Fall Further - The Original Thread

[xienwolf]

The multiplayer score issue might be tied into a seperate aspect of BUG mod. As I recall they placed the function to limit the scoreboard to only the top 10-20 Civs (for mods who allow 35+). If that function is messing up in counting the Civs, it would result in only seeing yourself most likely.

 

[MaxAstro]

Not sure if this has been reported yet, but removing Channeling 1 from Mazatl Shapers has caused them to be unable to cast Spring or Scorch; kinda kills their main point, if you ask me. XD

Also, can I get some kind of indication that the bug with Unique Feature happiness has at least been noted? I know this is the third time I've mentioned it, but it's really starting to annoy me when I spawn next to the Remnants of Patria and miss out on an extra 3 happy...

 

[Psychic_Llamas]

Ok, i can now officially say that Harmatt is my favourite hero of all time.

just look at the screenshot below to find out why... the best ive ever gotten anywhere close to that is level 14... and considering what turn it is... there are no units anywhere near as tough as him (i even slaughtered hyborem twice in a row even though Harmatt was only 7 strength at the time (i admit i had just promoted to demon slayer), but now Gela +another air mana makes him 10 strength)



im not sure if its just increadible luck that i got the swift boots and that iten that gives heaps of first strikes, as well as the burning staff and a healing potion (again, i admit i got plagued, poisoned and withered , but luckily all near the pool of tears) or if harmatt is a tad overpowered... i like to think luck, because i havent had so much fun with a hero in ages , killing 4 civilizations with only 1 unit is the bomb-diggity

 

[Vehem]

Not sure if this has been reported yet, but removing Channeling 1 from Mazatl Shapers has caused them to be unable to cast Spring or Scorch; kinda kills their main point, if you ask me. XD

I'm going to add a couple of Shaper-only spells that have the same effect as Spring/Scorch so far as Swamp is concerned, but doesn't have the "base ability" of those spells (i.e. they'll be able to manipulate swamps, but not desert/plains). Should solve that issue in the process (version 041).

Also, can I get some kind of indication that the bug with Unique Feature happiness has at least been noted? I know this is the third time I've mentioned it, but it's really starting to annoy me when I spawn next to the Remnants of Patria and miss out on an extra 3 happy...

Thanks - I spotted it last time and thought "hmm - that's odd" but didn't look into it whilst I was swatting other bugs. Turns out that the "decimal happiness" code is interfering with the Unique Improvements ranged happiness (basically it's adding 0.03 happiness for each Remnants in your city radius).

In Patch B it will be "fixed", but the 'pedia will be reporting "+300 Happiness in nearby cities". In 041, it should all be sorted (need to do DLL work to fix the 'pedia).

Ok, i can now officially say that Harmatt is my favourite hero of all time.

just look at the screenshot below to find out why... the best ive ever gotten anywhere close to that is level 14... and considering what turn it is... there are no units anywhere near as tough as him (i even slaughtered hyborem twice in a row even though Harmatt was only 7 strength at the time (i admit i had just promoted to demon slayer), but now Gela +another air mana makes him 10 strength)



im not sure if its just increadible luck that i got the swift boots and that iten that gives heaps of first strikes, as well as the burning staff and a healing potion (again, i admit i got plagued, poisoned and withered , but luckily all near the pool of tears) or if harmatt is a tad overpowered... i like to think luck, because i havent had so much fun with a hero in ages , killing 4 civilizations with only 1 unit is the bomb-diggity

Utterly insane I like it. Looks like adventuring with a hero paid off for a change (everytime I've attempted it with an early hero, I've ended up with some sort of nastiness). He does have Adventurer though which helps a fair bit.

From a balance point of view - I generally only find 1 magic item from adventuring in every 3 or 4 games that I play, so the selection Harmatt found there was very lucky. I can't really see any case in which he's naturally overpowered unless you follow a strategy of grabbing every air mana possible in the early game (which given the research and expansion involved is fairly tricky to do anyway).

Nice screenshot too

 

[BeefontheBone]

He is pretty tough in the early game but I expect he'll usually weaken as techs progress - in my current game (raging barbs, though not much raging seems to be going on - I lost a city but only through stupidly forgetting to replace a warrior in it, and the 'Raphs got eliminated somewhere in the world) he's easily capable of taking out a civ on his own now that he's got Hero. With adventurer he can definitely survive exploring dungeons pretty well - a few orcs aren't really a threat, and I don't think he can trip much nastier things - haven't looked at the explore code.

I'm still getting a text key error but a lot fewer - TXT_KEY_STRATEGY_UNIT_SETTLER (or similar - that's off the top of my head) doesn't show on mousing over settler in the build window.

 

[Darksaber1]

Well, he could catch the plague.

 

[Vehem]

Decided to make this a quick one as one of the issues was preventing MP play.

Patch B
1. Fixed an issue with multiplayer scorelists
2. Fixed the behaviour of unique features (they will incorrectly list large happiness bonuses (+100, +300) until I rework the DLL, but the actual effects are correct (+1, +3) )

 

[MagisterCultuum]

Not sure if this has been reported yet, but removing Channeling 1 from Mazatl Shapers has caused them to be unable to cast Spring or Scorch; kinda kills their main point, if you ask me. XD

Is there really any reason for the level one spells to require channeling 1 to cast anyway? I know there was back when Priests used the same sphere promotions as arcane units, but I don't see much point in it now.

