FarowNES02

[The Farow]

I would like to apologize to everyone about the confusion of the stats. This is the second time and it is unacceptable for me to do this.

Everyone thank you for being patient while sort out all the problems in the stats and rules.

 

[The Farow]

Economy- Your economy will be represented by the total production of your nations combined resources.

Urban- Every three cities you build will advance your urban economy by one point. It goes the same the other way around so that if you lose three cities in a war you lose one point. This stat can also be increased through projects or stories.

Rural- This stat will be representative of your nation’s production in areas such as farming, mining, fishing, etc... Basically your total production of goods outside the city. Most of your nation’s production will come from rural areas as that is where a majority of your population lays thus the majority of your production. You can increase this stat through investment of economy and through stories or creative orders.

Trade- This stat will be the total amount of the trade centers one has. However you may get bonus trade points from trading with several people but these can be lost and gained very easily depending on piracy, wars and barbarian raids. Some countries may be trading with the same amount of people as another but they are in a superior position. For example an island nation in the center of the Great Sea (Corenwal) will have a lot more trade bonuses then a nation in the middle of land unless in center of a major trade route.

OCC: I wrote this quickly and there are lots of holes and much more will be added. I am still working on it but I am going to completely redoing economy. Everyone is going to lose or gain points after I am redoing economy. Any suggestions or criticism is welcomed. I want to make it so I can decide on how people are awarded economy points. Economy productions has risen way too high anyway as some nations are far ahead of what they should be.

 

[jalapeno_dude]

Urban: I don't think there should be a fixed number of cities to build to increase this. Rather, it should be relative--it should be harder to go from 9 to 10 urban economy than from 1 to 2. I suppose you could define specifically the required number of cities to advance a level, but I find it easier to decide qualitatively. You can be much more flexible that way.

Rural: Does this include things like mining?

Trade: Interesting approach. But don't trade centers also depend on the number of trade routes you have? IMO, it's easier to do away with trade centers entirely. Also, trade economy should oscillate much more than the other two types.

I do agree that economy has been growing much to fast. IMO, at this point the range should be from 2-8 EP or so, with most people from 3-5 EP.

 

[The Farow]

I will take your input into consideration, jalapeno dude.

More work will be put into it tonight

 

[Birdjaguar]

Economy- Your economy will be represented by the total production of your nations combined resources.

Urban- Every three cities you build will advance your urban economy by one point. It goes the same the other way around so that if you lose three cities in a war you lose one point. This stat can also be increased through projects or stories.

We will cluttter the map with cities. Why not make urban economy a function of rural economy. Say, it can never be more than 1/3 of the rural level and if it is less, you can spend a point to bring it up to 1/3. This will focus people on improving rural economy efforts, enhancing newly acquired territory and may change the way land is valued (are high mountains of equal rural econ value as wooded hills or rich famrland?)

Rural- This stat will be representative of your nation’s production in areas such as farming, mining, fishing, etc... Basically your total production of goods outside the city. Most of your nation’s production will come from rural areas as that is where a majority of your population lays thus the majority of your production. You can increase this stat through investment of economy and through stories or creative orders.

This works for me. How many points do you have to spend to get a +1 to rural economy? Still 2?

Trade- This stat will be the total amount of the trade centers one has. However you may get bonus trade points from trading with several people but these can be lost and gained very easily depending on piracy, wars and barbarian raids. Some countries may be trading with the same amount of people as another but they are in a superior position. For example an island nation in the center of the Great Sea (Corenwal) will have a lot more trade bonuses then a nation in the middle of land unless in center of a major trade route.

Can players pay X EP to create a TC if they have "good" reasons?

How about if each trade center is assigned a value (on map or in stats) that represents player and mod contributions to the "story" of that city. The value is based on things like location, number of trading partners, access to resources and knowledge, longevity, pirate activity, wars, player stories, etc. The value could go up and down as events change. For example the capital of Karanoff States might be a 2 this turn (1 for being a TC and 1 for trade rebound after the war); Corendal might be a 5 (1 for being a TC an 4 more for location, longevity, trading partners and stories).

