Shouldn't that be "make it so"?
Anyway, that two ayes and three abstensions, so will do.
CBob02 Jaguar Conquest
- Thread starter CommandoBob
- Start date
Shouldn't that be "make it so"?
Anyway, that two ayes and three abstensions, so will do.First off, the save: View attachment CBob02_BC_350.SAV
Preflight: switch citizen from tobacco to irrigated plains in AzAz--gets us 8 spt, or 2-turn jags
IBT:
-Rome jag>jag (5);JSoR jag>jag (5); Desert City rax>worker (4)
-Ottomans build Oracle
1:---
IBT:
-RoP w/Maya comes up for renewal--cancel
-AzAz jag>jag (2); HH settler>settler (5); ItW jag>galley (10); SnA jag>galley (6)
-America starts MoM; England starts GW; Maya starts MoM
2:
-settle Cowtown, start worker (10)
-send 15-jag stack toward Karakorum--will attack next turn
IBT:
-Maya settle Quirigua near incense
-FFC jag>jag (4)
3:
-commence attack on Karakorum--kill 3 spears, lose 2 jags, 4 jags retreat; raze Karakorum
-notice Maya are getting too powerful, so start planning war with them; investigate Chichen Itza and see this:
IBT: AzAz jag>jag (2); Oasisville worker>rax (forgot to record)
4:---
IBT: DC worker>jag (8)
5:
-declare on Maya
-MA w/England for 264 gold; MA w/America for 276 gold; MA w/Mongols and 100 gold for peace
-commence attack on Quirigua; kill 1 spear, lose 4 jags (!), 1 jag retreats
IBT: AzAz jag>jag (2); JSoR jag>jag (5)
6: start gathering stack near Chichen Itza
IBT:
-barb warrior kills jag and 3 slaves!
-HH settler>settler (6); FFC jag>jag (4)
-settler South Cowtown, start worker (10)
7:---
IBT:
-Mongols tell us to remove or declare--we remove
-AzAz jag>jag (2); Rome jag>jag (8); SnA galley>jag (3)
8: jag dies attacking redlined barb!!! I think it was the same barb that killed the other jag and the slaves
IBT:---
9:---
IBT:
-AzAz jag>jag (2)
-SnA and JSoR riot
10:
-raise lux to 30
-settler Cancerville near 3 tobacco tiles south of AzAz; start rax (10)
Notes:
1. Semper varium et mutabile RNG!
2. I've got 23 jags near Chichen Itza, and 2 JTs are heading their way (not from the garrison, though; these are regs, not vets). Given the size of the garrison and the city's 50% defensive bonus, we shouldn't attack with less than 30. Alternatively, we can hit some other cities first.
3. Chichen Itza, Copan, and Tikal are worth keeping ('Mids, spices, and gems respectively). Everything else can be razed unless we need more unit support.
4. I doubt we'll be able to wipe out the Maya before the alliances expire, but if we can, we shouldn't.
5. We'll probably need to hit England next.
Preflight: switch citizen from tobacco to irrigated plains in AzAz--gets us 8 spt, or 2-turn jags
IBT:
-Rome jag>jag (5);JSoR jag>jag (5); Desert City rax>worker (4)
-Ottomans build Oracle
1:---
IBT:
-RoP w/Maya comes up for renewal--cancel
-AzAz jag>jag (2); HH settler>settler (5); ItW jag>galley (10); SnA jag>galley (6)
-America starts MoM; England starts GW; Maya starts MoM
2:
-settle Cowtown, start worker (10)
-send 15-jag stack toward Karakorum--will attack next turn
IBT:
-Maya settle Quirigua near incense
-FFC jag>jag (4)
3:
-commence attack on Karakorum--kill 3 spears, lose 2 jags, 4 jags retreat; raze Karakorum
-notice Maya are getting too powerful, so start planning war with them; investigate Chichen Itza and see this:
IBT: AzAz jag>jag (2); Oasisville worker>rax (forgot to record)
4:---
IBT: DC worker>jag (8)
5:
-declare on Maya
-MA w/England for 264 gold; MA w/America for 276 gold; MA w/Mongols and 100 gold for peace
-commence attack on Quirigua; kill 1 spear, lose 4 jags (!), 1 jag retreats
IBT: AzAz jag>jag (2); JSoR jag>jag (5)
6: start gathering stack near Chichen Itza
IBT:
-barb warrior kills jag and 3 slaves!
