AND2 and SVN Bug Reports - A New Dawn 2 ONLY

[Moth Bones]

Version 658, Epic, Huge, Noble.

Reached Medieval at 510 turns (510 AD) by using a GE to pop Engineering. I didn't rush towards it, and I'm sure I wasn't the first to discover it (there is an unknown superciv).

 

[45°38'N-13°47'E]

Version 658, Epic, Huge, Noble.

Reached Medieval at 510 turns (510 AD) by using a GE to pop Engineering. I didn't rush towards it, and I'm sure I wasn't the first to discover it (there is an unknown superciv).

Thank you Moth Bones; this kind of report is useful for my balancing work.

 

[45°38'N-13°47'E]

On the field commanders, I'm having the same problem.

Noted, I'll have a look. Just be warned (everyone) that a lot of problems are popping out, probably because more players are using AND2 recently. I need time to look at everything, so please be patient if the problem you reported is not being addressed quickly.

 

[45°38'N-13°47'E]

I started a new game with Ancient at 60, Classical at 75, and Med at 90. With these settings I did not have my 1st city or 1st 2 cities devastated by the Health event (-1 pop with successful outcome), because generally my city/cities have just reached pop 2 when this event likes to pop up.

You can't compare C2C with AND on these values because AND does Not have the building choices C2C has. And Needs a less restrictive Ancient era for igrowth than C2C.

Warning: OT Rant
Quite frankly AND is boring for the 1st 200/300 turns (on Epic or Marathon) because you have very little to build or improve, limited Gold/Commerce, and too high maintenance costs for city, units, and civics (in that order). Build more than a handful of units or more than 3 cities and you drown in -Gold and research slider at < 30%. You Must have an extremely good starting location to get above this. Now add in that Civic changes in Ancient and Classical (till you build National Courier Wonder) is 3 turns of anarchy for every Civic change. This is too much too! And finally the Poly/Mono/Buddha Religion tech line Must be broken up as well as the kemet/zorast. 1 civ will generally found at least 3 of these starting 5 religions, but sometimes all. And it's all because of How the tech progress is set up. A few simple Preq Tech changes and the religions will get spread out and then Limited Religion Option becomes Unneeded because the original complaint of 1 AI or player hogging all the religions is Gone! These are some of the issues I had with Afforess and AND back in the day, that impho still exist for no good real reason (in my estimation anyway).

Okay rant over, just had to get that off my chest.

JosEPh

I'm experimenting a bit with lower values for iGrowth.
As for religion, the new tech tree should make the situation a bit better but we'll know when we start testing it.

 

[SnoopDogg23]

I don't know how you've done or if you've done it on purpose but you've activated "Divine Prophets" option (which is disabled and hidden by default); I've seen it in your options in your savegame. Either you haven't cleared your cache (have you used C2C recently by chance?) or you've edited some xml file. Either way, if you want to clear your cache start a standard game with Play Now without any mod. Then quit the game and then start AND and everything will work. But you'll have to start a new game, you can't change options once you've started a game.

Thanks 45! That is strange, as I have never played C2C and it is not installed on my comp.

Snoop

 

[SnoopDogg23]

I started a new game with Ancient at 60, Classical at 75, and Med at 90. With these settings I did not have my 1st city or 1st 2 cities devastated by the Health event (-1 pop with successful outcome), because generally my city/cities have just reached pop 2 when this event likes to pop up.

You can't compare C2C with AND on these values because AND does Not have the building choices C2C has. And Needs a less restrictive Ancient era for igrowth than C2C.

Warning: OT Rant
Quite frankly AND is boring for the 1st 200/300 turns (on Epic or Marathon) because you have very little to build or improve, limited Gold/Commerce, and too high maintenance costs for city, units, and civics (in that order). Build more than a handful of units or more than 3 cities and you drown in -Gold and research slider at < 30%. You Must have an extremely good starting location to get above this. Now add in that Civic changes in Ancient and Classical (till you build National Courier Wonder) is 3 turns of anarchy for every Civic change. This is too much too! And finally the Poly/Mono/Buddha Religion tech line Must be broken up as well as the kemet/zorast. 1 civ will generally found at least 3 of these starting 5 religions, but sometimes all. And it's all because of How the tech progress is set up. A few simple Preq Tech changes and the religions will get spread out and then Limited Religion Option becomes Unneeded because the original complaint of 1 AI or player hogging all the religions is Gone! These are some of the issues I had with Afforess and AND back in the day, that impho still exist for no good real reason (in my estimation anyway).

