Espionage

[champinoman]

This made me laugh:

Not every team clicked on "future tech" at the start and ending up teching mining first.

Why didn't we just read that thread to know what they researched

And yeah, FREE BEAKER, FREE BEAKER, FREE BEAKER, FREE BEAKER, FREE BEAKER, FREE BEAKER, FREE BEAKER, FREE BEAKER, FREE BEAKER, FREE BEAKER, FREE BEAKER. lol

Add 1 to what it says in the top left corner

 

[caveman1917]

Don't forget about the free beaker everyone gets. Working a coastal tile as a financial leader gives 13bpt.

That's true, totally forgot about that

 

[champinoman]

Can we assume that if they are working a coastal tile to start with that they are building a worker first? If they were building a WB they would be more inclined to speed it up with hammers to get the earlier advantage of seafood.

And for reference later when we figure out their next move they would have had 4 beaker overflow into the next tech on turn 6.

EDIT: Can be assumed as caveman points out below

 

[caveman1917]

Can we assume that if they are working a coastal tile to start with that they are building a worker first? If they were building a WB they would be more inclined to speed it up with hammers to get the earlier advantage of seafood.

And for reference later when we figure out their next move they would have had 4 beaker overflow into the next tech on turn 6.

Doesn't have to be a coastal tile, every riverside lux resource will do in this case. Even oasis in an unlikely case

 

[Lord Parkin]

Looks like this has been sorted out in the barrage of posts since I left work.

Confirmed for myself that CDZ could have worked a 3 commerce tile and got Mining on turn 6. All is okay again.

Assuming that the map maker has gone for an even distribution of seafood and Forge resources (which I'm betting on being quite likely), I'd say these are the possible tiles and respective chances they're working them:

Coastal Fish - 1/10 chance
Coastal Clam - 2/10 chance
Coastal Crab - 2/10 chance
River Gold - 1/10 chance (I'd almost go with zero since I'm betting the mapmakers would be disinclined to place Gold on a river for a capital)
River Gems - 2/10 chance
River Silver - 2/10 chance

Of course, the map may not be split up in this way, but I'm well aware that patterns are attractive to map makers (for balance as well as aesthetic purposes), so my bet is going with the above guess.

Maybe the top 5 cities hasn't updated yet?

So it just has to be the pop, or something else. Does the "5 best cities" update before we meet the civs?

The top 5 cities screen always updates instantly, which is handy for seeing how your rivals' capitals are doing without even having met them.

 

[azzaman333]

As does the demographics screen.

 

[AlphaShard]

I was taking a gander at the team rosters of the other teams, to help me remember who is on who's team. I noticed in Team Merlot's mission statement that they will have a role for each player, one being a Chaplin and head of religous things. Makes me think they choose Pacal to get an early religon and he can do it too. I in fact have spammed fouding religion with him on a Solo game.

So in saying that I hope that both the teams playing Ghandi and Pacal try for the same religion.

 

[hell_hound]

Just a point for obsolete's post, maybe it was a double bluff? If you think about it we have a very commerce heavy start and we are financial. They have an ideal wonder start and they want a SE. Just a thought.

 

[Irgy]

Just a point for obsolete's post, maybe it was a double bluff? If you think about it we have a very commerce heavy start and we are financial. They have an ideal wonder start and they want a SE. Just a thought.

The starts *should* have been randomly assigned to teams. So if what you say is the case, it should be only a lucky co-incidence.

 

[AlphaShard]

I thought each start was supposed to be balanced out by the Mapmaker, I thought THAT was his job.

 

[Irgy]

I thought each start was supposed to be balanced out by the Mapmaker, I thought THAT was his job.

They are, but not in a way that accounts for which team/leader has which start. They should be balanced for every possible assignment of teams to starts. Or at least balanced on average, some leaders may prefer some starts more than others but on average they get a start no better or worse than anyone else.

I'm assuming here you're responding to my previous comment anyway? Otherwise I have no idea what you're getting at.

 

[AlphaShard]

Yes I am responding to you Irgy. So the map just had start locations made by the Mapmaker but those locations were randomly assigned? Awefully lucky we are then to get this start.

 

[champinoman]

Who is to say we are exclusively lucky? I think LP's description is probably the closest:

Looks like this has been sorted out in the barrage of posts since I left work.

Confirmed for myself that CDZ could have worked a 3 commerce tile and got Mining on turn 6. All is okay again.

Assuming that the map maker has gone for an even distribution of seafood and Forge resources (which I'm betting on being quite likely), I'd say these are the possible tiles and respective chances they're working them:

Coastal Fish - 1/10 chance
Coastal Clam - 2/10 chance
Coastal Crab - 2/10 chance
River Gold - 1/10 chance (I'd almost go with zero since I'm betting the mapmakers would be disinclined to place Gold on a river for a capital)
River Gems - 2/10 chance
River Silver - 2/10 chance

 

[Lord Parkin]

Yeah, I highly doubt we were exclusively lucky. I'd even go so far as to say that the map makers would be daft if they made the map that way. Other teams will probably have Gold/Gems/Silver and other good resources. Expecting that we're the only team with a nice start isn't realistic.

 

[Lord Parkin]

Just noticed that last turn (turn 9 / 3640 BC), three teams had their score increase to 39, meaning they learnt a tech: Mavericks, Quatronia, and Merlot. As of this turn (turn 10 / 3600 BC), Amazons are the only ones who have not had a score increase yet, meaning they're probably researching a more expensive tech as their first one, possibly Animal Husbandry. This is interesting as their start was probably similar to ours and they didn't begin with Fishing.

 

[Irgy]

I don't think it's that unlikely that the starts are different enough for Amazons to have animals for food in their BFC. Or maybe grains, but in either case not quite so much seafood as we were given. We basically proved they went AH first from the demographics, it was the only way for any team to get to 20 GDP (thanks to their starting techs).

Also though if you have clams, irrigated corn and no plains forest hill to work, then worker first is better than workboat first even if you have fishing. So maybe they do have a little seafood, but aren't prioritising it.

 

[Lord Parkin]

True, that could be the case. Maybe I'm assuming a little too much with my theoretical 2 civs with Fish / 2 with Crabs / 2 with Clams, or with no land food sources. Maybe the starts are more different from ours than we thought.

 

[AlphaShard]

Yeah and it also means they can have their Immortals in a timely fashion. They could have a bigger island or not even be on an island. Though I do think it's a safe bet they have some land animal food cow/pig/sheep.

Man the anticipation is killing me, we need to get alphabet so we can make spies and send them scouting!

 

[Lord Parkin]

I would be very surprised if they were not on an island. I expect all of the starts will be somewhat mirrored, hence my suspicion of either a "ring of islands" or "star with islands between points" setup for the map.

 

[Trystero]

I agree AH first for Immortals would be an unusual choice for an island start. Perhaps they aren't on an island, or if they are, they have no seafood resources near their capital, but have pigs/cows?