Zack
99% hot gas
Well why do you say "esport" and not "sport" then?
Counter-Strike hacking scandal
- Thread starter Saigon
- Start date
It's a specific category of sports. There are plenty of other sports categories: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Category:Sports_by_type
Oh look, electronic sports is on that list.
Light Cleric
ElCee/LC/El Cid
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It really does merit emphasizing that the NCAA is an capricious joke that really doesn't have any clue what it's doing or even care to have said clue, instead preferring to throw darts at a board to decide what incidents will be investigated and what the punishment will be for that incident.
This is a cheating scandal, not a hacking scandal.
As a fan of real sports, I consider neither video games nor gridiron to be sports.
As a fan of real sports, I consider neither video games nor gridiron to be sports.
Timsup2nothin
Deity
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Curling fans unite!!!!
Kennigit
proud 2 boxer
you can't cite that list unless you want to include everything on it
I highly doubt anyone wants to include "Fantasy sports" as a sport itself (e.g. fantasy baseball, not quidditch).
Don't get me wrong, I've followed esports for a relatively long time--although not fps--but the vernacular of "sport" implies a bit more of a human-generated physicality than a "competition" or subclass of sport. CFC probably had a generic poll a while ago on "what do you consider a sport", as many forums do, but esports require very little physicality besides quick reflexes (only for some titles, eg hearthstone who cares) and hand-eye coordination. I would never call playing the piano a sport, and that requires more physicality than all esports. Nor would I really call NASCAR a sport, even if it may take some physicality to perform it. It needs the motorsport disclaimer.
I assume the Dreamhack must be some online cups or whatnot, because I would think it would be difficult to have an active hack at the LAN competitions. Of course I err on the side of not banning/removing qualifications status/invite status unless there is strong reason to suspect cheating in the online cups and qualifications. CS is a live team game so anyone on the team cheating directly impact the entire game, compared to independent events (e.g. series of 1v1s).
also:
Kespa also is less a governing body than it is a conglomerate of the sponsors; yeah it's in the ministry of culture or whatever but it's not really a real governmental agency
Kennigit
proud 2 boxer
That's actually very easy, since all serious esports have "offline" competitions (offline meaning in-person at venue, since most games don't have true LAN anymore due to piracy stuff. It still is "online" but you get the point). The tournament organizer can ensure the default client is installed and no additional mods and stuff are being used.
The actual issue in competitive gaming that will continue to be a problem for a long time is of course any online competition (some games have better anti-hacks than others), and match fixing or agreements between the players.
Match fixing is like any other sport with match fixing. Most notably was Ma Jae Yoon, korean starcraft:brood war progamer who arranged for players for throw matches so that gambling websites can place large bets on the outcome.
Agreements, as I refer to, is a bit harder to prove. For instance, say there is a $X USD prize for first place and $Y prize for second place. Players have, and allegedly have in other cases, agreed that they'll just split the money evenly (X+Y)/2 regardless of who wins in an under-the-table deal. This is particularly possible to happen since many esports competitions nowadays are "top-heavy" prize distributions, often the majority of the prize pool solely in the first place prize. E.g. first place 5000 USD, second place 500 USD. You can't make a living making 500 USD every few months. You can do that winning 5000 USD occasionally.****
There also is obviously match throwing/etc to get more favorable brackets or in group-stages that are like round robin and your teammate is in the group as well.
But those issues are common to every competition that has enough money to entice people to cheat but not enough money to just make big $$$ off of your salary where the risk of getting banned deters many people or you have an organization that thoroughly investigates potential cheating
Of course, that does not stop some no matter how much money they make. Like all famous match fixers of any sport or competition. And obviously, basically no sport has a real solid definitive regulatory/investigatory board, particular when it comes to things like recruiting rules and salary caps and money under-the-table that doesn't directly impact on field performance. It is easier to test for steroids than it is to necessarily find that 20,000 "bonus" given to a college athlete's uncle or whatever scenario you want to extrapolate.
****edit: well I say that because there is generally more allegations for that medium range of money, but it doesn't matter how high the prize pool goes. Just there is probably higher scrutiny.