Okay rant over, just had to get that off my chest.

JosEPh

Joseph,

I 110% agree with your criticisms of the AND early development and religion founding. I would note though that I have found the civic issues significantly less when using an Organized leader and when using SmartMap extra grass with balanced resources, which ensures most civs have good terrain.

Can't wait for Vokarya's new tech tree! Any news on when that version will be released?

Thanks again to 45 Degrees, Vokarya, and all who are working hard on AND2. I think there should be a new modern era tech called "Modding" which allows you to build a Civilization IV: ROM AND wonder. Effects: +3 happiness in all cities, +2 Great Engineer growth, +2 Great Artist growth, and increases the effect of Universities by 10%--I know I learned more about human history from Civ than from anything else!

Snoop

 

[Kryanni]

Warning: OT Rant
Quite frankly AND is boring for the 1st 200/300 turns (on Epic or Marathon) because you have very little to build or improve, limited Gold/Commerce, and too high maintenance costs for city, units, and civics (in that order). Build more than a handful of units or more than 3 cities and you drown in -Gold and research slider at < 30%. You Must have an extremely good starting location to get above this. Now add in that Civic changes in Ancient and Classical (till you build National Courier Wonder) is 3 turns of anarchy for every Civic change. This is too much too! And finally the Poly/Mono/Buddha Religion tech line Must be broken up as well as the kemet/zorast. 1 civ will generally found at least 3 of these starting 5 religions, but sometimes all. And it's all because of How the tech progress is set up. A few simple Preq Tech changes and the religions will get spread out and then Limited Religion Option becomes Unneeded because the original complaint of 1 AI or player hogging all the religions is Gone! These are some of the issues I had with Afforess and AND back in the day, that impho still exist for no good real reason (in my estimation anyway).

Okay rant over, just had to get that off my chest.

I'm probably an idiot for still playing 1.75C, but has the recent release of AND2 changed anything about this?

I've always found this early era a pain - I generally play huge/epic, and pretty much experience this most of the time. Get up to 3 cities, then I have to hunker down and try not to get tangled in any wars, until enough time passes that money isn't so tight anymore.

Well actually I like playing with Barbarian Civs active for a reason, I get money when I sack their cities. It also gives my units enough veterancy so that I can rely on a few elite units for defence, instead of having to keep churning out a steady stream of units. No barbarians = screwed when the neighbours decide I'm easy pickings. Ditto on the religions thing, it's too easy to snap up a couple of them at one go.

I dunno whether I should finally get off my ass and upgrade to AND2, or wait even more for the tech tree changes. Good work btw, I love this mod, and it's really great to see so much activity here.

 

[IPEX-731BA5DD06]

More on the great commanders problem.

I've only just realised to post this, but they aren't using up the command points, when they are in control of a battle unit.

Example, I have my Great commander on board a frigate. I send this ship out, with the great commander, to attack a Dutch east India-men. It wins the battle, but the great commander, still has 5/5 command points left, when it should only have 4/5. This is what is causing them not to gain experience.

As I've said, I had it working on one loading of the game only, I've no idea what I did, and I can't replicate that again. It's also happening to the AI's as well.

 

[Sgtslick]

Limited religion helps, i usually always play with this.

 

[45°38'N-13°47'E]

Limited religion helps, i usually always play with this.

I don't, just because I play with revolutions: so having multiple religions can cause troubles and I avoid it if possible.

 

[JosEPh_II]

I don't use Limited either. And the Religion changes I have briefly proposed should eliminate the need for it, whether you play with REV or not.

JosEPh

 

[Vokarya]

Here's something I've noticed with Start as Minors. The CivAlerts will often say Will Sign Peace Treaty: once an AI comes out of minor status, but then they won't sign peace if you actually go into the Diplomacy window. I think part of this might be the AI power calculation when deciding whether to accept peace. Is there anything else at work? This is using 660.

 

[Sgtslick]

@Vokarya Its the same in C2C, basically what it does is considers if - 'under the right circumstance' (bribes) they will make peace.

Usually this doesn't mean just a straight peace for nothing, they usually always want something (like a small amount of gold). So the alert 'will make peace', doesn't mean they'll do it for free in other words.

 

[45°38'N-13°47'E]

Here's something I've noticed with Start as Minors. The CivAlerts will often say Will Sign Peace Treaty: once an AI comes out of minor status, but then they won't sign peace if you actually go into the Diplomacy window. I think part of this might be the AI power calculation when deciding whether to accept peace. Is there anything else at work? This is using 660.

