Current (SVN) development discussion thread

[Leoreth]

I was also able to modify the "free tech" mechanic so that you now can only select techs of your era or earlier, to avoid abuse of Liberalism or the Oracle.

 

[Linkman226]

It still amazes me that firaxis was able to create a game that guys like leoreth and Ryhe can tinker with to create a historical simulator.

Without it being scripted

Just a random sequence of events that can some times create actual historic worlds.

I highly doubt there will ever be a game this cool ever again

And I love that these things happen rarely and randomly, as in our reality this is how things played out but subtle changes could have made a whole new world, like that last episode of community...

Civ IV is definitely one of the most moddable games I'm familiar with.

I was also able to modify the "free tech" mechanic so that you now can only select techs of your era or earlier, to avoid abuse of Liberalism or the Oracle.

 

[Leoreth]

Oh, right, I completely forgot to second what jammerculture said. Civ4 is not only moddable in the respect of having an easily accessible code, it's also great in the aspect of how much you can achieve from a set of rather simple features. Complexity from simplicity, that's what makes a good game.

The same holds true for RFC. Sometimes it's outright eerie, because often I don't even have to do much to get the game to resemble history. I just add stuff and watch it unfold, and often it unfolds exactly like it's supposed to.

Short, Firaxis and Rhye are both awesome and everything we're doing here is built on their genius.

 

[AOS9001]

Oh, right, I completely forgot to second what jammerculture said. Civ4 is not only moddable in the respect of having an easily accessible code, it's also great in the aspect of how much you can achieve from a set of rather simple features. Complexity from simplicity, that's what makes a good game.

The same holds true for RFC. Sometimes it's outright eerie, because often I don't even have to do much to get the game to resemble history. I just add stuff and watch it unfold, and often it unfolds exactly like it's supposed to.

Glorious, isn't it? And people wonder why I spend my time playing things like this... They don't even know.

 

[civ_king]

Civ IV is going to have a very long shelf life

 

[Linkman226]

Partly because they made civ V so crappy and unmoddable

 

[Tomorrow's Dawn]

Now, now, Civilization V isn't crappy.

I just don't like how Firaxis nerfs everything and anything with each update.

The next thing that's identified as "cheap" or "unbalanced" is instantly nerfed and almost nothing gets improved in any meaningful way.

I hope this doesn't really reach out on too far of a tangent but,
I liked how back in the day, the MMO, Ragnarok Online balanced things in an interesting way.
You didn't nerf an overpowered attack on one class by lowering it's power; you nerfed it by
buffing an attack from a different class as to making said overpowered skill look weaker in comparison.

Or in the recent Ultimate Marvel vs. Capcom 3, they gave almost every character an OTG
(an Off The Ground attack) to make every character viable. Okay, /end tangent.

I agree that Civilization V's unmoddability is frustrating though.

 

[Kubko]

I think there's a problem with the newest SVN version with barbs, playing as chinese I got a constant stream of their horse archers coming, I went to worldbuilder in 1000AD and saw like 15+ city ruins, most in middle east, but some in americas and greece.

 

[Leoreth]

I'll look at it (was it 3000 BC or 600 AD?).

 

[Kubko]

i'll look at it (was it 3000 bc or 600 ad?).

3000 bc

 

[Kubko]

Other bugs I encountered(started playing as china, changed to Portugal on their spawn):
Mongols newer spawned
England has 0 colonies, Spain has 1 they got from trade company event, France has 2 colonies that aren't captured indy cities.(in 1700 ad)
Turkey never took random indy city in northern Anatolia, Greece took it instead in like 1700 AD
Greece had a random "Celtic Camel Archer" mercenary running around in Anatolia, lol

So yeah it's very buggy currently :O

 

[BenZL43]

I understand where you're coming from, but dealing with the jungle problems is part of the Khmer challenge.

Then at least make that Jungle don't give them +0.25 sickness because, again, here in Southeast Asia, Jungle is something beneficial for us
Another reason is I often seen when Plague spread, Khmer became the least to heal because the high rate of sickness..

I doubt the AI would found cities so close, and justifiably so.

Okay..
I will try to mold the Khmer according to my suggestion, and I will notify you if they settle the Angkor afterward

- Only your one war elephant?
- What's your problem with that?
- not even after you move a unit along their border? Otherwise, save?

I guess so. I'll recheck it then in my next Khmer game.
Will save if I still found no solve to this problem..

This ... is just ... I'm completely amazed.

Me too! I think this will only works in Emperor mode?
The only negative things is that it happened when I spawn, not in the historical Trajan era (which is almost impossible to replicate) haha..

That would be nice to have, but would it actually impact the game?

Represent the modern world's mulitculturalism?
Actually this one is pretty inspired with the American UP which I still wondering what the advantages for them having their cities not 100% American

Pff, I live in northern Germany so I don't have much to do with all that Oktoberfest jazz (actually I'm always a little aggravated that it's only the Bavarians who represent us abroad ). All I can say is that the Oktoberfest usually starts in September, counterintuitively, and only its last days are in October.

