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Final Fixes Reborn

Discussion in 'Rise from Erebus Modmod' started by Ronkhar, Apr 17, 2013.

  1. black_imperator

    black_imperator Emperor

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    yeah, i'll take any suggestion, see the pedia thread for this.
     
  2. Dunpeal

    Dunpeal Warlord

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    I have managed to get the game working again but it involves starting the game several times, loading previous saves or starting new games, and waiting until one of the iterations does not crash the game.

    I searched the forums and found out that STEAM doesn't like to be in one drive and the game files to be in a different drive (I usually install the games I play regularly on my flash drive instead of my hard drive for a smoother gaming experience).

    I regularly have to check the integrity of the game files on STEAM so not sure if there is a connection. I use our launcher but none of the options other than "start menu" will work - it just opens the bts vanilla game.

    Anyway, onwards and upwards ;P
     
  3. vogtmurr

    vogtmurr Emperor

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    Hi guys

    really impressed with the hard work that makes this game durable cant wait to see a new download. The mod on source forge is still 14.11.7 which is minus the alfar and Dural, has some errors re chain of command but works. If development is ongoing I would like to share some observations and suggestions with the group, and some cool custom scenarios.

    Question:
    I play on a not so new machine, but has windows 7 - 64 bit, dual 2.2 CPU, video card, and 4G RAM (which I cant expand). Is this going to be enough to play a stable release to the end on a huge map, with some extra civs?

    Thanks, looking forward to hearing more.
     
  4. black_imperator

    black_imperator Emperor

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    Yeah, the release version is still the same, as there is a recurring bug for some people in the beta version. As soon as it is killed, i'll release a new one. Please do share your remarks though ^^
    As for your question, the 4Gb RAM is probably the limiting factor to play a game on huge with additional civs.
     
  5. vogtmurr

    vogtmurr Emperor

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    @black_imperator

    Yeah - thats what I expected, it slows down but keeps chugging. Maybe a virtual memory fix that would help in this case -

    I have an unrelated experience since I downloaded and activated multiple versions - Rise from Erebus launcher, Fall from Heaven II as well as Ashes of Erebus (both releases). Activated the old frozen/jotnar modules on RfE and get it to load with a lot of errors. But even without it seems my workers wont build anything,not even roads ?.
    I keep FfH II because I enjoy the story line scenarios and just finished the Falamar episodes. AoE plays fine - as long as I load it from the BtS launcher. At one point I was able to play both versions under different MOD names, but now it just defaults to the new one. Just in case this was of interest or similar to any one else's experience.

    Anyway - I'll come back to the topic at hand with a few game experiences and what I observed.
     
  6. vogtmurr

    vogtmurr Emperor

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    I've played a number of civs over the years in various incarnations of Erebus and these were my impressions: first the artwork, concept and storylines are engrossing. Keep it up and I would like to contribute. Allow me to reminisce a bit:

    Mechanos - first civ I chose, because their innate resistance and less religious/arcane dependency made it seem less intimidating than the complex disciple and magic promotions I perceived in my most formidable adversaries; that and the steampunk motif of course. Killed Zarcaz and Acheron, took out the Sheaim, Illians and Frozen, but I got bogged down fighting the Khazad my neighbours after allowing them to flourish. Still my favourite assassin and horse archer units, and the musketman is a replacement for the crossbowmen. The national units seemed almost too much with the purchase upgrades available to them, but never fully tested them before I packed this one in.

    Scions of Patria - picked them because they seemed the most intricate and I think some of that was lost on me at the time. I like the background but didn't quite get into the role before I lost interest or had other priorities.

    Malakim - challenging and takes patience, seems a good strategy is to keep terraforming desert and play defensively, but didn't play it all the way out either.

    Balseraphs - on the old Erebus map, an interesting civ to play if you like a decadent atmosphere, with freaks mutations and illusions. Took role of Empyrean and slowed the armageddon counter by eventually vassalizing the Sidar with their pyre zombies and stigmata, and forced them to abandon ashen veil while sealing off their borders. Ended up in a battle for survival with Basium and the Khazad who adopted Octopus Overlords, where I first racked up huge experience points in a game.

    Bannor - Ideal for the militaristic 'good' player. Ophelia and Decius both have such cool traits I wish they could be combined. The Chain of Command made a difference, but my toughest opponent turned out to be The Elohim and Basium. Again racked up huge experience but didn't prevent Einion Logos from winning a culture victory.

