[Development] Canonical City Location Suggestions

[merijn_v1]

I don't think that is a good idea. I suppose that the copper tile represents Samar Island, and the sugar Panay/Negros. Given that, than Luzon isn't so much bigger then Mindanao. (only 1 tile) And Luzon is historically more important than Mindanao.

I don't think that Mindanao should be designed for 2 cities. I think it should be designed for 1 city. It is possible to have more, but that shouldn't be favorable. I would compare it to Java. That is designed for having 2 cities, although it possible to have 3.

The Philippines will be a colony of Spain in the main mod. I think 3 cities is a bit to much presence for them. Even in my Philippine modcomp, I think 2 cities is the best setup gameplay wise. And if there would be an additional city in the Philippines, I think it should be on Luzon, not Mindanao.

 

[Steb]

Sure. I was more concerned with the shape of the island than the number of cities it can support. Maybe it should be enlarged by 1 tile, but be given a peak, most appropriately on the tile just west of the gold (which in any case should at least be hilly).

 

[merijn_v1]

I kinda like the ingame shape compared to the real world shape. I think adding a tile would make that worse.

 

[Temüjin VIII]

The map can fit 3 PH cities, actually. I think 1W of @merijn_v1's suggestion is more accurate for Manila. The Panay Island could represent Cebu, instead, and we can give Spain 2 colonies to conquer.

Davao has been more important recently (both politically and economically). Butuan, although the center of an earlier kingdom, hasn't had significant historical canonical impact since the Spanish colonial era. (Sorry, Butuan friends.)

I'mma just finish my semester then I'll add some more input on this

 

[Genghis Khaiser]

That's what I was thinking. Don't know what my opinion on enlarging China to the east at the expense of the Pacific Ocean. That already happened too often by now.

China is already pretty large, and in fact it is in the original map. I think China is fine as it is. As it looks, it can support many large, productive cities.

 

[TJDowling]

China is already pretty large, and in fact it is in the original map. I think China is fine as it is. As it looks, it can support many large, productive cities.

Agreed, if China gets any bigger we'll have to add more Chinese civs...

 

[Jarlaxe Baenre]

Quoting the map suggestions thread, since my response fits more here.

I impowered myself to make a suggestion about Ontario. I really don't understand the reasoning of having Toronto be so far West, except to make room for the 3 other cities. This is all well and good but the Ottawa River is crazy long and distorts the shape of Ontario/Quebec. So this is my solution. In red, my ideal city placement (I don't mind that the cities are one tile off if it means the physical geography is correct), In blue, the most accurate placement (minus Ottawa), in yellow the Ottawa and Toronto are in the right place compromise.

I love dealing in minutiae.

Spoiler :

View attachment 497108

I perceive Toronto as being on the forest or corn in that picture (Is this supposed to be in the other thread? You moved some resources around, but that's all I see changed). The large urban area there, including Hamilton, covers the west side of Lake Ontario.

I suppose this is all just a compromise, though.

We disagree about where Toronto and Ottawa go, but agree about Montréal and Québec city.

If we start by placing Montréal and Québec City in the right places, then my preference is all we've got left for Toronto and Ottawa. That makes all of them be in the right spot, in my opinion. However, it puts two of them in the wrong spot for you.

If we use your solution, then you're compromising with Montréal and Québec city to get Toronto and Ottawa in places you prefer.

There is another solution, though.

Axe Ottawa. It was made capital as a compromise. Canada can then spawn in either Toronto, Montréal or Ottawa, depending on the situation in Upper & Lower Canada. Split English/American and French, and Ottawa's available to found a city, then it spawns there. Fully English or American, and it spawns in Toronto. More French, spawns in Montréal.

 

[Leoreth]

Axe Ottawa. It was made capital as a compromise. Canada can then spawn in either Toronto, Montréal or Ottawa, depending on the situation in Upper & Lower Canada. Split English/American and French, and Ottawa's available to found a city, then it spawns there. Fully English or American, and it spawns in Toronto. More French, spawns in Montréal.

That's interesting.

 

[soul-breathing]

Agreed, if China gets any bigger we'll have to add more Chinese civs...

Russia and America are also big, also no more civs settled there...

Add 7 or 8 tiles in China would not be so excessive.

 

[AessaSH]

I would place Hanoi 1W, to reduce the overlap with Guangzhou. And Hanoi is mostly on the (south) west side of the river anyway.

Spoiler Indochina :

Done~
Also, the cities placement in the western Indonesia:

Spoiler Western Indonesia :

 

[TJDowling]

Quoting the map suggestions thread, since my response fits more here.



