Ghandhi (EC) Emperor Cookbook! Let the fun begin.

I thought Gumbolt's post said he hoped everyone wouldn't just vote for the best saves all the time. We probably should agree what the aim of this exercise is otherwise we will all be at cross-purposes.

I chose the saves that were interesting and solid, but not so uber-powerful that it becomes a cruise.

I agree we should agree...
 
I agree we should agree...

What do we learn if we vote for the strongest save on the first round? Lets vote for an interesting save early on. That being said the people who chose early wars could have negative diplomatic points which could also impact a save. End of day Toku and Monty capitals are so strong it would be hard to lose from a decent rush by 1500bc.

In later rounds we may well go for the strongest saves to finish the game.

The cookbook is meant as a learning game. By playing from a peaceful save we might learn more from this. If the majority want a strong save to play from I wont stop people but its not best way to move up the ladder. That being said this map was ideal for an early rush with our UU and so much forest.
 
here is a thought. how about we play the weakest safe and try to safe the game with stongest from then on.
 
I didn't vote the saves which contain an early war (Gumbolt, Theboot, CY, kjellea, Yakidk - this probably the strongest save of all) simple 'cause I'd prefer to play this game in the peaceful way (and with the difficult diplomacy that will arise soon) almost early.

1st - mjg5591: 4 good cities and very good exploration. Soon you'll have pottery. (Maybe only 3 workers is the downside)

2nd - grimlok: I don't agree with copper's city position (I think it'd be better 1S or 1NE)but good techs (Pottery and Writing already finished), I'd research Masonry at this point instead of Math. You could do better with exploration.

3rd - Joyodongo: 4 good cities and good tech choices. Maybe you have to hook up horses and marble yet and maybe you could do better with exploration. It's a pity the barb's jungle city.


My other comment:

GreatEngIneer: Very interesting original religion approach. I think it's a very good save, thought I didn't vote for it only 'cause it's not the kind of game I wish to play.

John Edwards: It's seem me a strong save, but it's an approach a bit too different from the kind of game I wish to play

MaximumPain: It's a solid start, but I don't like that you didn't got copper and adopted a religion.

Lymond: I agree with Bombay's position and good job gotting SH, but loosing the copper it's a bit too weak.

Softnum: As Harbourboy has already said

AlejDuke: I don't agree with your tech choices (Archery? writing already finished but not agri/POTTERY and far from Masonry). Not great exploration

Toranth: 4 cities but not the best spots IMHO (the jungle's city and not the horses/marble). I don't agree with your tech choiches (archery when there is copper avalaible and no pottery yet). Very good exploration instead.

Harbourboy: Good cities, nice the Oracle so close, but I don't like missing Agri/Pottery. You could do better with exploration.
 
here is a thought. how about we play the weakest safe and try to safe the game with stongest from then on.

I dont think pointing out the weakest save is the way forward and it may well scare people off the cookbook in future. . We need to encourage people to up their games from Monarch to Emperor level. By browsing all the saves this is a great way to see how people do things differently.

I like the idea of trying from a peaceful save this round. We could then consider a catapult/swords/HA rush next round if need be. See where people take the save.
 
My votes and responses.

Gumbolt - Nice rush on monty, his capital is a monster GPFarm.

Alejduke - Has nice city placement, has archery. No pottery though. Could have explored more.

Toranth - 4 cities although jungle city will take long time before can improve. Should have gone north for horses/marble site. Very good exploring. No pottery or writing.

Grymlog - 3 cities although don't like copper site 1 of coast. Ok exploring and nice tech rate early.

Theboot - WOW 5 cities, really crippling economy here though. war with monty. Again copper site 1 of coast. Does have GK and monty blocked though.

Kjellea - GK is dead. His capital makes nice HE site which is unlocked. Nice exploring, Pottery and writing in.

Great engineer - 3 cities nice placement. Oracle in 8 turns. No pottery or writing though. GK is in WHEOOHRN. More exploring. Only save who went religion first. Nice different save.

CH Yank - Nice beaker count early pottery and writing in. War with GK. Nice exploring.

Softnum - Nice exploring but hasn't met HC yet. No writing. But no copper site either.

CBPE - 3 cities nice placement. 4th city soon. SH. ok exploring. Why poly though, writing needed more.

Joyodongo - 4 cities and nice locations. Has scout out exploring. Writing in 16.

Lymond - Nice early teching here also. Pottery and writing in. Monty is in WHEOOHRN though. No copper site and need more exploring.

John Edwards - Running seperate religion. Only 2 cities, but settler coming soon. But has SH and oralce. Col form oracle. Also already has shrine. No pottery.

Maximpain - Monty is in WHEOOHRN. Nice teching here though. 4 cities but need more exploring. Running Budda. No copper site.

Harbour Boy - 3 cities settler aslready heading west of capital. Nice exploration. Oracle due in 10 turns. No pottery or writing though.

Yakidk - Last but not least. Strong save here. 5 cities. Toku is dead and soon have the gems.Nice exploring and 7 fast workers already. HE unlocked. Not yet met HC. Pottery and writing in.

My votes. I am picking peaceful saves here. Althouh Yakidk seems to be the strongest,

1. Lymond - Needs copper site though but tech rate nice. Need watch Monty also.

2. CBPE - Why teching poly? $th city coming soon. SH.

3. Toranth This would have prolly been first if 4th city was placed not in the jungle.

Thought about Softnum, MaximPain and Joyodongo for 3rd also.

john edwards save is strong if you go NSR. Already has the shrine and could run RE. Why i didn't pick it.
 