    Mekara Order - in AoE 14.4.7. Looked intriguing, with some weaknesses and opportunities, like the aspirant. Ended up winning in permanent alliance with Varn Gosam. Slave Hunter is a great mid-game unit, as is Sharpshooter and Skirmisher. Did not get much use out of Agent and Caretaker units, though I like the latter concept. Can't remember if I was Jamal or Iram, but one thing I was unable to figure out was actually create a sluga army, when I tried the game crashed.

    Doviello - a great concept for a civ, their beast-like affinity should allow one to really bring the animal packs into the game as a coherent force, and they did. Once I had animal parks and experienced captured packs, so many wild animals flowed into my armies it was becoming a pain. Probably had most of the game options on. The maximum should be adjusted to territory size so they don't 'overpopulate'. Otherwise I would like to see animal packs evolve more quickly to remain relevant. An age base strength scale like the giantkin, combined with experience unlocking upgrades. ie to swordspider, sabretooth, etc. They were strong enough to deal with Sheaim hellhounds though.
    A word about the javelin thrower archery unit: it is simpler to build needing no fletcher but costs a lot more than an archer. For that I think it should have some longevity as a two way unit with access to bronze and iron like a peltast with mobility, or the alternative of upgrading to a melee unit with the skirmisher promotion.

    If this is entertaining I'll add the remaining reviews of civs I played and won, and what I think might be relevant critiques;)
     
    Last edited: Mar 31, 2018
  7. black_imperator

    black_imperator Emperor

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    Please continue, this kind of feedback is very useful ^^
     
  8. vogtmurr

    vogtmurr Emperor

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    Thanks - I have a few more to share. And I should probably point out that I don't always play clearly with the various victory conditions in mind, it's more for the fun of it. I'm a tactical player rather than strategic, (incidentally isn't that Ophelia's benefit - tactics I & II?) Strategy is a different attribute altogether.

    Clan of Embers - I played Jonas Endain in the role of a barbarian with principles. They have useful early advantages but I didn't expand too quickly to stifle technology. I wanted to but never did call the horde - I wonder if it is best early in the game when there are more barbarians, or later when they are more powerful and you are ready to benefit from them? The Clan is pretty hard to beat as it is. Used forts and overlords with garrisons to cover approaches and choke points, and built an empire in two discontiguous pieces at the expense of Scions, Balseraphs and Svartalfvar. Became an arbitrator in other wars to keep any one side from becoming too powerful. The biggest challenge was a mature Illian/Doviello alliance that was probably getting close to ascension for Auric, and I had to march across a Malakim desert to get to them. Slow going on their home turf of ice and tundra, but the Priest of Bhall is an excellent solution to countering the Clan's vulnerabilities in the late game. In addition to scorching terrain and enemies they racked up mind promotions to turn some enemies. Ironically I ended up with Baron Halfmorn (or Halfmoon I call him when he's not in werewolf mode :) and turned Wilboman into a werewolf.
    Where the Clan is too powerful is the Warboss. A simple ranger unit without experience should not have the recruiter function, they are powerful enough with no terrain costs, take no collateral damage, and the fact there is no unit or promotion I'm aware of that grants a bonus against commander units. I racked up lots of experience with them, and literally crushed the alliance by recruiting big armies in captured mature cities. And every time I recruited I got more war bosses to sustain the offensive. I think a recruiter has to be earned by experience - so a separate barbarian warlord (great commander) unit could fulfill this function, perhaps with some combat ability and a recruitment bonus. The Ogre Warchief would also be in character with a one time recruitment ability.

    Austrin - would be one of my favourite picks for any game. Their mobility and adaptability to terrain make them ideal for exploring. The Highlander and Recurve Archer are best in class, a match for champions in the late game on rough terrain. And the Tracker is effective despite its weaker base strength. What you realize is to leave a few cities without barracks and keep producing Highlanders as long as you can. If you have the money the unique upgrade options give you guerilla I, woodsman I with tracker, then woodsman II with the bowman. Pick up guerilla II on the way and you keep all the promotions when you finally upgrade to crossbowmen, giving you an unparalelled two way fighter with mobility in rough terrain - (but the crossbowman in my opinion has become too dominant in the game and I have some suggestions on that later that would limit its numbers).
    The other thing I learned is that with the right civics, religion and wonders it seems possible to bring her into good alignment, but though I've tried twice I never succeeded in that. You are better off to pursue the neutral Leaves religion abilities and gather some heroes before the elves do. I've played Deirdre twice in some of my most challenging games and had success - winning once on a crowded map where I had every civ in pairwise teams. I was lucky to explore an unclaimed land mass first.

