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[BtS] Diversica

Discussion in 'Civ4 - Graphics Modpacks' started by mamba, Aug 24, 2007.

  1. njohns99

    njohns99 Chieftain

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    Oh, man, that is totally awesome.

    You, sir, have made my day.

    Edit: Ha! Even better that 3.13 was released a day later.
     
  2. mamba

    mamba Deity

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    Updated to 3.13, either get the xml changes only, or the new version (if you want the new units right away)
     
  3. mamba

    mamba Deity

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    Next War incorporated into Diversica.

    It is somewhere between Next War and an updated (to 3.13) Expanded Epic Game

    I too removed the new civilizations and leaders and kept the standard main menu.

    I too did not include the changed / additional Next War screens and removed the League of Nations (which in turn replaced the U.N.).

    The default Music is back in 3.13 anyway (I assume, the xml files did not differ in that regard), so there was no need to change anything.

    And here is where I differ from EEG :

    I turned everything modular (where possible). I did not change anything about the buildings (EEG speaks about fixing some bugs, when comparing the xml between NW and 3.13 I did not notice anything out of the ordinary, I assume they were fixed in 3.13).
    In theory the tech xml should be modular too, but when making it modular, the game crashed at the end of the first turn each time (I assume when I should have chosen a tech), so I kept it as it is. If anyone knows how to overcome this, let me know.

    I 'updated' the Next War definitions which were identical to BtS 3.0x definitions but now differ from the 3.13 definitions to the 3.13 definitions (as things are modular, I simply did not integrate the Next War definitions, so the standard ones will be used).

    I did not include the Next War specific Python code (this affects screens mostly).

    So in essence this is regular CIV 4 with the technologies and units of the Next War mod.
     
  4. Uhlan

    Uhlan Chieftain

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    Mamba,

    Just wanted to say I really enjoy your mod. A collections of the awesome graphics packages is something I've been trying to do for days and just couldn't get my mind around it.

    Your efforts are much appreciated... and worth my first post.;)

    There are some wonderful efforts here, and nice to see many of the authors/creators are working together. Be nice to see a great combo graphics mod such as yours combined with an equally well written flavor mod.

    Again, thanks for the efforts and to all those artists out there that make it possible to do so.
     
  5. 0R4NG3

    0R4NG3 Prince

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    You're the best Mamba!!
     
  6. njohns99

    njohns99 Chieftain

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    It's awesome that you were able to fit in Next War with this. What's next?
     
  7. mamba

    mamba Deity

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    Thanks for the praise everybody, glad you like it ;)

    I don't yet know what will be next, I now have integrated everything I thought of originally. I will of course continue to add more unit graphics, the rest remains to be seen.

    There are three things I will take a look at (no promises about integrating any of them, but they go from most likely to least likely).

    A more expanded gameplay (which I basically started with by integrating Next War), along the lines of Extra, which is adding much of the additional units etc. from the various official (i.e. included with CIV, Warlords and BtS) mods to the main game.

    In this regard I might also start to add a few units and technologies which are not included in any official mod if I think they are worth adding. I am not a follower of bigger is better, so I won't be adding 50 civs, 20 religions and 30 new resources just because they are out there (imo 20 new religions would actually ruin the religion related diplomacy options, the other two are simply pointless). There isn't really much I am thinking about in this regard yet, I am thinking about adding Dreadnoughts (the ship class, not the Next War tank) and maybe some future units and techs (i.e. expand on Next War).

    I might also adjust Next War somewhat (revert some things back to the regular definitions or at least get closer to them again).

    Introducing unit formations along the lines of Regiments. I am not sure whether this actually is a good idea (performance wise) and how easy they would be to unplug (or how much effort it would be to integrate them in the first place).

    And finally I like the idea of Influence Driven War, I am not at all sure whether I will add this though. I set myself a limitation of not changing any game dlls in my mod (only xml and minor changes to Python) and I believe this mod does so (haven't taken a look yet). If it does, it won't get added, if it doesn't, it is worth taking a closer look.

    I won't be including changed dlls for several reasons
    - they introduce major changes (exposing new functions to Python or introducing additional tags) which in turn get reflected in major xml and / or Python changes
    - they are not unpluggable (either they get used in xml or Python or they don't, but you have to change both if you want to unplug them again, so I would need two sets of files, one with the new functionality / tags and one without, which would be a major pain)
    - I cannot fix anything that might be wrong in the dll
    - I cannot integrate different dll changes (unless I do so at the C/C++ source code level, which I certainly won't), so I would have to pick one over all others to base my mod on (unlike Python and xml)
    - I no longer am in full control of my mod (e.g. I could not have released an update for 3.13 without having an updated dll first)
    - I would not be compatible with a new patch until the dll is updated (0.50 was compatible, it just didn't reflect some of the changes - where I had different definitions in my xml)

    So anything requiring a different dll is out, everything requiring large Python changes is out (my Python skills are nonexistant). Anything requiring xml changes 'only' is potentially in, but there is nothing which I already know I will add.