I perceive Toronto as being on the forest or corn in that picture (Is this supposed to be in the other thread? You moved some resources around, but that's all I see changed). The large urban area there, including Hamilton, covers the west side of Lake Ontario.

I suppose this is all just a compromise, though.

We disagree about where Toronto and Ottawa go, but agree about Montréal and Québec city.

If we start by placing Montréal and Québec City in the right places, then my preference is all we've got left for Toronto and Ottawa. That makes all of them be in the right spot, in my opinion. However, it puts two of them in the wrong spot for you.

If we use your solution, then you're compromising with Montréal and Québec city to get Toronto and Ottawa in places you prefer.

There is another solution, though.

Axe Ottawa. It was made capital as a compromise. Canada can then spawn in either Toronto, Montréal or Ottawa, depending on the situation in Upper & Lower Canada. Split English/American and French, and Ottawa's available to found a city, then it spawns there. Fully English or American, and it spawns in Toronto. More French, spawns in Montréal.

I guess it was tough to place my post because I changed the map and the canonical locations. The river was changed and the corn was moved, otherwise it was the cities. I am fully on-board axing Ottawa altogether or having it decided as you said by the "situation in Upper/Lower Canada". I still think the Ottawa River should bend earlier, which is 90% why I moved Toronto 1E, 10% because I think it belongs above the Western half of Lake Ontario. I just think it looks better/more accurate.

Russia and America are also big, also no more civs settled there...

Add 7 or 8 tiles in China would not be so excessive.

Yeah but Russia and USA don't get big until the late game, so their curve is not as much of a problem.

 

[soul-breathing]

I have to give up to move Japan and Korea 1E, to enlarge midland of China. I find the Pacific Ocean is too small to reduce. Now it's only 13 tiles from Tokyo to Califonia, it can't be smaller.

Based on the recent map, I've made some Canonical City Location in different era in Chinese history, as a reference. They're all referred to The Historical Atlas of China.

First it is the city location in China around 100bc, include the territory of Han Dynasty and some independent cities in Xinjiang:

Spoiler :

 

[soul-breathing]

The city location in China after 600ad, include the territory of Tang Dynasty and some independent cities and civ around:

Spoiler :

 

[soul-breathing]

Reserved for some dynasties later, to be continued.

 

[inthesomeday]

I wish the AI would found St Louis more often

 

[Genghis Khaiser]

Here are my suggestions for city placement. While some cities might be too close to each other, I generally followed the belief that placement should be to cover as many tiles as possible with as least cities as possible.

USA and Canada: I think coastal cities are much more important than inner cities here.
Mexico: Maybe I could add Tijuana. Hermosillo could also work one or two tiles north instead of Culiacan.

 

[Genghis Khaiser]

Part 2.

Europe:
-Brussels may be removed.
-Maybe Florence and Milan could both be added, but it might get Italy crowded, unless that is the intention or Italy's Republic civic can fix that.
-I followed the plan of replacing Frankfurt with Cologne and Munich. While Cologne may be more appropiate on the western side of the river, I think the eastern side could protect it better against invasions from the west.
-Instead of Sarajevo, we could also have Dyrrhacium, Apollonia, Zagreb or Ragusa.
Iran: I noticed it was very tall on the north-south axis and although it's obvious that some tiles are meant to hold a city, I didn't know which ones, so I picked a map and interpreted it as I could. EDIT: I put Isfahan in the wrong location. It should be one tile north-west, on the Oil next to the Oasis.
Africa: About time we had enough space to make for a decent Nigeria. It's home to many cultures and empires and currently the most populated country in Africa, so it couldn't be underestimated. I'm also glad of having a less crowded Western Africa.
EDIT: Damascus should switch places with the resource just south of it, while Tyre should be located 2S, 1W of where it is.

 

[Leoreth]

I have to give up to move Japan and Korea 1E, to enlarge midland of China. I find the Pacific Ocean is too small to reduce. Now it's only 13 tiles from Tokyo to Califonia, it can't be smaller.

I feared that would happen. Have you considered rearranging the peaks west of Xi'an to move it 1W? In the current map Xi'an is also further west than it should be and while inaccurate one tile more space along the Yellow River would already give lots of room to the cities there.

I really like the different city suggestions based around the major dynasties. It gives a good timeline of how China should expand in the game and also some dynamically changing city names.

 

[Genghis Khaiser]

Part 3.

There's a spot at central China I didn't know what to do with. I thought about putting Wuhan there, but there were some resources or lakes on the tiles I thought of. Otherwise, it looks like it could have a great city.

As everyone has said here, it's kind of weird to see the Pacific Ocean so small, with Japan and California so close to each other.

 

[inthesomeday]

Whoops, double posted.

How do I access the big map so I can make placement suggestions?