    Hippus - with only one unique unit the mounted mercenary seems like a limited advantage but with Horselords it is a mounted champion with withdrawal and terrain defense capabilities - that you can hire whenever in need (if you have the money). Build forts for that very purpose. I played two of my most exciting games against the odds with Hippus. In the first I was embroiled with the Calabim and the Lanun won a religion victory.
    In the 2nd my empire was small relative to rivals but my recon units had success recruiting animal packs and gaining promotions. I was just able to upgrade to beastmasters and berserkers before I had to face a dominant and more advanced Amurite foe under Naxus supported at times by Bannor under Gaius. I focused on getting knights (and Magnadine) while recruiting mounted mercs, and sounded the Warsong - the one and only time I played the world spell and it was decisive, it actually saved my ass. One of the highlights was evacuating a city about to be taken having just a bowman, ranger and assassin I rushed in production. I couldn't even get a mounted merc in to help them. By recruiting animals in wild regions behind the lines this little force gained promotions in ambushes and eventually conquered an Amurite city - saving my allies the Sidar from extinction. The only way was by capturing animals summoned (even temporarily) by Amurite priests and wizards to avoid attrition. Later I was able to capture Acheron, then used him to kill Abashi and capture Nitrospira lol.
    Unfortunately I left quick victory conditions on and Svartalfvar stole a quick culture victory - but if I recall when you play the game further (as I will if its fun) it allows you to claim the full victory conditions later on. Like the Austrin pursue a neutral religion with the Hippus - and unless you are rich in wooded lands and forest lore - my choice is Kilmorph. The Paramander and Earth affinities come in quite handy in any terrain dealing with demons, and dwarven mines are awesome..

    Kuriotates - I played this with advanced start and all classical era advances, on barbarian world. It was the most intense survival game I've played. I started getting the upper hand over babarian lairs but too late to save Ethne the White - closest thing I would have to a true ally. I had powerful beastmasters and mustevals by then, but most of them were crazed, part demon, mutated or undead! I also did not fully appreciate the Kuriotate mechanics and should have been more particular about selecting my 5 cities. In the end I really like the settlement concept - reducing micromanagement while holding a large area. It was hard to defend against the Clan, Khazad and Basium. I fell into the trap of accepting vassalage from unworthy allies I could neither defend nor prevent the Armageddon counter from accelerating - because they refused to abandon Ashen Veil - and I could not disavow vassals once given to them - so I closed borders to prevent the spread.
    Eventually I racked up the most experience and with Phoenix Blood, master outfitters, fletchers and the like prevailed, but by far the hardest going was against the Cualli who transformed a vast empire into jungle swamp. You lose all mobility and it takes a lot to remove even one blowpipe on their home turf. I introduced the airship rather late. Without deploying Eurybatres, the Cualli if unchecked are really too much and were starting to whittle me down, but I had a dramatic finish by killing Hyborem, regaining birthright, and completing altar of Luonnotar all on the same turn. Kuriotates are definitely recommended for a game experience.

    Lanun - I have to mention Falamar in the context of FfH II and the Radiant Guard scenario. The rest are easy by comparison. I don't know if it is ever possible to upgrade the handful of weaker units (hunters, axemen and archers) after achieving the first objective - but the only thing, besides radiant guards, that allowed me to survive hyborem's numberless balors, eidolons and liches was summoning elementals and hosts of the Einharjar. As long as they win a victory they stick around for the next turn, and I finished without losing a single original unit. The Lanun world spell came in handy at a critical time against the Sheaim in Black Tower.

    Lord D'tesh - the only time I intentionally played an evil character, because this one is not allowed on AI. After awhile I got into it despite its minimalist undead trait, but in the bronze era, turn 167 the game abruptly crashed when I advance the turn and I cant seem to get around that.

