Bye Bye Tik Tok Yay?

[caketastydelish]

Yeaaaaaah, I'm not entirely sure why you think this is a good thing, but heyo.

After giving the Germans and Japanese a firm spank on the ass neither have had an atrocious foreign policy ever since so who is to say it was wrong?

 

[Zardnaar]

Chinas the closest thing to an actual Nazi state atm. USA may be on that road but China built it.

 

[caketastydelish]

China commits human rights violations and atrocities to their Muslim minority population on a regular basis and has for some time. But SJW's give the Chinese a free pass when they do it just because "it's their culture", they're not white, and the government is communist which is favorable to them.

 

[Kyriakos]

Let's not venture so deeply into the fantastical that we actually believe the US is now hostile to China due to the plight of the muslims in its poorest and least significant region.
This is about economic wars, and a long time in the making.

 

[caketastydelish]

Let's not venture so deeply into the fantastical that we actually believe the US is now hostile to China due to the plight of the muslims in its poorest and least significant region.
This is about economic wars, and a long time in the making.

I never said that's why the US is hostile to China, obviously those are two completely separate issues.

 

[Gorbles]

China commits human rights violations and atrocities to their Muslim minority population on a regular basis and has for some time. But SJW's give the Chinese a free pass when they do it just because "it's their culture", they're not white, and the government is communist which is favorable to them.

I'm not giving China a free pass. Never have. If you have to invent arguments for other posters and rely on WW2-era jingoism as a defense for the suppression of free speech, maybe your argument just isn't as well thought-out as you think it is.

This thread is about the US and TikTok.

 

[Zardnaar]

I'm not giving China a free pass. Never have. If you have to invent arguments for other posters and rely on WW2-era jingoism as a defense for the suppression of free speech, maybe your argument just isn't as well thought-out as you think it is.

This thread is about the US and TikTok.

You never condemn them either. They're not even communist and are the closest thing to a modern Nazi state.

Tibet as well, social credit and s totalitarian state either a closed internet.

USA fsn ne bad, Chihas always awful it's built into their government. USA occasionally does something right. Probably not under Trump.

 

[Kyriakos]

I don't agree that China has to be closer to a nazi state than other candidates. It is likely closer to a nazi state than the US, yes, but the world has many other countries.
For starters, China hasn't been to war in many, many decades.

 

[Gorbles]

You never condemn them either.

Wrong. If you're going to pop in to make your thread about your personal issues with other posters, please don't moan when people then "ruin" them. Can't have it both ways.

Again, the thread - the one you started, is about the US and TikTok. Not about condemning China for completely unrelated things. If this was a thread about China and I said "you don't condemn the US enough", I figure I know what you'd call it

 

[Zardnaar]

Wrong. If you're going to pop in to make your thread about your personal issues with other posters, please don't moan when people then "ruin" them. Can't have it both ways.

Again, the thread - the one you started, is about the US and TikTok. Not about condemning China for completely unrelated things. If this was a thread about China and I said "you don't condemn the US enough", I figure I know what you'd call it

Why let crappy regimes like China have a mass media backdoor into the US or anywhere?

They indirectly helped Trump get elected and outright made it blatant post election.

 

[Zardnaar]

Some forums I post in have just banned linking to Twitter/X, Meta, and anything linked to CCP.

 

[Gorbles]

Why let crappy regimes like China have a mass media backdoor into the US or anywhere?

They indirectly helped Trump get elected and outright made it blatant post election.

Because it's not actually proven that China does have a "mass media backdoor", beyond "China is a government and the company related to TikTok has ties to it". If this is the qualification for a "mass media backdoor", every country outside the US should ban every single app made by a US company.

If anyone would like to claim "but the US doesn't do questionable things with tech", I direct them to (among many other examples):

Apple–FBI encryption dispute - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

Sure, sure. Definitely not.

r.e. "indirectly helping Trump get elected", have a read of this: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chine...interfere_in_the_2024_United_States_elections. Beyond using TikTok, none of what China was accused of has anything to do with TikTok. They also used Twitter. They'll use any public form of social media.