Esports also currently suffers from many shady business deals and tournaments not paying out prizes. It steadily is getting better, but it depends on the game and is case by case. Several professional gamers are "owed" severals or tens of thousands of dollars from their teams that never payed salaries, or tournaments that are basically never going to pay out their prize pools, etc. And you are relatively powerless to do anything about it, if say, a german tournament you went to owes you 2000 dollars for winnings + travel they said they would reimburse and you are some chinese player. You're never going to get that money. [that was strictly hypothetical]
shadowplay
your ad here
I had no idea there was even such a thing as a professional Counter-Strike player.
Evie
Pronounced like Eevee
Labeling video game as sports is the same as labeling chess or bridge as sports (which several people do, but is nonetheless not in the spirit of what sport is): it's a ridiculous stretching of sport.
If it doesn't involve reasonable physical activity, it's not sport. It can be a competition, it can be a very wortwhile competition, but it's not a proper sport.
(I'm fine with calling it e-sport, just so long as it's understood that's a new definition of sport, not a subset of the old one)
If it doesn't involve reasonable physical activity, it's not sport. It can be a competition, it can be a very wortwhile competition, but it's not a proper sport.
(I'm fine with calling it e-sport, just so long as it's understood that's a new definition of sport, not a subset of the old one)
azzaman333
meh
The problem with the cheats that have just been caught is that they're practically undetectable from watching them play, and they were being used in LAN competitions because they were able to transfer the cheat via the Steam workshop. They were picked up by a 3rd party anti-cheat which is way more intrusive than Valve's, so now there's question marks over many of the top players in the top teams who will be attending an international LAN event in a couple of days. There's one particular player in one of the highly regarded teams who is copping a massive inquisition into whether he's a legitimate player, with a few clips of his play being heavily scrutinized and a lot of accusations flying.
Thorgalaeg
Deity
Never heard of this "esports" thingy and found the idea of a profesional counter strike gamers amusing. Then looked for it in wiki and found there are millions in prizes, above all in a game called Dota 2, also found this pic:
And finally i came to the conclusion i am getting old...
And finally i came to the conclusion i am getting old...
Just one thing. Using a hack doesn't make you a hacker...creating one does. Just like playing a game doesn't make you a software developer 
I guess that depends on what you define as sports. If you go by physical activity, then yes esports isn't sports...but then chess or curling or whatnot are out too.
I guess that depends on what you define as sports. If you go by physical activity, then yes esports isn't sports...but then chess or curling or whatnot are out too.
Hygro
soundcloud.com/hygro/
Dawg these kids have APMs in the 300s. The level of physicality and adrenaline management to win in competitive starcraft is nothing short of athletic.
azzaman333
meh
Just one thing. Using a hack doesn't make you a hacker...creating one does. Just like playing a game doesn't make you a software developer
Hacking is the correct term in the context of the game though. People who cheat in CS are typically referred to as hackers.
This is pretty accurate. I'd even go so far as to say that it's more difficult to become a professional StarCraft player (unless you live in Korea), than it is to become a pro or semi-pro (i.e. collegiate or high school) football, soccer, etc. player.
Kennigit
proud 2 boxer
Most westerners dont play consistently w/ 300 apm, and certainly very few have that eapm (mostly spam--eg 400 apm 250 eapm). And apm is really only consistently high in starcraft bw, starcraft 2, or some wc3 players (eg moon). Maybe like meepo players in dota 2, though idk.
Playing the flute or clarinet or piano has more dexterity on any high level concert pieces
Actually i dunno about clarinet
Phrossack
Armored Fish and Armored Men
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This is what happens when people take games seriously and mix them with cash prizes for winning. Throw in monetary incentives, and you get lots of cheaters, amongst other bad things. I find the concept of playing anything professionally, or betting non-trivial sums on games, to be ridiculous, be it couch potato competitions, soccer, or horse racing.
warpus
Sommerswerd asked me to change this
It sounds like.. people playing video games for money to me.
I watched a chef showdown on TV the other day. It was two people using their culinary expertise, skill, and strategy for monetary gain. There were people in the audience watching and cheering them on.
It was not a sport. It was just two dudes cooking.
I think you're forgetting that these things are labelled as "sports" for pretty much marketing purposes. It's how they get more people interested in the event, so that they can make more money putting on such events. If labelling as something else would make more marketing sense for them, they would have done that instead.