    Phew, long response without actually giving much of an answer ;)
     
  8. 0R4NG3

    0R4NG3 Prince

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    You could add 20 religions if they will only be available with the "choose religion" option on. This way there will only ever be 7 religions at a time, but at least you can choose from 20. I don't know though if it is possible to do this.
     
  9. mamba

    mamba Deity

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    This was just an example I made up, not something I intend to do.

    I failt to see the point of having 20 different religions with only 7 or so in each game though. I prefer to have these 7 each time over having some random 7 out of 20, but maybe that is just me ;)
     
  10. Tirse

    Tirse Chieftain

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    First, thank you for all the work – great job, well worth it for me to register here just to say that. Combining all those graphics into one mod is a real help. However, there are some issues I seem unable to fix (BtS 3.13):

    Plain Diversica 051 (very minor stuff):
    - civilopedia only - missing textures for Japanese rifleman, cavalry (rider only), grenadier (grenade excluded) and cannon (crewman only) seem missing – all I see are black figurines (creepy stuff). Units placed through WorldBuilder look normal.
    - civilopedia only – persian rifleman lacks everything but the icon (no model, no description). The unit can be placed through WorldBuilder, I haven’t checked actual game.

    Next War (the real issue):
    - applying Next War addon totally messes up the game for me: paths leading to certain techs are missing, so all the NW futuristic techs have nothing in “requirements” box, on advanced start they are buyable from the very beginning (in theory, that is). The same applies to some of the regular techs; meditation has “computers” and “laser” as requirements, while “laser” leads to meditation only, “hydroponics” leads to theology etc. This results in CTD as soon as in-game research screen is about to show up. Nothing of the sort happens in regular Diversica.
    In addition, the “dawn of man” text appearing on regular starts displays funny message about it being 4000BC and collapse of world government. Not a game – breaker, but still.

    As I’m a total modding newbie, it IS very much possible I messed up with Next War (I merely copied the addon file into /Mods directory, overwriting when needed... everything looked as it should be). Seeing as nobody else reported NW problem, it’s probably just me, but I did all I could think of (including reinstalling the game), and nothing. Would be grateful for some help.

    Once again, thanks for all the work on the mod.
     
  11. 0R4NG3

    0R4NG3 Prince

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    I don't really mind either way. The point however would be that it would be more historically accurate, plus as a player you would be able to choose the religion you want. Obviously this is all cosmetic, but I suppose so is having civ specific graphics ;)
     
  12. mamba

    mamba Deity

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    I usually check with WorldBuilder, haven't checked civilopedia before. All japanese units are fine for me though. The persian rifleman indeed lacks everything. The funny thing is that someone else today noted the same thing (not related to my mod).

    This appears to be due to corrupted files, replacing the kfm line of the Persian rifleman with <KFM>Art/Units/Janissary/Janissary.kfm</KFM> fixes it for me.

    Strangely enough, the files were binary identical, no idea what causes this. I guess I will go through my mod and remove all kfms which are identical to the standard ones just to make sure this isn't true for other units as well.

    I guess you downloaded the bugged version I put out initially and silently updated (that is what I meant when I wrote modular techs do not work properly). Please download the current version and delete the NextWar directory under Diversica/Assets/Modules before extracting it. That should fix it.
     
  13. Uhlan

    Uhlan Chieftain

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    Mamba,

    As an ardent fan of your graphics combo skills, I make no presumptions about the choices you make for these particular combinations. I appreciate any and all attempts by so many to make the wonderful units that grace your mod. I make no pretentions about being an artist of any skill, so please take my comments for what they are worth.

    However, that said, I have noticed that several nationalities look more like National sports teams in their dress (Israelis) than they did historically. The figures are nice, but the dress, well... Maccabee's were a nice choice, but what about the famed "clubmen"? I assume you included these as no other alternative was available.

    I mean, counter those mentioned with the Ottoman units... for an example.

    I am sort of a "curmudgeon" when it comes to historicity (<--- I like this word :)) I have even noted that certain artists make their particular units look like something out of "Warhammer"... Knights with over-sized shoulder pads :)lol: ) etc... This I can handle as it is a matter of "style" than anything else.

    One particular objection is the choice of the 20th cen German inf in light grey with what appears to nazi armbands. A much better "Wehrmacht" unit is readily available I believe. I think there is even a really nice "Falschirmjager" floating (er, no pun intended) out there in the ether.

    I think the americans should have the "Minuteman Unit" as their musketeer. There are also a few cultures sadly burdened with the american cav unit still.

    Then there are such gems as the "Roman" musketmen, fantastic. Though I think the Romans would still be using the ancient S.P.Q.R. flag as opposed to the italian flag. That symbol, well, would belong to the Italian civ, a different entity entirely.

    Maybe these questions should be directed to the makers of the units. I just wanted to express my opinion a bit as to your choices. No offense meant.

    I know you have little to do with the actual art (pardon if I'm wrong on that account), but I thought the intention of the mod was to be as historically accurate (as was possible) with the units based on their culture. I mean I understand that a few "extrapolations" were needed to fill the ages beyond which the particular civ existed, but still. I hope some of the gaps may be filled as well, as their appears to be much less to identify the cultures past the renaissance.

