Cuba and US to normalize relations

[luiz]

Cuba's own apartheid, which outlasted South Africa's and only ended in 2008:

Between 1992 and 2008, in order to gain the much-needed hard currency, some hotels and resorts were opened only to foreign tourists, leading to accusations of "tourism apartheid". The policy was reversed by the Cuban government in 2008.
...
To ensure the isolation of international tourism from Cuban society, tourism was to be promoted in enclave resorts where, as much as possible, tourists would be segregated from Cuban society. This was not lost on the average Cuban citizen, and the government tourism policy soon began to be referred to as "enclave tourism" and "tourism apartheid".[28]
...
Until 1997, contact between tourists and Cubans was de facto outlawed, and Cubans seen in contact with tourists were regarded as potential thieves by police.[2][3] Global human-rights groups' complaints, and the upcoming visit of Pope, helped cause an about-face, although such contact is still frowned upon. Police often demand identification checks of any Cubans seen in contact with tourists.[2] Tourist identification is usually not checked unless the tourist has dark skin and is mistaken for Cuban.[2] Despite the restrictions, average Cubans thrive on Cuba's tourist industry,[2][29] and many simply see the policy as inevitable.[23]

The policy of restricting certain hotels and services to tourists was ended by the government of Raúl Castro in March 2008.[30] As well as officially allowing Cubans to stay in any hotel, the change also opened access to previously restricted areas such as Cayo Coco. However, access remains very limited in practice, as the vast majority of Cubans do not have access to the hard currency needed to stay in such hotels.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tourism_in_Cuba#Tourist_vs_Cuban_hotels

 

[luiz]

If Cuba is such a wonderful place, why aren't people lining up to move there?

Not only are they not lining up to move there, they're actually lining up to leave. Cuba has a net migration rate of -3.64 / 1,000 people, and that's a significant part of the reason why their population is actually shrinking. By comparison, the net migration rate in freakin' Mexico is -1.64 / 1,000. So Cubans are leaving their country at a rate 122% higher than Mexicans.

Seems like people don't want to live on the socialist shantytown paradise.

 

[MobBoss]

Not only are they not lining up to move there, they're actually lining up to leave. Cuba has a net migration rate of -3.64 / 1,000 people, and that's a significant part of the reason why their population is actually shrinking.

Seems like people don't want to live on the socialist shantytown paradise.

And that little fact right there is more telling than anything in this thread up to this point.

Apparently even communists that think Cuba is the shiznit don't move there. Go figure. Maybe its own of those 'places that its nice to visit, but wouldn't want to live there' things?

 

[luiz]

I always tell the communists I meet in Brazil "go to Cuba you s.o.b." (they are invariable Castro fanboys). They never go. Or rather, they might go for a week and stay in one of the foreigners-only five star resorts, but they never contemplate moving there and helping the Revolution out. Go figure.

 

[Tee Kay]

Cool, pretend there's any equivalency between what I'm saying and what RT is saying. Typical leftist.

What are you shoving your hateboner at me for? I don't even like Castro. Go back to playing with RT.

 

[luiz]

What are you shoving your hateboner at me for? Go back to playing with RT.

Why am I replying to a comment you made about me on a thread started by me?

Seems like a pretty stupid question even by your standards, kid.

 

[Borachio]

If Cuba is such a wonderful place, why aren't people lining up to move there?

Don't know. It's a mystery.

An even bigger mystery is why people are lining up in Calais to move to the UK.

But that's people for you. Largely unfathomable.

 

[Tee Kay]

I made a general observation as a (relatively) neutral observer.

Also I note that no one else in the thread took it personally or felt the need to be belligerent about it.

I miss Winner.

 

[luiz]

I made an observation as a (relatively) neutral observer.

I note that no one else in the thread took it personally or felt the need to be belligerent about it.

For starters, you're not neutral. In the real world inhabited by working adults, you're on the left fringe.

Additionally, you're equating my entirely objective, mainstream and fact-based assessment of Cuba with that of a self-described Marxist-Leninist. I'm not making Cuba look worse than it is; I acknowledged repeatedly for instance that their education and healthcare are above Latin American average. I also pointed out, with facts, that they were even better on relative terms prior to the Revolution. I'm not making up any numbers or denying any concrete facts.

You didn't dispute anything I posted, merely made a cretinous observation equating my position to that of a total lunatic (let's not be hypocritical. You know he is a lunatic as well as I do. And so do all moderators who might take exception to this. Facts are facts and can't be offensive).

When you compare and equate my position to that of an individual who think North Korea is awesome and Stalin was a great humanist, I'll take exception. In fact I take great exception to it and will call you out on your nonsense. It's just as offensive as being compared to a neo-Nazi Holocaust denier.

 

[ReindeerThistle]

And that little fact right there is more telling than anything in this thread up to this point.

Apparently even communists that think Cuba is the shiznit don't move there. Go figure. Maybe its own of those 'places that its nice to visit, but wouldn't want to live there' things?

Communists not moving to Cuba? Why would they? Build socialism in your own nation. Don't mooch off of someone else's socialism.

Mooching is a capitalist thing, you know?

The real fight is in getting rid of the US' racist, fascist, violent institutions. Can't do that from Cuba. Though, apparently, the US, a nation that toppled Saddam, Qaddafi, Egypt, etc, can't do squat against Cuba from 90 miles away, either.

Losers.

And don't tell me they haven't tried.

 

[JollyRoger]

If you want to live in a socialist paradise, you do not have to move to Cuba, you just have to join the military.

 

[dutchfire]

Moderator Action: This thread doesn't seem like it will go anywhere anymore. Closed
Please read the forum rules: http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?t=422889