If you want to talk about the things that "indirectly helped Trump get elected", there are a ton. Shall we ban them all? Going to be tricky considering one of the factors in getting Trump elected were the Democrats themselves.

Anytime you justify the suppression of speech via government intervention, you need to be very, very careful. I'm not opposed to the entire concept (after all, there's no such thing as "truly free speech"), but banning an entire social media platform "because China" is the definition of not being careful.

 

[Farm Boy]

is something you use on a playground

International lethal force is very similar to playground fights. Chanting cheering circle around the combatants and everything. The more you understand about the latter, the easier to understand the former it is.

 

[Klaus Hergersheimer]

But at the same time I don't think it's at all comparable to the 1950s-era McCarthyist Red Scare. No one's saying "turn in your granddaughter for using TikTok" or warning about neighbors being foreign spies. The problem is that from a sober-minded realpolitik standpoint, if a country has potentially vast amounts of knowledge about half of one of its rivals' citizens, that's an awful lot of potential leverage in either influence or targeted coercion.

Please explain this reasoning to me. I don't get it.

Like, what does it matter if someone "collects data" on me or whatever? Anyone who witnesses me doing my regular TikTok antics in-person is doing that anyway.
What, are these TikTok users scouting out missile silos in Montana or wherever? I can understand it being restricted on government-issued devices but not private devices.

 

[Lexicus]

Why let crappy regimes like China have a mass media backdoor into the US or anywhere?

"Congress shall make no law....abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press" seems pretty cleae to me.

 

[Farm Boy]

"FIRE!"

"Won't somebody shoot that <slur>?"

Seems the public safety argument is reasonably strong.

Edit: But nah, the first amendment is complicated as hell once life gets going.

Why not use this one, as a totes random example, for how things build? Where do you think the speech leaves its foundation of bedrock grievances, absolutely what the first amendment was written to protect as public speech, and where does it become incitement, the crime?

Spoiler :

 

[Sommerswerd]

American History X was an excellent movie.

 

[Moriarte]

Please explain this reasoning to me. I don't get it.

Like, what does it matter if someone "collects data" on me or whatever? Anyone who witnesses me doing my regular TikTok antics in-person is doing that anyway.
What, are these TikTok users scouting out missile silos in Montana or wherever? I can understand it being restricted on government-issued devices but not private devices.

On a personal note, I am far less worried with Chinese corps gathering my data than their Western counterparts doing the same. The Chinese can't do much with my data, I am outside their sphere of influence. There is a great firewall between us, I am not even welcome into their virtual kingdom. They don't advertise & sell me stuff, I do not care if they assign some social points towards my avatar or put me in any other pigeon hole, they can't get me in person to prosecute if they chose to. We simply don't intersect online or irl, me and China. Western corps & governments on the other hand... where do I begin. To keep it short, I am in the pocket of the latter group financially, sometimes locationally and in terms of various laws. Constantly watched over with most of the data gathered and stored safely for the day they need it. Nope, this China surveillance thing is not resonating here at all.

 

[Lexicus]

"FIRE!"

"Won't somebody shoot that <slur>?"

Seems the public safety argument is reasonably strong.

If your argument is that posting a video on Tiktok, regardless of its actual content, is as dangerous to public safety as either of these examples, then make that argument, don't just insinuate it.

Why not use this one, as a totes random example, for how things build? Where do you think the speech leaves its foundation of bedrock grievances, absolutely what the first amendment was written to protect as public speech, and where does it become incitement, the crime?

The spoiler is just blank space on my end so idk what you're talking about, but assuming you posted some kind of inflammatory/dangerous tiktok video, then your argument is as dumb as someone saying we need to ban all books because you can read dangerous stuff in a chemistry textbook

Edit: oh it finally loaded or whatever, not watching it, don't care, boundaries of incitement are irrelevant to the actual topic of discussion here

If the US is just going to ban entire social media apps on incredibly flimsy national security pretexts then there is no "free society" worth protecting from scary Chinese influences in any case.

 

[Farm Boy]

I extend you back a reciprocal level of effort.