 

[xienwolf]

Firebow is the only reason I was able to think of when the same thought occured to me a while back.

 

[MagisterCultuum]

I fail to see how Firebows are relevant.

You know, if you didn't require channeling to cast the spell but did require it to get the promotion, you could could make the promotions available to more unitcombats and then easily make Govannon's train spells not require any python.

 

[Vehem]

Is there really any reason for the level one spells to require channeling 1 to cast anyway? I know there was back when Priests used the same sphere promotions as arcane units, but I don't see much point in it now.

Firebow is the only reason I was able to think of when the same thought occured to me a while back.

Would it be too much of a boost if Firebows were just given Fire2 rather than the Fire1/Channeling 2 upgrade path? Alternatively, it would actually be fairly easy to make it so that level 3(?) Firebows gained the ability to cast Fireball, whilst they didn't have that ability initially. I'm quite keen to try some level requirements for certain promotions anyway (think Xien mentioned something along those lines in another thread).

In any case, would there be any knock-on effects if Channeling 1 were removed as a prereq for casting the level 1 spells across the board?

 

[Daijin]

've just fixed a problem with the multiplayer scores list in the part that keeps track of whether a player has completed their turn or not - another part of BUG that I think was broken by 3.17 (it's calling SetActive() on the scoreboards but apparently that doesn't exist anymore). It doesn't sound exactly like what you've reported, but if you have Show Python Exceptions turned off, it could look the same. I've also played around with having Humans meet AI's and Humans meet Humans, but can't reproduce any further problems.

Let me know if Patch B fixes it (once it's posted).

YEAH!! It is fixed!!!, now time for me and the wife to have fun!!!

 

[Darksaber1]

Yea, if it's removed then the spells are avalible to all, and Adepts which start with it simply get bonus free exp. and the reduction to enemy resistance chances. To clarefy, I like the Idea.
Edit: Once Govannon Trains them or their specily designed to have spells

 

[xienwolf]

I already added Level Pre-reqs in my MODCOMOP, so you'll have that when you import it (hopefully you haven't yet, I am refining the Religious HUDs as an option right now, should be up tonight, possibly with new HUDs that are just color shifts instead of crappy artwork).

Reasonably certain that Firebows remain the only case where it is relevant anymore. And you cannot learn the Rank 1 spells unless you are UNITCOMBAT_ARCANE, so you don't need to fiddle with that too much either.


A scan of Python and XML for Channeling 1 shows no issues. Used in Python only for the Train spells. Used in Promotions as a Prereq for each level 1 spell and Extension 1, but all of those are only available to UNITCOMBAT_ARCANE anyway.

 

[MagisterCultuum]

There is not UNTCOMBAT_ARCANE. It is called UNITCOMBAT_ADEPT.

I still think that making level 1 spell spheres available to more unitcombats but still requiring channeling 1 (which only unitcombat_adept units would have) would be a good idea, since then Train can become XML-only, and the AI would better understand how to use it. (I'd also probably go ahead and include a version for each spell sphere, that is if I don't move to making train a passive pyPerTurn effect.)

 

[Ormarr]

Looking at your screenshot, I notice the vanilla civ menu screen; do you have the BtS version of FfH or the vanilla version? FF is only compatible with the BtS version of FfH.

It's BTS, I just didn't like the Menuscreen from BTS, still no Text when I switch the Menuscreens.

There still seems to be some kind of text, I managed to go into the Civpedia.

 

[Darksaber1]

Thats odd. Even Odder if your not supposed to have the German version, but if you are, the lack of text is odd.

 

[Ahwaric]

In any case, would there be any knock-on effects if Channeling 1 were removed as a prereq for casting the level 1 spells across the board?

I actually use it it my mod and it works fine. Channeling is only required to learn a sphere, not to cast a spell. This way only adepts can learn spells, but if you get the promotion otherwise, it is ok. So far the only bad thing I have noticed is that firebows can use blaze. Not a big problem if you ask me.

Changing it also helped me in blocking druids and priests from getting spells they should not be able to get. I just removed channeling form both (well, it required a bit more to let them cast some spells, but blocking was that simple)

 

[Alzara]

Quick question:

What happens if I use birthright regained with the Kahdi? Do I get to cast the "other" version of the world spell and give Kahd even more spells and get the combined effects of both Enlightenment and Corruption?

Thanks

Al

 

[MaxAstro]

I'm going to add a couple of Shaper-only spells that have the same effect as Spring/Scorch so far as Swamp is concerned, but doesn't have the "base ability" of those spells (i.e. they'll be able to manipulate swamps, but not desert/plains). Should solve that issue in the process (version 041).

Hm... I'd actually prefer them to just have Spring and Scorch. Spring especially is almost necessary if the Mazatl start anywhere near desert. But however you want them to work, I suppose, they are your civ. It also does make things less complicated to just have Spring and Scorch be the Swamp-affecting spells; otherwise you are adding two new spells for little reason.

Thanks - I spotted it last time and thought "hmm - that's odd" but didn't look into it whilst I was swatting other bugs. Turns out that the "decimal happiness" code is interfering with the Unique Improvements ranged happiness (basically it's adding 0.03 happiness for each Remnants in your city radius).

In Patch B it will be "fixed", but the 'pedia will be reporting "+300 Happiness in nearby cities". In 041, it should all be sorted (need to do DLL work to fix the 'pedia).

THANK YOU! XD You have no idea how much this was bugging me...