your nation, and your people. Also, this data tells you how much you can spend, which is critical.

Verbal Descriptions generally tell the world how your economy is doing. It is per capita, that is, you can directly compare it to another nation. A bigger nation, with a bigger population and more resources will perform better, given everything held constant, then a smaller nation, so I take that into effect. However, a small nation can also have an incredibly efficient economy that is extremely productive, like Singapore in real like. Here is a list of the descriptions. The numbers in brackets I will explain next:

Shattered (1) - Barely functioning (2) - Mostly Functioning (3) - Functioning (4) - Severe Depression (5) - Depression (6) - Recession (7) - Failing (8) - Stable (9) - Normal (10) - Above Normal (11) - Growing (12) - Strong (13) - Very Strong (14) - Prosperous (15) - Very Prosperous (16) - Extremely Prosperous (17) - Outstanding - (18) - Very Outstanding (19) - Powerhouse (20) - Superpower (21+)

Each year (or update), you will have a set amount of what are referred to as “eco”, or economic points to spend. These loosely represent the revenue that you make from your economy each year. The numbers above are the gross amount that you will make at each economic level. Generally, an eco is equal to around 10-15 billion dollars. It must be stated, however, that you cannot really compare this system to a real life economy. I have designed this system so that you have money to spend each year to make things more exciting.

Now I will explain the numbers in the brackets.

Economy: XXXX (A/B/C/D). This is interpreted as follows:
• XXXX - Verbal Description of your Economy
• A - Eco required to pay for maintenance or upkeep costs
• B - Eco you spend/turn (Don't forget Bonus eco from last turn, and add revenue from colonies or nations you directly control)
• C - Eco that you have banked, and can spend on any turn.
• D - Eco that you owe other people, your Debt. Note that this goes up over time, due to Interest.

As you can see, the numbers are fairly self-explanatory. I will now briefly explain them a bit more, but I think you get the idea from above. Maintenance is the money that you must spend to keep what you presently have. This means paying salaries mostly, but also for cleaning costs, and such. A large part of this will be the government bureaucracy and the military. You must pay this each turn, if you don’t, well, bad things happen, such as strikes and the like.

The eco that you can spend (B) is the amount from above, the description, minus the maintenance. So, if your economy is outstanding, that means that you have 18 eco to spend. If you have 5 eco of maintenance per turn, then 13, the net amount, will show up as B. Now, each turn you have the chance of gaining bonus eco. Please see the Stories section for more on this. The B number does not include bonus eco, you need to add that on yourself. Please see the appropriate section for how to spend your eco. The last two sections, C and D are fairly straightforward. I will not bank your eco for you if you fail to spend it, or send orders. I might bank 1 or 2 if I am feeling nice, but somebody will spend your money for you, whether that is on government business or not.

You are able to influence, but not directly control, your economy. Cutting taxes will cause your revenue to drop, but not necessarily your economy, as consumers will spend that additional money (or businesses), and that money will stay in the economy. Your government type will influence the economy as well. A more socialist government, that has more influence in the economy, will generally be better for individuals but worse for the economy as a whole. A government that has little influence in the economy is better for the economy but worse for the individuals. By influence I mean setting prices, nationalizing industries, government-owned companies, and so forth. Your trade will also affect the economy. The more trade you do, the better for consumers and the economy, but the worse for producers. The less trade you do, or the more protectionist you are, the better for producers, but the worse for consumers and the economy as a whole. Again, another balancing act that I will take into effect.
The Gooberopia economy is as such: Shattered (2/-1/0/15). So, the economy has been totally ruined, likely by war of some sort. They have 2 maintenance every turn, and they lose an eco per turn. 1 eco/turn in Shattered – 2 maintenance = -1 eco. They have nothing banked, and owe 15 eco to others.

Military
This section is very self-explanatory. It just tells you how large your military is. The word after Military describes any special events happening to your military. In my example, the nation is being mobilized, that is, all persons of a certain age are being trained to fight. Please note that ships and planes will cost the same amount regardless of what nation it is. This is because it costs the same amount to build and manufacture ships and planes regardless of the country. Troops will vary depending on your nation’s size, which shall be explained more later.