    Anyway, pardon my criticisms, your work here is very much appreciated.

    Keep up the wonderful work!!
     
  14. njohns99

    njohns99 Chieftain

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    Ermmm, something's causing my game to CTD once I hit a certain turn. Not sure if it's the mod (Next War Version). Seems like I can reload, play one turn further than before, and I CTD again. I'm fairly certain this is not a MAF.

    Anyone else getting this?

    So far I have unloaded Blue Marble, still CTD.

    Hold on: Mamba, when did you update the Next War thing? Shortly after you loaded the original?
     
  15. mamba

    mamba Deity

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    I agree, for historical accuracy the Israel units aren't a perfect match ;)

    If they bug you enough, you can always delete the entire civilization. Personally I do not worry about accuracy much (if they are accurate, this generally is better though imo), I use the units I like and the Isreali do look sufficiently different for me to include them.

    There will always be units out there which are not included, either because I didn't get around yet or because I do not even know they exist. The former is true for the german Paratrooper (who is in the next release), the latter for the Minuteman (who now will also be in the next release).

    As to the nazi Infantry, if I find a suitable replacement, the unit will not feature any nazi symbols, my Germany civ isn't nazi Germany and imo should not feature the swastika.

    The fact that the american cavalry is still used by so many civilizations is something which bothers me as well, it just looks too american ;)

    This might actually still happen, as I used modern flags for all civilizations it appeared odd to me to not do so for Rome (you might have said the same about Carthage, Celts and Vikings for example). But with the addition of the new Bakuel Roman modern units (not yet in), it would imo be odd to still use the italian flag for Rome, so Rome and Italy will probably be separated into two civs now (if only there were a decent Italy civ to base Italy on).

    you are right on that one, the flags and buttons are my own, I only made some changes to maybe a handful units though (the HRE units are reskins of the Germanics redux units).

    The intention was to not have as many identical units running around, historical accuracy being a plus, not a must (generally speaking, sometimes I even might favor a non-historical unit over a historical one).

    With the modern age, the units of different nations did start to look very similar (all in camouflage, the colorful musketeers and cuirassiers a thing of the past), so I guess in that day and age they will always look similar, that they do before is mostly due to a lack of different units (e.g. danrell made lots of medieval units but almost no newer units) which is why the variety is lower later on.

    Thanks, I will.
     
  16. mamba

    mamba Deity

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    Chances are it is, please send me your savegame.

    Probably, as CTDs are usually unit related, whenever that unit is build, the game crashes due to me having made a mistake in the xml. So others will get it, but it is random as it depends on the civs you play with and the units they build.

    Well, if you made it past the first turn, you have the right version ;)
     
  17. Penitent

    Penitent Pacifist Warmonger

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    I've been using Regiments and Ethnic Diversity, but since it stopped working with the new patch I've looked around and found this. I need to download Diversica and see what the units look like, but I might end up preferring Diversica for the lack of gameplay changes.

    Could you upload some mirrors for "Diversica 0.51 for BtS 3.13"? Filefront hates me and has an atrocious download speed.
     
  18. njohns99

    njohns99 Chieftain

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    Hey, I downloaded the button fix. It stopped crashing. I'm all good now!
     
  19. mamba

    mamba Deity

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    Strange, nothing changed in the button fix should have been able to cause a crash in the first place. It has been that way since day 1 and no crashes ever were due to this.
     
  20. Tirse

    Tirse Chieftain

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    A stealthy update, huh? Well, I’m all happy it wasn’t me making silly errors. Enabling NextWar really made my day. Thank you. BTW, while browsing through all the new stuff in World Builder I noticed that German Marine displays infamous “three red blobs” (in WB, this is NOT civilopedia only). Not idea what would happen if someone actually builds the unit.

    Concerning recent discussion I second Ulhan on subject of national flags – in some cases it makes more sense than others, but overall effect is somehow related to fotball crowd. There seems to be serious shortage of modern armor; I wonder if distibuting existing ones among all the civs (just as you did with regular tanks) wouldn’t look better than everyone riding an Abrams. I saw (within your mod) some T-72/T-80 in various color schemes, M60, Merkava, danrell recently released some recolored versions (together with a beautiful Dreadnought battleship). The same goes for gunships. Well, just a thought.
    Ah, and German WWII infantry by bernie14:
    http://forums.civfanatics.com/downloads.php?do=file&id=5992

    One real balancing issue with Poland: it seems that your version of Poland is based on the Warlords version of “Polish Empire” mod, with hussar replacing knights. This worked OK in Warlords, but after BtS was released, hussar was moved to replace cuirassier (and toned down a little bit). This is not only historically correct, but necessary for balancing reasons, as existing hussar (knight level) is so powerful it actually obsoletes cuirassiers (at least as long as there are any pikemen around). I know this change was implemented in BtS version of the mod, so the unit is readily aviable.

    Well, that’s so much of me trying to be helpful. Once again, thank you for your hard (and much appreciated) work.
     

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