No, I don't think there's anything else; but I'm not sure it's a real problem. Just be aware that the message lets you know when you can trade with minors and it becomes possible to sign peace, although you can't (on some occasions) sign peace due to other factors (like power unbalance between civs). It might be something to change but I would postpone it for future revisions as it's not game-breaking (especially if you are aware of how it works) and we have other priorities at the moment.

 

[buck beach]

It doesn't look like a AND problem to me. Never happened something like that, not with the latest revision but I think never in AND history... CTD happens but definetly not black screens. That sounds to me more like a system failure or a hardware problem. Have you tried with some other program requiring a lot of resources from your pc?

This was driving me crazy, I found out it was my video card failing and like a big dummy ran out and bought a new one. Should have followed some online suggestions to check it inside the computer.

To make a long story short, I was about to install the new card but found that the inside of my computer was filthy, especially the video card's fan and heat sink. Ceaned it up and Civ ran like a charm.

Now I got to make a trip back to Best Buy and return the unopened GeForce GT 630 I like it but don't need it for whats on my computer and the $110. I get back will buy a lot of Sierra Nevada Pale Ale.

Thanks to you and Joseph II for the help.

Buck

 

[IPEX-731BA5DD06]

On my guilds remark, they HQ actually does receive a bonus, its just in the specials tab.

Another bug or change in game play I've noticed, is the withdrawal from battle when a unit is losing. Specifically when a my unit attacks, and the defender is forced to withdraw to survive, but MY unit ends up being the one who surrenders the battlefield. This has happened to both mounted and Pike units.

Previously, it was the near defeated defender, who withdrew from the battlefield, obviously the only exception to this is city defence for the last unit. On the open battlefield, it should be the defeated unit that withdraws from the field, not the successful units.

It has changed from previous SVN's where this happened.

 

[45°38'N-13°47'E]

On my guilds remark, they HQ actually does receive a bonus, its just in the specials tab. :red:

Another bug or change in game play I've noticed, is the withdrawal from battle when a unit is losing. Specifically when a my unit attacks, and the defender is forced to withdraw to survive, but MY unit ends up being the one who surrenders the battlefield. This has happened to both mounted and Pike units.

Previously, it was the near defeated defender, who withdrew from the battlefield, obviously the only exception to this is city defence for the last unit. On the open battlefield, it should be the defeated unit that withdraws from the field, not the successful units.

It has changed from previous SVN's where this happened.

Mmmm... I'll need to look but I've seen BOTH units withdrawing, which seems better to me. If you're not able to completely kill a unit, you could be stopped from gaining that plot, although the retreating unit cannot hold it.

 

[JosEPh_II]

This was driving me crazy, I found out it was my video card failing and like a big dummy ran out and bought a new one. Should have followed some online suggestions to check it inside the computer.

To make a long story short, I was about to install the new card but found that the inside of my computer was filthy, especially the video card's fan and heat sink. Ceaned it up and Civ ran like a charm.

Now I got to make a trip back to Best Buy and return the unopened GeForce GT 630 I like it but don't need it for whats on my computer and the $110. I get back will buy a lot of Sierra Nevada Pale Ale.

Thanks to you and Joseph II for the help.

Buck

You're Welcome buck.

It's a wonder what a bit of maintenance on these machines can do towards performance at times.

JosEPh

 

[Zorn]

A number of small nitpicks (v 661):

The bug that the predicted path for a goto order switches once you release the mouse is gone. However, now the goto order always uses a straight path, before it would use the tiles with the best defence modifiers.

The AI doesn`t defend it`s workers. If I move an unit next to a lone worker, it will not move away. It seems that the AI tries to move it, but gives the order too later, after the worker has spent his movement for the turn.

Finally, I notice that workers are aquiring experience. No harm in that, but strange.

 

[45°38'N-13°47'E]

A number of small nitpicks (v 661):

The bug that the predicted path for a goto order switches once you release the mouse is gone. However, now the goto order always uses a straight path, before it would use the tiles with the best defence modifiers.

The AI doesn`t defend it`s workers. If I move an unit next to a lone worker, it will not move away. It seems that the AI tries to move it, but gives the order too later, after the worker has spent his movement for the turn.

Doesn't happen to me, but will look into it.

Finally, I notice that workers are aquiring experience. No harm in that, but strange.

I know, it's something imported from C2C a while ago but it's not intended to work in AND2. It does no harm anyway. It's simply something displayed that has no effect so far.