Your army simply consists of the number of troops you have. The adage of more the merrier doesn’t really have an effect, with modern warfare. Having troops is a good thing; they can be useful in certain situations, but not all the time. With modern bombs and such, the foot soldiers of World War I simply cannot be as useful as a tank or bomber. For troops, this will vary depending on the size of your nation. The base amount will be 5,000 troops per eco. That number will be multiplied by half of your nation’s size, with the minimum being 5,000 troops. Some examples:

5,000 (base) X 2.5 (Nation Size of 5 divided by 2) X 1 eco = 12,500 total troops.
5,000 X 1.5 (Nation size of 3 divided by 2) X3 eco = 22,500 total troops.

Here are the costs for all other military units: Please note that these are the costs for the generic units. If you develop technology that is better, then those will cost more to build, depending on how much you improve the basic technology.

• 1 eco = 6 smaller ships (Frigates, smaller Destroyers)
• 1 eco = 4 larger ships (Battleships, large Destroyers)
• 1 eco = 1 large Aircraft Carrier, 2 small Aircraft Carriers
• 1 eco = 200 Tanks
• 1 eco = 25 Fighters or Interceptors
• 1 eco = 20 Bombers
• 1 eco = 350 Special Forces (Like the US Delta, Rangers, Canadian JTF2)
• 1 eco = 10 ICBMs or Space Launchers (Need Space Launching Facility)
• 1 eco = 100 SRBMs

ICBMs are, of course, InterContinental Ballistic Missiles, basically big missiles that go into space and come down to destroy stuff on other continents. You can attach nuclear devices to these, or other bombs. These are expensive because it costs a low to fuel it and get it off the ground. Space Launchers are essentially meant to put stuff in space, like satellites, etc. Everything else is fairly simply to understand. Please keep in mind that I don’t worry about the logistics. For instance, when you build tanks, it is assumed that you have tankers to keep them filled up with fuel, and support vehicles. For troops, I assume, that you have Armoured Personal Carriers to transport them.
One final note on Military is that you can do projects where you say that you want to build a set amount of military units, and then I give you a set price. As with everything, if you build or order large quantities, that is more efficient, so it will cost you less money. In limited circumstances, you can jointly develop new technologies.

Size
Size has to do with how big the nation is, and how many people it has. The bigger the landmass of a nation, or the larger the population, the larger the nation’s size rating. The rating varies from 1 to 10. 1 is a nation with a smaller population or land mass. An example would be Albania. 5 is an average sized nation, like, say, France. 10 would be a very large nation, in population and landmass. Am example would be Russia or China. You increase your landmass and population by conquering your neighbours. You can also encourage your population to produce more children through tax breaks and such.

Industrialization
Industrialization, as it sounds, is a measure of how industrialized your nation is. This means you have technologically advanced factories, industrial farms, an extensive and efficient road and rail system, and other infrastructure. This is calculated along a 1-10 scale, as discussed before. A 1 means that the country has little to no basic infrastructure. There might be some dirt roads, and very rudimentary transportation networks, but predominantly subsistence farming and very basic industries. Many African countries are at this range. A 10 means that the country has top-notch infrastructure. It has new, large roads, a very efficient transportation system, and industries that use the best, most modern technology.

This will directly affect your economy, and you can only somewhat affect it. You can upgrade and build infrastructure, roads, sewer lines, electrical grid, etc. But that is only half of it, you also need to attract companies which invest in the best technology and the like. Generally, large projects work best for this, but remember, roads always need to be repaved and upgrade, so trying to improve your industry can seem to be a bit thankless at times.

Education and Health
This is a very simple statistic. It simply is a measure of the education and health of your population. 1 means very little to no access to quality education and health, and 10 means you have a top-of-the-line health care and educational system. Depending on your system of government, then you can directly affect this. If you have a nationalized, state-owned Health Care and Education system, then you can just invest more money, and they will become better and better. If they are privatized, then you cannot really directly impact this number, except to try and change standards or prices. This will only really impact your economy if it is really low, because an uneducated workforce is a bad thing, of course. Also, a good health care and education number can increase immigration.

