Are people more negative/angry/depressed/etc online because being online is a negative experience?

[Narz]

Alot of people all irritable online. I noticed it in others 1st (of course) and then in myself.

Some might assume it's just humanity's true dissatisfied nature shining thru the medium. But maybe a large part of the answer is that the experience of life mediated thru a screen is inherently dissatisfying (even more than RL). Obviously using the internet is convenient & easy, playing a card game online vs. IRL is much faster & all players can join w/o leaving their homes (or w/ turn based games they don't even have to ever be in the same time-space either). Or consider this forum, a bulletin board format in many ways superior to bantering w/ a limited group of friends in real time.

Anyway, now I'm not so sure of my original conviction.

Also, while I'm high, would you rather live on an Island w/ 10 other random people (all physical/safety needs met) for one year or on an Island w/ no other humans but access not only to the Internet but a staff of helpers who could help you research and connect with most anything & anyone (within reason, you still have to convince Tom Brody to chat back w/ you as in normal life) and they'd virtual-chat w/ you at your convivence (again within reason, they're not genies, they could all be asleep or busy, consider them on a 9-5 type of schedule for you), also all physical/safety needs met?

Lets say for six months.

I'd choose the 1st but if you threw in some $ and really amazing remote helpers

Also, I'm convinced again of my original query. I think being online is generally a negative for social life, maybe within moderation it's ok. Maybe people w/ moderate internet usage (outside of work lets say) are healthier mentally than those w/ more severe use.

 

[amadeus]

1. Good argument against drug use.

2. I’m no less irritable offline.

3. I already live on an island with more than ten random humans. Overrated.​

 

[Moriarte]

I’d venture a guess that people are inherently the same both online and offline. There is code of conduct offline and one can get slapped for speaking their mind or expressing themselves in an overly negative way. Internet appears to be full of strangers though, so in absence of cultural limitations some people express their true nature and true worry more often when cruising online. Online experience mirrors our real world, with extra considerations, such as I mentioned above. Lots of people Are depressed outside their online interactions.

 

[amadeus]

To put a positive spin on the post by @Moriarte there is in some respects a liberation from cultural norms that discourage the expression of some negative feelings.

I find the idea of being too restrictive offline to be counterproductive; expressions can be made tactfully and I feel decisions are made better by the sharing of information.

I could be wrong about all this, and I have a lot of self-doubt as to whether some of my thoughts are shared in my peer group or if I am an outlier that thinks almost completely differently from them.

 

[Cutlass]

Not all the people who spend much of their lives online have nothing better going on in their lives. But a high percentage of people with nothing better going on in their lives spend their time online.

 

[El_Machinae]

I think the world has just gotten harder. I was incredibly more optimistic a decade ago, and was just arguing with people because they were wrong, and not because I was scared.

Ten random people would be terrible! There's a chance I'd only share a language with a couple of them, which means Lord of the Flies in ten days, flat. Assuming you didn't mean that, but a less-random assortment of people, I think I'd prefer that to being utterly alone. It still ends up Lord of the Flies, probably, but at least we could make a video log or something and have a great 'found footage' movie named after us. The coat-hanger murders, probably.

 

[Synobun]

It is difficult to be online when you are busy, and it's well known that stagnancy breeds malaise. While not everyone who is Very Online is going to fit into that mold, the people who rotate the same websites and spend hours every day on end going through the routine are probably not doing well mentally. People who aren't doing well mentally are susceptible to irritability and hostility. No judgement from me; I am, after all, also Very Online, and regularly go through periods where I don't care overly much about antagonizing people.

I would choose to be alone on an island. I'm already isolated from others IRL, so it wouldn't be much a change of pace. In fact, the terms of your hypothetical may actually be better than my current life.

 

[Lemon Merchant]

My luck I would wind up on an island with a bunch of psychologists. I can't see that going well, since we're all a collective bunch of loons.

We'd just analyze each other to death until one was left and could claim victory, but no support for his/her new theory.

 

[amadeus]

@El_Machinae, on the bright side, being college-educated and having been brought up in a first world system of medicine would leave you at both a distinct physical and intellectual advantage.

I suspect in some anarchic island situation you could “pick off” the other nine relatively easily.

Kind a crossover of Gilligan’s Island and The Running Man.

 

[El_Machinae]

"Wow, Maryanne sure makes good soup!"

"Yeah, but I am going to miss her, honestly"

 

[amadeus]

I would choose to be alone on an island. I'm already isolated from others IRL, so it wouldn't be much a change of pace. In fact, the terms of your hypothetical may actually be better than my current life.

