Fall Further - The Original Thread

[xienwolf]

Ah yes. In Fall Further all spell ranges are enhanced by spell Extension (and any other promotions which gives a SummonPerk that enhances mobility). There is also a separate SpellRange tag which only works to modify the range of non-summon spells.

 

[Opuhara]

View attachment Decius AD-0394.CivBeyondSwordSave
hello

I do not understand why I lost a size 11 city to the mercurian: i am a peaceful decius malakim, in war with no one. we share the same religion and they were suppose just to cross my state ...

 

[xienwolf]

Could have used some warning that it is a Hotseat game Being multiplayer means I cannot access all of the normal debug tools to try and figure things out.

My best guess was that Basium himself was in the city and possibly you had the Mercurian Gate without realizing it. He is a fair ways into your territory, but it is possible he converted the city and then continued to move forward. Froihk is a Malakim City name. So that means that this city probably never belonged to Cardith, and is unlikely to have the gate.

 

[Opuhara]

so it might be a bug: I did not build the Mercurian gate in Froihk
something to do with the fact that his capital is also where the code of junil is and my religion is Order ?

 

[Niveras]

I am playing a game with Varn Gosarm as Mazatl. I seem to be unable to build the Mazatl priests. According to the civlopedia they only require Elementalism/Divination, Sacaellum of Kalashekk/Omor, and Priesthood, though my cities have those buildings they still cannot be built. They do not even appears in the build list, as though I am missing a technology prereq.

I even tried this with Hiantrogh in a test game without unrestricted leaders, and after giving myself Mysticism, Writing, Philosophy, Divination, Elementalism, Priesthood, adding a Pantheon and Sacaellums of Omorr/Kalashekk, and adding an incense with plantation and trail nearby (thinking maybe it was required even though not shown in the civilopedia), they still did not appear in the build queue.

 

[Elm]

I pillaged a lair, and got the message about releasing someone from a prison cell -- but I didn't get a Great Person. (I got a Great Merchant with the message in one game).

Out of curiosity, I went through the xml/py and I don't see anything that would cause this -- unless it has something to do with one of the prisoners being an adventurer. Maybe I hit that one, and didn't get one because I wasn't grigori?

Anyway, found something on the lines of a typo. In CIV4GoodyInfo.xml

<Type>GOODY_MARNOK_RELEASE_PRISONER_ARTIST</Type>

Appears twice. Should probably remove one copy.

 

[Kolath]

I am playing a game with Varn Gosarm as Mazatl. I seem to be unable to build the Mazatl priests. According to the civlopedia they only require Elementalism/Divination, Sacaellum of Kalashekk/Omor, and Priesthood, though my cities have those buildings they still cannot be built. They do not even appears in the build list, as though I am missing a technology prereq.

I even tried this with Hiantrogh in a test game without unrestricted leaders, and after giving myself Mysticism, Writing, Philosophy, Divination, Elementalism, Priesthood, adding a Pantheon and Sacaellums of Omorr/Kalashekk, and adding an incense with plantation and trail nearby (thinking maybe it was required even though not shown in the civilopedia), they still did not appear in the build queue.

I also have this situation. Unable to build the priests even though I have the techs and the buildings.

Also, if I add either priest to the game using the worldbuilder it causes a memory exception and crashes to the desktop.

*EDIT* To clarify, the crash occurs as soon as I hit "end turn" after adding either priest through worldbuilder.

 

[Elm]

Also, there is something inconsistent in CvSpellInterface.py

The function MarnokDungeoneerBigBad(caster) basically returns the chance that a ruin will be destroyed when a barbarian unit is spawned. But some of the units are spawned with MarnokSpawnMonster(), which automatically removes the ruin.

So, for example: When MarnokDungeoneerBigBad() spawns a Lich it returns 80, (which I believe means that there is a 80% chance the barrow will be removed). But MarnokSpawnMonster removes the barrow before it returns (it calls pPlot.setImprovementType(-1)). So, the 80% chance is ignored.

I think you should comment out pPlot.setImprovementType(-1) in MarnokSpawnMonster().

 

[Valerarren]

I also have this situation. Unable to build the priests even though I have the techs and the buildings.

Also, if I add either priest to the game using the worldbuilder it causes a memory exception and crashes to the desktop.

*EDIT* To clarify, the crash occurs as soon as I hit "end turn" after adding either priest through worldbuilder.

I also can replicate this (and was having the same problem with lack of priests).

EDIT: I managed to edit the Civ4UnitInfos.xml file and stop it from crashing (by removing the accent from "Tuatha De Danann") but I still don't seem to be able to create priests normally. Maybe if I create a new game?

 

[Eternal Requiem]

even when playing as the race itself they still won't build those two units... got all the tech requirements... and nothing... that I think is a major bug...

 

[Valerarren]

A new game didn't fix the problem, and to be clear, I was playing with the default leader.

 

[Vehem]

A new game didn't fix the problem, and to be clear, I was playing with the default leader.

Thanks - have fixed it for the next patch.