Stability
Stability deals with political stability. Again, this works via my 1-10 system. A 1 means that the country has little to no political stability. A 10 means that the country has an established, stable political system. Factors that affect the stability of a nation deals with things such as armed insurgencies, minority governments, changing government types, etc. The political stability will directly impact the economy. Obviously the higher the stability, the better for the economy, long periods of instability is bad for economies. You have somewhat control over stability. You can quell insurgencies; you can try and have a stable government, stability is generally fair easy to deal with.

Trade
Trade is simply a measure of your levels of trade with the outside world. This will be impacted by a variety of things, but primarily your trade laws. If you are more protectionist, then you will be constricting the flow of goods into your nation, and that will be bad for your economy. If you have free trade laws, then any nation can import their goods into your country without restrictions. This employs the same 1-10 scale, with 1 being an economy which allows virtually no trade, and a 10 being a nation that has completely free trade.

Both have their benefits, but you need to have taken some economics to truly understand it. Essentially, protectionism is better for producers (companies), but worse for consumers (regular people who might elect you), and worse for the economy overall. Free Trade is better for consumers, but worse for producers, and better for economies overall. I can explain in more detail if needed. Essentially, you need to find a balance between the two, keeping in mind that the groups being made worse off will complain against your move.

Projects
Projects are large national undertakings that your nation does. The goal is, of course, to achieve something of strategic important. You might be improving your education system, upgrading your infrastructure, developing a new military technology, building a space station, or upgrading your military. Those are, of course, examples. How projects work is that you send me your proposal, as a PM or E-mail (preferably not by MSN). You give me the following:

• A code and real name for the project, the code name is shown in your stats.
• A brief description of the project
• Your estimated time and eco spent on the project.

Projects require two things, eco points to complete, and time. In your stats, I will show projects as you can see in the Gooberopia example. You will see the name (Armageddon) that you send me in the PM. Beside it, I will put the Eco and Time required to finish it, in this format: Armageddon (Eco Spent/Eco Required Time Spent/Time Needed). I will take your suggested times and ecos into consideration, but I ultimately decide because I am God in this Universe. When you complete a project, then your stats get altered as required, and I usually announce it in the AWR each year.

Orders
Orders are an integral part of any NES. I need them to update, to tell the world what actions you are doing. You need to send them to me by PM or E-mail. I don't accept Orders on MSN or in the thread. In your orders, you essentially tell me what you want to do for that year. You also spend your eco points, including any bonus from last turn.

I reccomend that you send me a set of general orders at the beginning of the game in case you are unable to send orders for an Update. That way I can update for you anyway. Then you can send more specific orders, and rely on the general ones if you are busy with school stuff of whatever one week. I don't save your eco for the next turn if you don't send orders.

When you send your orders, I reccomend that you copy and paste your stats with them, but that is not necessary. You need to do several things. First, you need to spend your eco points. See the Rules - Statistics section for more info on that. Then you need to tell me what you want your nation to do. Politically, you can try and influence your allies or enemies. You can hold elections (which you can decide the result, within reason, or I can). You can also try and pass laws in your nation to advance your agenda. Diplomatically, you can sent our orders to subordinate nations, ask allies to do certain things for you, like give you eco, or negotiate with your enemies. Militarily, you need to give me what you want your army to do. If you are at war, I need strategies. They don't need to be complex, just tell me where you want to attack, what you want to defend, etc.
Diplomacy
Diplomacy is when you talk to your friends and your allies, other nations, and try to get them to do what you want. This is to be done in the thread, if it is public. Secret diplo can be done via PM or MSN, or even E-mail.

NPC Nations are Non-Player Character. They are nations that have nobody playing them. As the Mod, I role-play them. Diplo with them is done through me. I try and be fair when I role-play them, and of course unbiased. In the updates, I might mention events that are NPC-related that affect your nation.
Stories
Stories are when you tell us about an event in detail. This is usually in the form of a newspaper telling the world about your domestic or foreign policies, but doesn't have to be. You could give a detailed account of how your domestic policies are helping your nation, describe a big national event, or perhaps a massive new project that you finished.