Perhaps its because the mall ran out of event ideas since Eid ul-Fitr moved earlier?
Or because they give free flow beer and the Brakwust sausages?
Just found out that the promotion only last until today (16th October) and we will have Halloween decoration from tomorrow on
[/QUOTE]

@jammerculture,AOS9001 and Linkman226
Unfortunately, I don't save it because I thought it was usual for AI Rome in Emperor
I will save it then next time I encounter the same condition..

A suggestion about Roman & Byzantine Relationship
How about making that Byzantine spawn when Rome have controlled Istanbul strait and have more than x cities in Mediterranean ?
Also that Byzantine should start with Friendly and Permanent Alliances with Rome, it is strange seeing Byzantine having war against Rome..
Byzantine should be Rome's best buddy and continue the reign of Roman Empire after Rome's death by Barbarian~

 

[AOS9001]

@jammerculture,AOS9001 and Linkman226
Unfortunately, I don't save it because I thought it was usual for AI Rome in Emperor
I will save it then next time I encounter the same condition..

A suggestion about Roman & Byzantine Relationship
How about making that Byzantine spawn when Rome have controlled Istanbul strait and have more than x cities in Mediterranean ?
Also that Byzantine should start with Friendly and Permanent Alliances with Rome, it is strange seeing Byzantine having war against Rome..
Byzantine should be Rome's best buddy and continue the reign of Roman Empire after Rome's death by Barbarian~

No autosaves?

And I agree. There never was any real war between the two, if I recall, though the East did divert barbarian tribes at the West to save themselves. I do believe the Byzantines only do spawn when Rome controls Greece and the Bosporus, but currently, their 3000 BC spawn is broken... They should spawn with all the east too, including Egypt if Rome controls that. I remember the Byzantines would spawn with everything but Egypt in previous versions.

 

[Tomorrow's Dawn]

I was also able to modify the "free tech" mechanic so that you now can only select techs of your era or earlier, to avoid abuse of Liberalism or the Oracle.

On latest revision.

They founded it exactly one turn before the Arabs spawn.
If I can reconstruct it correctly, they beelined Theology (I was spying on Rome for quite some time)
and then built the Oracle for a Divine Right slingshot.
Not that this is game-breaking though.

A couple turns later, it is amusing to see Makkah as a secular city-state but every city the Arabs conquer/take gets Islam.

 

[Leoreth]

Well, you shouldn't interpret the "you" in that sentence as an indefinite pronoun meaning that the AI is not affected.

 

[Tomorrow's Dawn]

Leoreth, please change China back to how it was before the revision.

1) The Economy is the main driving force of a China player's stability.
I don't know what you did but where I would normally have about 35-50 Economy Stability
propping me up, I now have 20-28 without doing anything different than from what I normally do.
Without it, I am Unstable/Collapsing way quicker than I should be.
2) Don't make Shenyang/other Southern Manchu cities flippable to the Mongols.
It's aggravating considering that a Manchu city would be necessary to fulfill the first UHV because of the production.

This is precisely why I advocated for direct Mongol buffs instead of nerfing China in comparison.
It's a lot more frustrating for the player.

 

[Leoreth]

I changed nothing to China's economy! Will take out southern Manchuria out of the Mongol core, though.

 

[Tomorrow's Dawn]

Okay.

The Shenyang flip considerably hurt my game and was very unwelcome.

I thought you had implemented that economy degradation for ancient civs that you mentioned in one of these threads.
Looking back at my save, I think my Economy problems stemmed from:
1) Diverting hammers normally reserved for gold & science buildings to troops because
they kept defecting to Mongolia after refusing to turn over Shenyang.
2) Fast, aggressive teching and tech trading on my part that hurts my (Civics?) rating with rapid civics unlocks.
I'll try and finish up getting Communism anyway and hope I make it through to Fascism before I collapse.

 

[jammerculture]

China seems fine. I just finished the first UHV condition without settling any cities in Manchuria, my most northern city is Beijing. I quite liked the new puzzle actually. There is a synergy between their UB, UP and UHV conditions that is very cool. Two of their required techs are bulbable with GS, and with the extra Scientists slot of their UB, you rack them up very quickly, especially with all the excess food running triple scientists in four cities. I bulbed alphabet, compass, paper and most of education. With the early alphabet and my UP allowing me to get monopoly techs for cheap, I could trade for everything I else I needed. I was even able to build the Great Wall which was very cool and solved my barbarian problem.

Their new UP is extremely exploitable though if you keep a scout in the west and focus on the techs you need for the UHV conditions, you can research deep into the tree very quickly and then trade for everything you need. It is 990 ad and I am researching liberalism, although I think it might be smarter to forego and go right for gun powder. As well there is a stabilizing effect. With super china feeding the ancient world techs, most of the classical civs are still around. I am also interested in seeing what happens with religions in Europe, as my beeling for paper resulted in the chinese founding catholicism.

 

[Tomorrow's Dawn]

For the long run, it's generally a better idea to take two of the eight required cities for the UHV from Corea & Japan. Mostly because it's the logical thing to do and that those city sites help out your empire immensely. I've always interpreted the 1st UHV condition for China as a subtle context to conquer your neighbors, much like how the "be first in score" condition for Japan is a subtle context to conquer your neighbors (along with the not-so-subtle Greater Empire of Japan goal).

And wait, what? Discovering Paper founded you Catholicism?
That can't be right. Don't you mean Theology?