-HH settler>settler (6); FFC jag>jag (4)
-settler South Cowtown, start worker (10)
7:---
IBT:
-Mongols tell us to remove or declare--we remove
-AzAz jag>jag (2); Rome jag>jag (8); SnA galley>jag (3)
8: jag dies attacking redlined barb!!! I think it was the same barb that killed the other jag and the slaves
IBT:---
9:---
IBT:
-AzAz jag>jag (2)
-SnA and JSoR riot
10:
-raise lux to 30
-settler Cancerville near 3 tobacco tiles south of AzAz; start rax (10)
Notes:
1. Semper varium et mutabile RNG!
2. I've got 23 jags near Chichen Itza, and 2 JTs are heading their way (not from the garrison, though; these are regs, not vets). Given the size of the garrison and the city's 50% defensive bonus, we shouldn't attack with less than 30. Alternatively, we can hit some other cities first.
3. Chichen Itza, Copan, and Tikal are worth keeping ('Mids, spices, and gems respectively). Everything else can be razed unless we need more unit support.
4. I doubt we'll be able to wipe out the Maya before the alliances expire, but if we can, we shouldn't.
5. We'll probably need to hit England next.
CommandoBob
AbstractArt
Great name!
It fooled me at first. I thought you had named it in reference to the astrological sign of the zodiac. Then I read 'near 3 tobacco' and knew that your humor is just as sick and twisted as mine.
Just some random notes on the game.
Ottomans
I see we built at least one galley. We may need some more to find the Ottomans. Even with a pangea landmass they could be hard to find. I expect some suicide galley losses.
Smart Civs
My game is still stashed away, so I'll ask this. How far is everyone from the Middle Ages?
By declaring on Maya we will pretty much stop their tech advances. Taking their capital, and probably their best researching city, will just about kill their search for smarts.
The question is, after the Mayans, is there another AI that can reach the Middle Ages before we kill them?
New Cities
We need a second settler pump to help out Hooka Huacan. The area around our capital is pretty well settled, which means that any settler made by HH has to walk a long way to found a new city. That walk costs us some upkeep for the settler but it also costs us turns, since we can't be making units while the settler is walking.
So, let's examine the possiblity of making Cowtown or South Cowtown into a settler pump to help out HH. If both can become settler pumps, great, HH can make vJags.
Chichen Itza
Do we want to keep this city for the Pyramids and the free granaries? If so, we'll need to keep units around outside the city, not inside it, in case it flips back to the Mayans.
Mayan Conquest
After capturing/razing Chichen Itza, I would suggest attacking eastwards towards Yax-whatever, northeast of Washington. This would split the nation and leave only the smaller cities (size 3 or less).
Once we get to Yax, if we still need to attack England, those forces in Yax can conquer northwards to England. If we need to take out the Yanks, we're already in place.
Roster:
CommandoBob - on deck
Phaedo - warming up
CivActuary
TimBentley
Norton II - just played
Lboogie13 - UP!
Phaedo
Emperor
Nice set Norton
. I think the pyramids would be a nice addition to our empire. It would help in settler production some, but more importantly, it would get our smaller core and semi-core cities up to better production levels faster.