I don't have time to look at a significant number of the saves myself, so I'll excuse myself from voting. Hope to be able to find time for Round 2 though.

Thanks to all those who have looked at all the saves and made comments though
 
So many games and so many different ways to spend 100 turns. It has been really difficult to choose. I feel like I am one of the judges on MasterChef.

My votes:

1st - CBPE - not too strong and not too weak. No unusual events. Chariots underway.
2nd - MaximumPain - not too strong and not too weak. No unusual events. Chariots underway. Heading for Great Library?
3rd - Toranth - lots of exploring done, solid but not too extreme.

Other comments:
Yak - Really strong position. Too strong for this game. Well done though on an excellent start.
John Edwards - Great progress with Oracle and Code of Laws. Not sure this will always be repeatable in similar situations.
Gumbolt - Great war with Monty. Again, not always repeatable and probably too strong for this game.
Kjellea - well done on killing Khan but too game-breaking for this exercise, in my view.
Softnum - too unfortunate in losing the Settler
TheBoot - 5 cities seems to much for this point in the game. Less ability for us to determine other city placements.
Grymloq - again, great progress, but too strong for this exercise.
Joyodongo - solid start, but not sure what we will do with 7 warriors.

i feel shafted...sniff sniff :confused:
 
i feel shafted...sniff sniff :confused:

I think the unspoken comment Harbour Boy left for you was that your save was so far above and beyond the rest of us that he mistook it for a non-voting shadow save.

:goodjob:
 
The rule is that EVERYONE which has posted a proper save has to vote.

Lets wait and see how end of voting goes. The rule was only put in place to stop people not voting so there save would win a round. I do think you learn more by looking at the saves personally. ;)
 
... The rule was only put in place to stop people not voting so there save would win a round...

Ah - I hadn't thought of that... My save's not in contention anyway so it shouldn't be a problem. I really do think you have to open the saves and take a look to get a good feel for how a player's done.

As people have pointed out, my save's not bad, but the decision to take three workers has angered the neighbours to a probably unacceptable degree in this case. I've never done this before - and I learned that stealing 3 (fast) workers was unneccessary. I really couldn't put them all to good use soon enough. Then of course, there's the obviousl diplo problem. Although funnily enough - I did continue my own game until the early AD's and had no further military action. Things were looking relatively ok - which surprised me. Possibly this is because I had built a decent size military which was about to start wreaking havoc.
 
Ah - I hadn't thought of that... My save's not in contention anyway so it shouldn't be a problem. I really do think you have to open the saves and take a look to get a good feel for how a player's done.

As people have pointed out, my save's not bad, but the decision to take three workers has angered the neighbours to a probably unacceptable degree in this case. I've never done this before - and I learned that stealing 3 (fast) workers was unneccessary. I really couldn't put them all to good use soon enough. Then of course, there's the obviousl diplo problem. Although funnily enough - I did continue my own game until the early AD's and had no further military action. Things were looking relatively ok - which surprised me. Possibly this is because I had built a decent size military which was about to start wreaking havoc.
Not checked the save but you worker stole from 3 ai??? With these neighbours??

Worker stealing has its place in the game and you can pin down an AI for quite a while. Downside is they may spawn lots of archers making a rush a tough ask.

One strategy i would of liked to see was a oracle HBR strategy. Tried it out recently to great success. Was able to rush 2 Ai quite early.

As for voting its not always possible for everyone to vote. Least you made it clear you were not going to vote. You will be more than welcome in the next round. :)
 
Okay just check ChYanks save. Wow you did worker steal off 3 AI. You truly have balls of steel. Also a lot of unhappy neighbours. it might almost be worth playing this one for the challenge. I do thinking rushing one of them might have to be an option before they all DOW out of spite.

Had a look at lymond save. there was no rush there but Sh is always useful especially if you capture monty holy city. Minor issue here is monty is on a war footing against someone. Axes asap!!! Monty's resourceless UU will be an issue.
 
Okay just check ChYanks save. Wow you did worker steal off 3 AI. You truly have balls of steel. Also a lot of unhappy neighbours. it might almost be worth playing this one for the challenge. I do thinking rushing one of them might have to be an option before they all DOW out of spite.

It might be more "brain of lead" than bollocks of steel, but I'll tell you the idea I had that I kept going with for round 2...

It's not an approach I've tried before, but my thinking was with the situation we're in to play it like an "always war" game. Primarily a large defensive military and a series of limited invasions to add territory 1 or 2 cities at a time in whichever direction was most advantageous.

I'm not sure how this would work longer term, but it seemed to be kind of working early on. It's probably not the optimal strategy, but like I said, when I saw the lay of the land and the neighbours, I thought - why not try something a little unorthodox?

As far as to whether it's worth continuing for the series or not - I would say probably not, as most will want to play a save that retains a better diplomatic option so there's more flexibility.
 
There is a general misconception that "rushing" one of the AI's even if succesfull gives you an obvious immediate edge.

Though we got it at as an advantage neither of our three direct neighbours are potential mid-late powerhouses, the chances of mass hate and own limited development are pretty severe and real.
No matter what, having 2 or even 3 simultaneous DoW on you, will break the game.

Therefor do not purposely vote on "lesser" saves, or non agressive saves. Just try to figure out which save offers the best for the future. Doing this, will not only improve your own game, but shows you what is possible and how to proceed by building on such an advantage.
 
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