 

[[to_xp]Gekko]

units with the "raider" promotion granted by the raiders trait automatically destroy lairs, I'm playing a game with the doviello right now and my lucian has destroyed a couple bear dens without me ever telling him to do so. not a problem at all, but one could prefer to keep them around to cage animals later in the game. not sure if this applies to other lairs too or only animal ones, but I would assume it does, which COULD be bad ( I don't think that it would count as "explore dungeon" providing boni/malus right? I think it only destroys the improvement like pillaging works) . not sure if this is intended either. hope I explained what I'm saying well enough btw

 

[Valerarren]

Thanks - have fixed it for the next patch.

Is there an easy way to fix it myself / will it break saved games? Thanks.

 

[Ahriman]

On playing with the Elohim more, I strongly recommend that you make spiritual a core civ trait (they really need it for in particular double-speed monastaries and 2-move monks and crusaders) for the the leaders and move defensive to be granted by visiting the Beacon.

All their new mechanics focus around Spirituality. Without it they are just a builder race with no ability to sustain a decent invasion until the very late game; you can't conquer anything early game with 3 strength attack vs 4 strength defenders.

And flavorwise; they're the most spiritual civ in the game. Heck, their whole concept is "spiritual monks". So their leaders are better candidates for the spiritual trait than anyone else.

 

[[to_xp]Gekko]

speaking of elohim, isn't the "pacifist" thingy ( i.e. -1 attack ) a little too much? I know it's just outside borders, but IMHO it could be better if it was applied only to enemy territory, no neutral one. I know it was changes once already in order to help with barb-busting, but barb-busting is usually a business you'd better take outside your borders anyway, and that -1 to attack, although it fits thematically, is a little harsh. the -1 attack when in enemy territory is great though, makes them pacifist like they should be

 

[xienwolf]

units with the "raider" promotion granted by the raiders trait automatically destroy lairs, I'm playing a game with the doviello right now and my lucian has destroyed a couple bear dens without me ever telling him to do so. not a problem at all, but one could prefer to keep them around to cage animals later in the game. not sure if this applies to other lairs too or only animal ones, but I would assume it does, which COULD be bad ( I don't think that it would count as "explore dungeon" providing boni/malus right? I think it only destroys the improvement like pillaging works) . not sure if this is intended either. hope I explained what I'm saying well enough btw

To change it so that you do not auto-pillage lairs you would need to make them all <bPermanent> so that only spells (Explore Lair) can remove them from the map.

On a related note: Don't step on the Pyre of the Seraphic with a Raider unless you are prepared to fight some elementals

speaking of elohim, isn't the "pacifist" thingy ( i.e. -1 attack ) a little too much? I know it's just outside borders, but IMHO it could be better if it was applied only to enemy territory, no neutral one. I know it was changes once already in order to help with barb-busting, but barb-busting is usually a business you'd better take outside your borders anyway, and that -1 to attack, although it fits thematically, is a little harsh. the -1 attack when in enemy territory is great though, makes them pacifist like they should be

Granted, it makes "barb-busting" harder... but would a PACIFIST be doing that anyway?

 

[[to_xp]Gekko]

Granted, it makes "barb-busting" harder... but would a PACIFIST be doing that anyway?

well, yes, to a degree. after all, pacifist does not mean dumb, and since those barbarians are all out to kill you, you shouldn't allow them to do so just cuz you love peace, right? I kinda agree that it does make sense from a logical-flavourful point of view though. I'm just saying that it seems a little harsh on them balance-wise. just my 2 cents of course

 

[Vehem]

well, yes, to a degree. after all, pacifist does not mean dumb, and since those barbarians are all out to kill you, you shouldn't allow them to do so just cuz you love peace, right? I kinda agree that it does make sense from a logical-flavourful point of view though. I'm just saying that it seems a little harsh on them balance-wise. just my 2 cents of course

Defending against the barbarians that are attacking you or threatening your lands is one thing. Pro-actively looking for trouble outside of your borders is something different. I can't see many reasons that the Elohim would go stand around in the nether-lands between civs and attack orcs on sight.

That is still kind of possible however (if you absolutely need to engage the barbs in neutral lands), if you bait the barbarians with your units and allow them to attack you in favourable terrain. You fight at full strength when defending, plus the terrain bonus helps further.

Granted, it makes "barb-busting" harder... but would a PACIFIST be doing that anyway?

That's pretty much my take on it too. I've played them a few times over the last week and they're quite able to defend themselves - they just can't create super units by attacking the barbarian rush with Shock-warriors.

It's definitely intended to be a downside to the civ. No one ever said that being a pacifist in Erebus was going to be easy.

 

[Valerarren]

Another minor issue. When I create a beserker as Mazatl, the graphics in general becomes slow (and there are no options for upgrading). This happens as long as I have the beserker selected. I now just don't build them.

I've seen this sort of behavior in previous versions when a water elemental splits in two.

Finally, I'd like to mention that when alt-tabbing in and out of the game, the brown-border at the edge of the game disappears (the options are still there). Hitting ctrl-i (or is it alt-i?) twice fixes it.