A declaration on the Ottomans makes sense. If we haven't seen them, this means they probably are not in standard galley distance. It presents a bit of a dilemma for the victory. Tons of Jags and lost galleys to get a proper landing force. We can't afford to get to caravels so the only option I see is fully loaded suicide galleys. Hopefully there will be a piece of land free to build up the force in relative safety before making the attack. A bridge to cross later, however it is important to know where that bridge is so I fully support some more galley builds.
Maya was definitely the right choice and getting the rest involved in a dogpile was excellent. I also agree that Liz is the next vic. It looks like we are going to need cats, and cash rushing might become an eventual necessity. Either way it's going to involve a fair bit of cash so the more cities we can plant for mini-specialist farms and to keep the UU down the better.
This is getting rather interesting.
. I think the pyramids would be a nice addition to our empire. It would help in settler production some, but more importantly, it would get our smaller core and semi-core cities up to better production levels faster.A declaration on the Ottomans makes sense. If we haven't seen them, this means they probably are not in standard galley distance. It presents a bit of a dilemma for the victory. Tons of Jags and lost galleys to get a proper landing force. We can't afford to get to caravels so the only option I see is fully loaded suicide galleys. Hopefully there will be a piece of land free to build up the force in relative safety before making the attack. A bridge to cross later, however it is important to know where that bridge is so I fully support some more galley builds.
Maya was definitely the right choice and getting the rest involved in a dogpile was excellent. I also agree that Liz is the next vic. It looks like we are going to need cats, and cash rushing might become an eventual necessity. Either way it's going to involve a fair bit of cash so the more cities we can plant for mini-specialist farms and to keep the UU down the better.
This is getting rather interesting.
Lboogie13
Warlord
Consider this a got it. I will play either tonight or Wednesday night. Any ideas on where to put the next settler. I think Pyramids would be nice to have. I'm not sure if I'll get enough Jags in place to taken Chichen Itza in my turnset. The Mayans are growing too fast so I would rather wait and take the capital.
CommandoBob
AbstractArt
Uh, (Chichen Itza is the Mayan capital.)
On where to put the settler, why not try your hand at a dot map of places you think are good? Post it back here and see what the team thinks. But don't limit yourself to just a city site or two; try four or five so we can plan for the next few turnsets also.
Lboogie13
Warlord
Yeah I know Chichen Itza is the Mayan capital...My point is that I don't want to attack it prematurely. I think 30 jags is a good number before I attack.
I will try out a dot map and post when I get the chance.
I will try out a dot map and post when I get the chance.
I have several jags on the way; it should come out to 30 in a few turns.
Lboogie13
Warlord
Sorry guys, I still haven't had a chance to play. Hopefully, I will be able to post tomorrow.
Lboogie13
Warlord
Sorry guys. Work has tied me up this week. Just to get the save posted I am doing an abbreviated post and will edit tomorrow night. First, the save..
View attachment CBob02_BC_150_Lboogie.SAV
Basically I captured Chichen Itza a few turns in and it hasn't flipped. Well at least not yet. I founded a new city and there is a settler to be placed by the next player. I found the Ottomans
I razed Bonampak, Mayan city with pop of 3. Here is our empire
and here are our front line troops
Again, sorry for the lateness and the abbreviated post. I have to go spend time with the wife. Last time she hid my Civ 3 vanilla!!!
View attachment CBob02_BC_150_Lboogie.SAV
Basically I captured Chichen Itza a few turns in and it hasn't flipped. Well at least not yet. I founded a new city and there is a settler to be placed by the next player. I found the Ottomans
I razed Bonampak, Mayan city with pop of 3. Here is our empire
and here are our front line troops
Again, sorry for the lateness and the abbreviated post. I have to go spend time with the wife. Last time she hid my Civ 3 vanilla!!!
Checked out the save--not too shabby! A few observations:
1. Looks like we took heavy losses, but that was to be expected. Fortunately, our capital can give us 1-turn jags now--we just need to move one citizen from a 1-shield tile to the forest.