Pretty much this for me. A year off with just the internet, and a team of researchers? I’d gladly quit my job today and get a full compliment of staff. I’d also outsource said staff and collect the proceeds from the contracts, putting me in a favorable position when it comes time to transition back into a hopefully post-coronavirus safe environment.

Really, there’s nothing to lose. Also, better island weather.

 

[Narz]

1. Good argument against drug use.​

And yet 1st poster on thread & top engager on thread...

To put a positive spin on the post by @Moriarte there is in some respects a liberation from cultural norms that discourage the expression of some negative feelings.

Isn't that an overall good cultural norm (within reason)? Also I'd say my real life acquaintances know way more of my insecurities/dark side than people online. Whereas online I both overshare (since I'm projecting to many, that includes people who don't know me like that) and undershare (rarely take time out to engage w/ specific individuals I am/could be close with (except ones known or ones I want to know IRL to schedule RL stuff)

Ten random people would be terrible! There's a chance I'd only share a language with a couple of them, which means Lord of the Flies in ten days, flat.

I hadn't considered the language thing, I should've specified they all speak your language (lets say gender balanced & no children for simplicity).

As for lord of the flies, I doubt it, since all food/comfort needs already met so there wouldn't be as dire a need for rigid hierarchy & violence.

I would likely go w/ the 10 people even if no guarantee of an English speaker (according to Google on a pure random sampling I'd get average 2 English speakers). Since survival & baseline comfort needs would already be met it would be a unique opportunity to learn about other cultures/languages, who knows after 6 months we might even invent some new words, a mini language made from the hodegpodge of various languages people spoke, that would go viral.

Assuming you didn't mean that, but a less-random assortment of people, I think I'd prefer that to being utterly alone. It still ends up Lord of the Flies, probably, but at least we could make a video log or something and have a great 'found footage' movie named after us. The coat-hanger murders, probably.

Assuming everyone knows the stipulations of the situation (needs met, there for six months, will then go back to society & presumably be charged for any murders) I don't see why it would have to go so dark.

 

[The_J]

https://www.healthline.com/health-news/social-media-use-increases-depression-and-loneliness

[...]
A new study concludes that there is in fact a causal link between the use of social media and negative effects on well-being, primarily depression and loneliness. The study was published in the Journal of Social and Clinical Psychology.

“What we found overall is that if you use less social media, you are actually less depressed and less lonely, meaning that the decreased social media use is what causes that qualitative shift in your well-being,” said Jordyn Young, a co-author of the paper and a senior at the University of Pennsylvania.
[...]

I guess it partially also boils down that while you're online, you're simply also alone, and it's not a good replacement.

There's also another effect, which I can't find right now, which is about your perception of the world online. Everyone only posts about how great their life is, which is not the truth, and you see your life as it is, which makes you miserable in comparison.

... ah, wait, got it:
https://medium.com/the-mission/how-...omparison-anxiety-and-depression-538e4c87b963

Through social media we have a continual window into the lives of friends, pseudo-friends, and celebrities. And what we see is not some unvarnished peek into their world but a highly idealized image that they present. We see only the most exciting images from their vacations, the happy faces of their friends, and children, accounts of their continual self-improvement, the fascinating people they are meeting, the great causes and projects they are involved in, the example of success in their endeavors.

Let's also directly plug in a scientific study:
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC5985443/

Consistent with hypotheses, technology-based social comparison and feedback-seeking were associated with depressive symptoms.

 

[Zardnaar]

My luck I would wind up on an island with a bunch of psychologists. I can't see that going well, since we're all a collective bunch of loons.

We'd just analyze each other to death until one was left and could claim victory, but no support for his/her new theory.

Move here it's an island and chronically short of psychologists.
I use 2 forums and avoid social media. Used FB during lockdown which was new for me.

Mostly just hang out in private chats for D&D. Avoid social media for your sanity imho.

 

[H4run]

Move here it's an island and chronically short of psychologists.

If LM moved to NZ as immigrant would it shook the job vacancies in NZ? Or the housing and property price? Why not give the psychologist job to the local? Should every nation and its citizen mind their own business? Or Lemon able to integrate better than a drunken kiwi or a Chinese?

Sorry to drag it here, I just found a perfect timing and I don't want to miss it, if not I will lose my sleep this night.

 

[Zardnaar]

If LM moved to NZ as immigrant would it shook the job vacancies in NZ? Or the housing and property price? Why not give the psychologist job to the local? Should every nation and its citizen mind their own business? Or Lemon able to integrate better than a drunken kiwi or a Chinese?