I want to make it so I can decide on how people are awarded economy points. Economy productions has risen way too high anyway as some nations are far ahead of what they should be.

But maybe we got there through hard work.

 

[jalapeno_dude]

Just noticed my population didn't grow at all either...

From: Dux Patriarchae Terrae Trifluentiae (Leader of the Patriarchs of Terra Trifluentia)
To: Gentes Citerior Amni Vastissiumi (Nearer Tribes of the Vastest River (i.e. the barbarian states closest to me))

The rivers of our world are a great network binding our nations closer together. Through trade, our destinies are intertwined, and our interests brought into agreement. Is it not fitting that our peoples be intertwined still further, so that the great family of mankind can be unified? As the Patriarch appointed to conduct foreign policy, I wish to invite you to send delegates to the Curia Patriarchae. Your people are much like ours--you have the same government, you also honor your ancestors, your lives are also governed by the river. As a member of the Curia, you would still rule your lands, but you would also be part of something greater than yourself, something greater than any of us--a nation, that ultimate institution of mankind. Alone, a tribe is just a tribe, but united, many tribes make up a nation greater than any of them. What say you?

From: Dux Patriarchae Terrae Trifluentiae (Leader of the Patriarchs of Terra Trifluentia)
To: Natio Imperialis Tepheniae (Imperial Nation of Tephen)

Hail, people of the setting sun! For years we have striven to unify the tribes of our river into a great nation. And as we now see there are many rivers, we also see there are many peoples that share our goal. It is heartening to find that others have the great ambition of unifying the family of man. Is it not sensible to unify it still further, by joining our nations in partnership beyond mere trade? As the Patriarch appointed to conduct foreign policy, I wish to invite you to send delegates to the Curia Patriarchae. Though they are ruled differently, with a common foreign policy our nations can prosper. What say you?

From: Dux Patriarchae Terrae Trifluentiae (Leader of the Patriarchs of Terra Trifluentia)
To: Civitas Maaslae Keeistae (State of Maasla Keeista)

Well met, people of the East! From all we have heard, you are an enlightened people, and we are heartened by that. Like us, you strive towards the highest goal possible--the unification of the vast family of man. By trade, our two branches, each with many twigs, of this family are intertwined, but surely you do not dispute the sense of unifying it still further. As the Patriarch appointed to conduct foreign policy, I wish to invite you to send delegates to the Curia Patriarchae. Though they are ruled differently, with a common foreign policy our nations can prosper. What say you?

 

[justokre]

From: Dux Patriarchae Terrae Trifluentiae (Leader of the Patriarchs of Terra Trifluentia)
To: Civitas Maaslae Keeistae (State of Maasla Keeista)

Well met, people of the East! From all we have heard, you are an enlightened people, and we are heartened by that. Like us, you strive towards the highest goal possible--the unification of the vast family of man. By trade, our two branches, each with many twigs, of this family are intertwined, but surely you do not dispute the sense of unifying it still further. As the Patriarch appointed to conduct foreign policy, I wish to invite you to send delegates to the Curia Patriarchae. Though they are ruled differently, with a common foreign policy our nation can prosper. What say you?

To Chashasichashaeh ehluy Ahu-Murtyrista (Emperor of Leaders from Three-Rivered Land)
From Chashasi-B'Deiru eheu Maasla Keeista (Emperor B'Deiru [The Scholar] of Maasl's followers in the Land of the Kee.)

Good tidings to the Land of Three Rivers. I must admit, the rumors of your nation have not portrayed Teraa Trifluentia as the intelligently led, peaceful country it seems to be. But alas, that is in the past. Though we learn from the past, the Kee do not dwell on it. Your invation to our "delegates" is appreciated, and I wholeheartedly accept! May peace and prosperity ensue!

 

[jalapeno_dude]

From: Dux Patriarchae Terrae Trifluentiae (Leader of the Patriarchs of Terra Trifluentia)
To: Civitas Maaslae Keeistae (State of Maasla Keeista)

We rejoice in your acceptance. May peace always reign!

 

[The Farow]

All problems regarding stats will be fixed tonight. I am still working on an economy rule and it should be up by tomorrow. I will post a rough draft version latter tonight and the final version will be up tomorrow.