    Well that wraps up my review of all the civs I've played. Not sure who I should try next, but I have a great idea for team pairings in a multi-player environment. It would be cool to find some likewise gamers interested in that.
    I have just a few general observations to make independent of any particular civ.

    I mentioned crossbowmen as being too powerful - and I think at one time they were limited in number as a national unit. I would suggest allowing maybe six as a start, up to the number of cities and bowyers you have - so averaging out to a max of two per city. With all the other powerful units and promotions this may upset the balance and mechanics, but one thing that would help is assigning a significant city malus to cavalry units and chariots. They should definitely have a penalty attacking cities especially when some have a bonus against archery to begin with. It stays closer to vanilla concepts, in which chariots and crossbows are not generally the top of their combat class. To partially compensate, I would suggest chariots and cavalry units get a strength bonus on open plains and grassland, where they can defend as well.
    Maybe a weaker crossbow that upgrades to arbalest as a national unit with mechanical weapons, and a similar upgrade for arquebus/musketman extending range to two with rifling. And btw If you ever reintroduce the Hamstalfar I think having such a fast moving recon unit with withdrawal ability should come at the expense of access to mithril or heavy weapons.

    The other thing is having only one melee class for any era (except in some unique civ units) you potentially draw on to upgrade to four different national units. I'm thinking with iron comes two melee units; one is a defensive close order formation that is slower but strong on open ground against archers and cavalry, and an open order melee unit that favours terrain and attacking cities.
    I know such a change adds a lot of complexity - and one of the first goals of any game fixes should be reducing memory and CPU cycles for minimal gains or flavour. So I don't know how practical these suggestions are, just my two cents.

    Cheers
     
    Last edited: Apr 8, 2018
  9. black_imperator

    black_imperator Emperor

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    Thanks for that. I have yet to look at the clan in depth, but i took note of the warboss thing.
    On the crossbowan, they are national units in the beta version at the moment.
    As for your remark on the two melee classes, it is actually planned. There's a dev diary talking about it somewhere in the thread. If you don't want to look for it, here is a google doc with all the past dev diaries : https://docs.google.com/document/d/14P90zYvnsodp-PLfRDmAehvX--nuhGV6yhKZMUxy9NI/edit
     
  10. vogtmurr

    vogtmurr Emperor

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    Well thats awesome you've already thought of some of these things. The city malus/plains strength thing is something to consider as well.
    Thanks for that link, and if there's an opportunity to suggest some stats or write background, let me know.
    Now that I've seen it you guys are definitely on the right track - I'll keep my eye open for something I can do.
     
    Last edited: Mar 31, 2018
  11. black_imperator

    black_imperator Emperor

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    Well, there's plenty that can be done, whether xml, pedia work or more ^^.

    For pedia work, see the thread dedicated to it in the forum. For the rest, just ask and i'll find you something to do ^^
     
  12. Makkah

    Makkah Chieftain

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    Thanks so much for those reviews! So great people are still playing and enjoying this modmod. Is there any Discord for the community?
     
  13. black_imperator

    black_imperator Emperor

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  14. jackelgull

    jackelgull An aberration of nature

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    For some reason I can't research Way of the Earthmother, it's blocked to me as the Khazads?
     
  15. black_imperator

    black_imperator Emperor

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    it may be due to an hidden option. Have you run a play now game? (you should do one when switching mods or going from vanilla to mod or mod to vanilla)
     
  16. avien

    avien Chieftain

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    Nothing happens when I run the launcher :( I've followed the instructions.
     
  17. PPQ_Purple

    PPQ_Purple Techpriest Engineer

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    If you can't make the game launch from the launcher no matter what try loading the mod manually through the game.
     
  18. black_imperator

    black_imperator Emperor

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    Did that ever get fixed ? (sorry, i was on a business trip the last dozen days, been a bit distracted ^^)
     
  19. Calavente

    Calavente Richard's voice

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    I re-read the dev diary on units : for dragoon : did we already mentionned Cataphract ? (a knight-archer of the bysantium empire)
    for tier IV alignement units... no more ideas than the ones that were proposed a while ago.
     
  20. PPQ_Purple

    PPQ_Purple Techpriest Engineer

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    Cataphracts weren't horse archers. Although they were often employed in conjunction with and in combined formations with horse archers. They were a form of heavy cavalry. Similar to the mounted knight.
     

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