Sorry to drag it here, I just found a perfect timing and I don't want to miss it, if not I will lose my sleep this night.

I'm not opposed at all to skilled migrants we're short of and I don't care where they come from.

You're the one putting words in my mouth.

I'm opposed to cheap labour the employers can exploit. You can still get here if you're a health professional.

Just be aware cost if living is crazy.

 

[amadeus]

@The_J, what do you read into those studies? I have a Facebook account, now dormant going on almost a decade and I have a twitter basically to follow news updates and look at pictures from other hobbyists. I stopped using the former because Facebook isn't all that popular in Japan and honestly the stuff people put on there is just ridiculous. I'd rather come here and look at stuff.

Isn't that an overall good cultural norm (within reason)? Also I'd say my real life acquaintances know way more of my insecurities/dark side than people online. Whereas online I both overshare (since I'm projecting to many, that includes people who don't know me like that) and undershare (rarely take time out to engage w/ specific individuals I am/could be close with (except ones known or ones I want to know IRL to schedule RL stuff)

I don't mean revealing the particulars of insecurities, at least not in any case where it wouldn't make sense contextually. I'm talking about when it interferes with day-to-day stuff; I've had a few days recently at work where I've taken some anxiety medication and just told my coworker just to give me a few minutes to settle down and I'd be alright after that. I could have chosen not to reveal that information, but then it would have interfered with work negatively for the both of us. So, from my perspective, the optimum solution is to state only what I believe to be the relevant information and then what can be done productively thereafter. Does this break a cultural norm? Most likely.

 

[The_J]

@The_J, what do you read into those studies?

I'm not qualified in that area, but... first, I'd say that social media is like any other tool, it depends on how you use it. It seems that most people are not using it in a proper way, and that results in unhappiness. The effect seems to be relatively clear from the studies, that longer use seems to make most people unhappy. It might be due to multiple causes, like neglecting actual social contacts, or by the psychological impact which the manipulation machinery has on you, like being highly addictive and feeding you only content which you supposedly like. "Supposedly", because if you end up going down some nutty rabbit hole, the algorithms will feed you more of that, certainly not making you happier. And there is the mentioned jealousy factor for actually nice things (seeing how well your friends are doing).
All of that is done intentionally, but I'm not sure if you can radically change it, without people losing interest. Which the companies would certainly not let happen.

For some RL content: I'd be certainly happier if I could move my phone calls right now to an in-person setting, even if the content of the calls does not change. I'm sick of not seeing my friends. Pretty sure some people have that with social networks too, but the addiction factor keeps them bound to the screen, instead of going for RL interactions.

There's the netflix docu "the social dilema", which talks about the addictivenss, and the content of the docu is in general quite okay, IMHO.


Related comic, to not make this too bland right now:

Spoiler :

https://www.smbc-comics.com/comic/the-pleasure-button

 

[AmazonQueen]

Pretty much this for me. A year off with just the internet, and a team of researchers? I’d gladly quit my job today and get a full compliment of staff. I’d also outsource said staff and collect the proceeds from the contracts, putting me in a favorable position when it comes time to transition back into a hopefully post-coronavirus safe environment.

Really, there’s nothing to lose. Also, better island weather.

Its regrettable that most lighthouses are automated rather than having keepers nowadays. That would've been a good job.

 

[Quintillus]

I would say that being online can be a negative experience. The_J did a good job covering social media sites. I'll only add that generally, the more I have going on in real life, the less time I spend online, and most of the time what I have going on in real life is good. There are rewarding interactions online as well, but when I have more events in real life, it's the least rewarding online interactions I'm likely to reduce first.

Which supports what Cutlass said.

I also agree with The_J that I'd prefer virtual conversations to be in person. My corona-recovered friend and I meet up in person to play games that could be played over the Internet. Why? It's just more fun. Real time conversation, breaks for ice cream, the ease of shifting the balance of our time between the game, conversation, and perhaps watching a movie. No technical difficulties with hearing each other. It's the same reason I make a point of making a trip to visit some out-of-state friends every year; it's just a better experience reconnecting in person.

So, despite preferring to hang out with people I know than people I don't know, I'd take the 10 random people on an island. Chances are I'd become pretty good friends with at least a few of them over time. It would probably be a lot more fun exploring the island with other people, too. The solo alternative would be okay for a few weeks as I had an island to explore, but after that I'd run into the same problems I have in real life this year.