2. No one's in the MA yet, but everyone except the Ottomans is one tech away. England should still be our next target.
3. It'll take galleys 2-3 turns to get to Ottoman Island, but if the English finish the Great Lighthouse, and we capture it, we won't have to use suicide galleys. We should investigate London to see how close they are.
4. @Lboogie13: Did you take a screenshot of Istanbul after establishing the embassy? If not, we'll have to investigate it, too.
1. Looks like we took heavy losses, but that was to be expected. Fortunately, our capital can give us 1-turn jags now--we just need to move one citizen from a 1-shield tile to the forest.
2. No one's in the MA yet, but everyone except the Ottomans is one tech away. England should still be our next target.
3. It'll take galleys 2-3 turns to get to Ottoman Island, but if the English finish the Great Lighthouse, and we capture it, we won't have to use suicide galleys. We should investigate London to see how close they are.
4. @Lboogie13: Did you take a screenshot of Istanbul after establishing the embassy? If not, we'll have to investigate it, too.
Lboogie13
Warlord
Ok gents here is the full post, sorry it took so long
Pre-flight: 1. Capture\raze Chichen Itza
2. Found Ottomans
3. Attack further east into Mayan territory
350 - everything looks good, just hire taxman in Just South of Rome and Something non-AZ to stop rioting, hit enter and away we go
IBT - Mayans are building Temple of Artemis and complete Mausoleum of Mausollos, England settles Liverpool in northern frontier
330 - move units towards CI
IBT English get great wall
310 - more moving units, disperse barb camp and collect some free gold
IBT - Mayans attack our stack with javs, we go 1-1
290 - get a settler from HH, kill redlined jav that just killed one of ours, move stack of 30 to CI
IBT - Jav kills elite jag trying to join stack, barb galley suicides against our galley
270 - begin the attack on CI 5 retreats, 8 wins and 7 losses, not too bad considering there was 8 defenders. We take the city and get Mausoleum and Pyramids, plus 2 slaves and 3 of our own workers back.
I garrison 2 units inside the city and the rest outside. Move the workers to connect CI with our southern cities.
IBT - Javs kills 2 of our jags
250 - move jags up to CI (but not in it) to prepare for our next attack, send another potentially suicide galley out in search of Ottomans
IBT - Mayans and English declare peace, Rome and CI are in chaos
230 - hire a joker in Rome and CI, kill 2 misc. javs roaming toward our territory, move our stack to Bonampak, next Mayan victim
IBT - Rome and CI are ok, lose galley up north exploring
210 - Meet Ottomans finally! Here's a shot of Istanbul courtesy of our new ambassodor
He is up polytheism on us and we are up Wheel and IW.
IBT - Mayans and Americans declare peace, English are working on some sort of huge, lighthouse that is supposed to be great, Ottomans kindly threaten us to leave their territory or else
190- keep moving jags in place
IBT - settler from HH, Mayans attack our stack and kill 1, lose 2 of their javs
170 - Attack Bonampak, 5 retreat, 5 die and we kill their 3 defenders and raze the city
, founded Frontierville in our northern frontier, rax in 20. Sorry guys I didn't do a dotmap. I hope the placement is ok. I accidently left Fake Fur on to build a spear instead of a jag so we now have a spear for defense.
IBT - Mayans attack our stack, 2 jags retreat and 1 dies, we kill two of their units
150 - leave stack in place for the next player, 12 jags with more on the way. See my post above for the save and other screen shots.
Pre-flight: 1. Capture\raze Chichen Itza
2. Found Ottomans
3. Attack further east into Mayan territory
350 - everything looks good, just hire taxman in Just South of Rome and Something non-AZ to stop rioting, hit enter and away we go
IBT - Mayans are building Temple of Artemis and complete Mausoleum of Mausollos, England settles Liverpool in northern frontier
330 - move units towards CI
IBT English get great wall
310 - more moving units, disperse barb camp and collect some free gold
IBT - Mayans attack our stack with javs, we go 1-1
290 - get a settler from HH, kill redlined jav that just killed one of ours, move stack of 30 to CI
IBT - Jav kills elite jag trying to join stack, barb galley suicides against our galley
270 - begin the attack on CI 5 retreats, 8 wins and 7 losses, not too bad considering there was 8 defenders. We take the city and get Mausoleum and Pyramids, plus 2 slaves and 3 of our own workers back.