 

[The Farow]

We will cluttter the map with cities. Why not make urban economy a function of rural economy. Say, it can never be more than 1/3 of the rural level and if it is less, you can spend a point to bring it up to 1/3. This will focus people on improving rural economy efforts, enhancing newly acquired territory and may change the way land is valued (are high mountains of equal rural econ value as wooded hills or rich famrland?)

Birdjaguar, this an interesting idea. I like it the only problem is that it requires me to check to make sure everyone is doing it correct and it would be another thing I forget when doing stats

Instead I may make so that your urban economy can never excede your rural economy. I of course will make sure that it is extremely difficult to increase as your urban gets close to the same size as rural.

By the way I am still working on the rules expect a rough copy in an hour.

 

[jalapeno_dude]

I don't agree with that idea. Many, indeed most, states are not self sufficient, and are unable to feed their own population. That's why they import grain. A few states, like ancient Egypt, were agricultural powerhouses, and imported grain to the countries surrounding them. The rest were net importers of food.

Perhaps urban should be less than or equal to rural+trade. But it definitely shouldn't be limited only by rural economy.

 

[The Farow]

You make a good point jalapeno dude and your idea is actually easier for me to keep track of.

 

[Birdjaguar]

I will hang out to read them Farow.

 

[LittleBoots]

For the record, I completely agree with JD and had intended to post something similar myself, but I forgot.

 

[The Farow]

Economy- Your economy will be represented by the total production of your nations combined resources.

Urban- Every three cities you build will advance your urban economy by one point. It goes the same the other way around so that if you lose three cities in a war you lose one point. This stat can also be increased through projects or stories. Since urban economy should never really increase that of the rural economy this stat cannot become larger then that of the rural economy.

Rural- This stat will be representative of your nation’s production in areas such as farming, mining, fishing, etc... Basically your total production of goods outside the city. Most of your nation’s production will come from rural areas as that is where a majority of your population lays thus the majority of your production. You can increase this stat through investment (2 EP as before) of economy and through stories or creative orders.

Trade- This stat will be the total amount of the trade centers one has. However you may get bonus trade points from trading with several people but these can be lost and gained very easily depending on piracy, wars and barbarian raids. Some countries may be trading with the same amount of people as another but they are in a superior position. For example an island nation in the center of the Great Sea (Corenwal) will have a lot more trade bonuses then a nation in the middle of land unless in center of a major trade route. To lose a trade economy can have profound impacts on your nation and all other economic areas. For example if a major port (Economic Center) for your nation is destroyed it may be the port that imports raw materials that feed a trade or the opposite a trade no longer is able to export its products causing a drop in production.

OCC: I made some minor changes to what I had before. I am going to keep trade centers because they represent important economic or wealthy areas of a nation so if you lose one you will have a lot of side effects.

I will make a more final and easier to understand rule set tomorrow with minor changes but the concept will remain the same.

 

[jalapeno_dude]

If I make a good point, why do your rules ignore it?

 

[North King]

I disagree. Some states had no rural economy at all--look at Athens, who probably would have had something like 3 (for the silver mines, mostly)/4/6 or whatever. Most smaller city states would have had no "rural" economy to speak of, and some larger states were more urbanized than we might think. Especially in later periods, having rural economy outstrip urban is just silly.

 

[jalapeno_dude]

I disagree. Some states had no rural economy at all--look at Athens, who probably would have had something like 3 (for the silver mines, mostly)/4/6 or whatever. Most smaller city states would have had no "rural" economy to speak of, and some larger states were more urbanized than we might think. Especially in later periods, having rural economy outstrip urban is just silly.

I agree completely.

 

[The Farow]

You just said that rural should never outpace urban jalapeno dude and that is what I put???

Also, we really have no city-state like nations currently and if one forms I will take them into consideration. There can be exceptions to the rule and as the mod I will decide.

 

[jalapeno_dude]

I said urban should never outpace rural+trade, if you're going to put a limit on it at all. The entire argument I made was to dispute Birdjaguar's proposed rule.