Stories are definitely a plus to this game. They really add to the game, and make it more fulfilling for everybody. It shows that you have the time and care about your nation enough, and you are a serious NESer. But, if you don’t write them, don’t worry, we all have our real life issues. Random Bonuses or Events will happen to all nations, just more towards those who write stories. I will give random eco bonuses, roops bonuses, etc. depending on your story, but I will keep it real. I mean, you are not generally going to go up eco levels, you will just get bonus eco. Note that stories will usually bring positive random events, but can bring negative ones too. And there is the very unlikely possibility that you might lose eco because of it, but I will deal with that by informing the writer.

War
War is when you use your military to attack another country. There aer some things which need to be explained here. First, if you are the agressor, your people will eventually tire of the cost of a lengthy war, both in monetary and human values. This is especially true if you are a more liberal democracy. Of course, if there is no freedom of the press, what the people don't know generally can't hurt them. If you are the defender, then your people will be much more willing to support the cause.

You can Conscript and Mobilize your nation during wartimes. Conscription is drafting people into your army, like the USA did for Vietnam in real life. It is VERY unpopular in democracies. In other government types, that depends on the national mood. Mobilization is when you transform your economy so that you are producing goods for war, and that only. It is generally bad for economies, and the government usually needs to intervene. I will warn you that wars are unpopular, but sometimes needed. Your people are definitely not fond of them.

Nuclear Weapons

This is all about the dreaded N-word of the Cold War. Nuclear Weapons. Nuclear War. That word sends a shiver down most people's spine. These devices are awesomely powerful, as the USA demonstrated on Hiroshima and Nagasaki. Three nations have developed them: The USA, USSR and CSA. They are a jealously guarded secret, which is why they are not in the stats. Those three nations have shared this technology with a select few other nations. Here is the complete list of nations which have Nukes, with suspected nations in (Brackets):
USA
USSR
CSA
France
UK
PRC
Brazil
(Cuba)
(India)
(Israel)

The world is a very hostile place at the moment. Tensions are high, and international incidents only make them worse. If a war was to break out directly between CAN, ITO and Comintern, Nukes might be used. What stops that is a principle called MAD. It means Mutually Assured Destruction. Essentially, both sides would nuke each other until they both died. That is what stops Nukes from being used. As Mod, I will do everything I can to avoid this. If this NES goes into Nuclear War, it's Game Over, as far as I am concerned. Unless it is VERY limited. You all have stockpiles of these weapons. Also, you have ICBMs to launch them at each other. It is irrelevant exactly how many you have, or what size. Suffice to say, all of your arsenals are equal. And large. Very large. The 3 superpowers could destroy the world many times over if they felt like it. Which is why a Nuclear War would end the world, and thusly game.


I will obviously change some of the wording and the nuclear rules will be adjusted.
 
True, I suppose Saddam Hussein isn't opportunist enough here.

Essentially there could quite easily be a Jihad against the USSR, which, possessing as it did a very large Muslim population in Central Asia, could very quickly become problematic.

Probably not; Central Asia was quite secularised and was probably the least troubled part of the USSR in the later years, corruption scandals aside. I really doubt there would've been any major rebellions there. Maybe in Caucasus, but even there its unlikely.

What I wonder about here is the possibility for American-Iranian reconciliation. Or maybe they'll decide to make use of Iran being caught in the crossfire, move in to overthrow the Islamist government and install a more compliant one (after rewarding Saddam with Luristan); then they would be able to use Iran as a base of anti-Soviet operations.

The rules are a bit too complicated for my taste; plus the MAD thing has been challenged on this forum before. ;)
 
What rules do you suggest then? Symphony was right, your set is a little simplistic for a modern NES...but I don't really want it that sophisticated, since it will scare away potential joinees and make the ones in the NES less motivated to send orders.
 
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