I garrison 2 units inside the city and the rest outside. Move the workers to connect CI with our southern cities.
IBT - Javs kills 2 of our jags
250 - move jags up to CI (but not in it) to prepare for our next attack, send another potentially suicide galley out in search of Ottomans
IBT - Mayans and English declare peace, Rome and CI are in chaos
230 - hire a joker in Rome and CI, kill 2 misc. javs roaming toward our territory, move our stack to Bonampak, next Mayan victim
IBT - Rome and CI are ok, lose galley up north exploring
210 - Meet Ottomans finally! Here's a shot of Istanbul courtesy of our new ambassodor
He is up polytheism on us and we are up Wheel and IW.
IBT - Mayans and Americans declare peace, English are working on some sort of huge, lighthouse that is supposed to be great, Ottomans kindly threaten us to leave their territory or else
190- keep moving jags in place
IBT - settler from HH, Mayans attack our stack and kill 1, lose 2 of their javs
170 - Attack Bonampak, 5 retreat, 5 die and we kill their 3 defenders and raze the city
, founded Frontierville in our northern frontier, rax in 20. Sorry guys I didn't do a dotmap. I hope the placement is ok. I accidently left Fake Fur on to build a spear instead of a jag so we now have a spear for defense.IBT - Mayans attack our stack, 2 jags retreat and 1 dies, we kill two of their units
150 - leave stack in place for the next player, 12 jags with more on the way. See my post above for the save and other screen shots.
CommandoBob
AbstractArt
Looks good to me, too!
Skip
I won't be able to play this next turnset. We're not through with our painting and our son comes in on Wednesday night. He will be here until Sunday morning when he flies back to Kentucky for his last two weeks of school, after which he is back home for the summer.
I cannot fight the wife unit and live to tell of it, at least, not this week.
And this time I have to agree with her. Get the house stuff done first, C3C second.
Roster:
CommandoBob - skipped
Phaedo- UP!
CivActuary - on deck
TimBentley - warming up
Norton II
Lboogie13 - just played
Skip
I won't be able to play this next turnset. We're not through with our painting and our son comes in on Wednesday night. He will be here until Sunday morning when he flies back to Kentucky for his last two weeks of school, after which he is back home for the summer.
I cannot fight the wife unit and live to tell of it, at least, not this week.
And this time I have to agree with her. Get the house stuff done first, C3C second.
Roster:
CommandoBob - skipped
Phaedo- UP!
CivActuary - on deck
TimBentley - warming up
Norton II
Lboogie13 - just played
Phaedo
Emperor
Ok, well unfortunately I've been pushed up in a number of games. I can probably get to it later in the week but if someone wants to trade sets, it would help.
CivActuary
Warlord
Phaedo, I can take it and play tonight or tomorrow, so let's do a switch.
Phaedo
Emperor
Thanks. That's a big help
CivActuary
Warlord
OOB:
1 Settler
22 Workers (13 native, 9 slaves)
1 Spear (1v)
3 Galleys
31 Jags (24v/7e)
Unit limit is 56, so we are not paying any upkeep.
Research is turned off, and we are at +26gpt with 606g in the bank.
State of the Empire:
Aztec Azeleas (8) grows in 12, vJag in 1
Cancerville (2), grows in 2, vJag in 4
Chichen Itza (4), no growth, vSpear in 19
Cowtown (2), grows in 2, rJag in 7
Desert City (2), grows in 3, vJag in 3
Fake Fur Coat (3), grows in 3, vJag in 4
Frontierville (1), grows in 9, Rax in 19
Hooka Huacan (3) grows in 3, Settler in 5
Into The Woods (4), grows in 4, Galley in 2
Just South of Rome (5), no growth, vJag in 2
Oasisville (2), grows in 2, vJag in 7
Rome (5), grows in 7, vJag in 6
Something Non-Aztec (6), no growth, Galley in 5
South Cowtown (1), grows in 1, Rax in 17
So we are building, in summary,
Settler 1
Spear 1
Jags 8
Rax 2
Galley 2
Couple items before I play.
- MM'd AzAz to get 1 turn Jags
- The Settler moving N I am planning to put on the grassland 3NE of Rome. I briefly considered the hill1 E of that position, but with the corruption that will be in that city, I think we would need the mined hills to get 2 shields out of it.
- When did we get that Spear and what are the plans for it? We are building another as well - are we going to continue with building some defensive units or just build Jags?
- Going to switch Cowtown to a Rax, regular Jags are not going to help us at this point.
- Are we planning an taking the Mayans all the way out before starting on the English? They have 6 cities left, and there is a lot of open space for them to re-expand if peace breaks out.
- Attack forces are kind of scattered, Holding off on the attacks for a turn or 2 will probably be good. The stack near Copan needs to move out of range to heal.
1 Settler
22 Workers (13 native, 9 slaves)
1 Spear (1v)
3 Galleys
31 Jags (24v/7e)
Unit limit is 56, so we are not paying any upkeep.
Research is turned off, and we are at +26gpt with 606g in the bank.
State of the Empire:
Aztec Azeleas (8) grows in 12, vJag in 1
Cancerville (2), grows in 2, vJag in 4
Chichen Itza (4), no growth, vSpear in 19
Cowtown (2), grows in 2, rJag in 7
Desert City (2), grows in 3, vJag in 3
Fake Fur Coat (3), grows in 3, vJag in 4
Frontierville (1), grows in 9, Rax in 19
Hooka Huacan (3) grows in 3, Settler in 5
Into The Woods (4), grows in 4, Galley in 2
Just South of Rome (5), no growth, vJag in 2
Oasisville (2), grows in 2, vJag in 7
Rome (5), grows in 7, vJag in 6
Something Non-Aztec (6), no growth, Galley in 5
South Cowtown (1), grows in 1, Rax in 17
So we are building, in summary,
Settler 1
Spear 1
Jags 8
Rax 2
Galley 2
Couple items before I play.
- MM'd AzAz to get 1 turn Jags
- The Settler moving N I am planning to put on the grassland 3NE of Rome. I briefly considered the hill1 E of that position, but with the corruption that will be in that city, I think we would need the mined hills to get 2 shields out of it.
- When did we get that Spear and what are the plans for it? We are building another as well - are we going to continue with building some defensive units or just build Jags?
- Going to switch Cowtown to a Rax, regular Jags are not going to help us at this point.
- Are we planning an taking the Mayans all the way out before starting on the English? They have 6 cities left, and there is a lot of open space for them to re-expand if peace breaks out.
- Attack forces are kind of scattered, Holding off on the attacks for a turn or 2 will probably be good. The stack near Copan needs to move out of range to heal.
Sashie VII
Balance of Power
lurker comment: Looking good, I'm enjoying it.
Lboogie13
Warlord
I built a spear on accident. One of those mouse slips where I thought I left production on a jag and it was a spear that popped out in like 2 turns. As far as building another one I probably did the same thing. Sorry!
We took heavy losses attacking those 2 mayan cities. My guess is that we need 20 to attack a small city and 30 or more to attack a capital or big city.
My vote is take down the Mayans ASAP. They do have too much room to grow and seem to be our strongest enemy. Keep exploring the Ottomans. It looked like they were lagging behind in tech and may not have any resources to build more advanced units, especially if they are stuck on that island. IMHO, that may be the last civ we want to take down.
