Greatest Naval Commander in History

[Glassfan]

I would only object to including "One Hit Wonders", Commanders who were victorious in one big battle only and then go home. Success over time - several victories, victorious campaigns, several wars even, undefeated over a career, that makes a great commander.

In baseball, if you go to bat once, get a base hit, and then retire, then you have a "1000" batting average. Are you truely the greatest hitter ever? Or is it the .350 hitter over a 20 year career?

 

[Tank_Guy#3]

I would only object to including "One Hit Wonders", Commanders who were victorious in one big battle only and then go home. Success over time - several victories, victorious campaigns, several wars even, undefeated over a career, that makes a great commander.

In baseball, if you go to bat once, get a base hit, and then retire, then you have a "1000" batting average. Are you truely the greatest hitter ever? Or is it the .350 hitter over a 20 year career?

In this case, it would be some guy off the street getting a hit from a major league pitcher to go along with your analogy, as like I stated before Themistocles was a politician not a career sailor.

Oh, and he did fight two major battles against the Persian fleet. So not quite a one hit wonder, but I understand what you're getting at.

 

[vogtmurr]

Themistocles has to be considered one of the greatest - for his persuasiveness in setting it up, not just fighting it. Convincing a city to commit its resources and manpower to the navy in the first place, when its allies were uncertain; then forcing the allied fleet and tricking the Persians into a decisive battle at Salamis. Can your typical naval commander do more than that ? The fleet that fought at Artemisium was actually considerably less experienced than the Persians.

Yi-sun Shin of Korea was the greatest naval commander in history, Nelson was the second. ...... "It is always difficult for Englishmen to admit that Nelson ever had an equal in his profession, but if any man is entitled to be so regarded, it should be this great naval commander "

Ballard says he could be considered equal, not better. Proportionately speaking they both won stunning victories. Korea had less of a naval tradition maybe than Britain in Nelson's time, but their ships were quite superior to anything the Japanese had. I also have great respect for Yi Sun-Sin but lest we forget; Nelson defied orders on every occasion to achieve his amazing feats at Cape St. Vincent, completely destroy the French fleet at the Nile, and capture the Baltic fleet at Copenhagen; not to mention a long list of escapades before that. He lost an arm, an eye, and finally his life achieving the greatest naval victory in the age of fighting sail; against a fleet that was superior in numbers and firepower.

Bombardment of Copenhagen?

Not heroic.

Real problem with those 18th C naval skippers was their greed for prize money.

I don't get it - he did not 'bombard Copenhagen'. He engaged warships and shore batteries at great risk, to prevent a large naval fleet falling in to the hands of the enemy. Furthermore he was not the senior commander there - but he made it happen. It was considered one of the most difficult battles of his career, and resulted in an armistice with the crown of Denmark, not the bombardment of their city.

 

[GoodGame]

Nelson

 

[Cheezy the Wiz]

"Some would say not a great seaman, but a great leader." - some dude on Nelson in Master and Commander

 

[J-man]

Michiel de Ruyter. Scored several mayor victories, even when he was outnumbered.

 

[Dachs]

Lysandros wasn't a one-hit wonder. Aigospotamoi was the culmination of a series of naval and political campaigns by him to destroy the Athenian overseas empire. It may have been his greatest victory, but this was also the dude who finally built a stable alliance with the Achaemenids, and who scuttled the Athenians' best chance to reconquer the rebellious Ionian cities at Notion. Not that I'm saying the dude was OMG WONDARFAL JEENYUS or anything.

Whoever the "Greatest Naval Commander" was, he wasn't British.

 

[Cheezy the Wiz]

Togo Heihachiro probably deserves at least a mention.

 

[LightSpectra]

The candidates for the best commander have all been listed; but the ballsiest one is undeniably Stephen Halden Beattie during Operation Chariot.

 

[ParkCungHee]

Togo Heihachiro probably deserves at least a mention.

The Togo Turn was impressive, but he certainly falls under one hit wonders.

 

[Heraclius49]

The candidates for the best commander have all been listed; but the ballsiest one is undeniably Stephen Halden Beattie during Operation Chariot.

No Farragut is the ballsiest. Just saying

One really good commander that has not mention was Hayrettin Barbarossa. He was the scourge of the Mediterranean and was feared by every Christian nation with a port in the Mediterranean. He a big battle or two (as far as I know). He also trained many future great Muslim pirates/Naval commanders.

 

[vogtmurr]

Whoever the "Greatest Naval Commander" was, he wasn't British.

Why not. seems like a logical place to look for one does it not ?

"Some would say not a great seaman, but a great leader." - some dude on Nelson in Master and Commander

In terms of seamanship he is considered one of the finest; but he had a lifelong struggle with seasickness, maybe that's what they are referring to.

 

[Dachs]

For the same reason that the Greatest Team in Basketball History was not Russell's Celtics.

 

[vogtmurr]

sorry I'm not up on the NBA - but it sounds like you have a bias against people being biased. Simple matter is - Nelson, and Yi sun-Sin both have a lot going for them to deserve that distinction. And de Ruyter would be very close, who else do you have in mind ?

 

[Dachs]

I dunno, I don't think too seriously about these questions.

 

[Cheezy the Wiz]

In terms of seamanship he is considered one of the finest; but he had a lifelong struggle with seasickness, maybe that's what they are referring to.

Well the comment came after a crew member quoted him: "Forget the maneuvers, just sail straight at them!" so I think they were probably referring to his lack of tactical finesse, not his sensitive stomach.

 

[7ronin]

Nimitz was a theater commander. He never led a fleet in battle.

Vice Admiral Charles A. Lockwood should be considered. Little known, he had a decisive influence on the war against Japan through his direction and leadership of the U.S. Pacific Submarine Force.

Otherwise, I would probably go with Nelson. Although, Cap'n Jack Sparrow comes close.

 

[LightSpectra]

I don't know about Spruance. I've read a few sources about him, which alternate between praising him as some sort of fantastic military genius, and praising him for being impossibly lucky.

 

[Dachs]

Both of those traits are pretty important to any great military commander.

 

[privatehudson]

Bombardment of Copenhagen?

Not heroic.

I just wanted to add something to what vogtmurr pointed out on this remark:

It would be rather difficult to pin the blame for the bombardment of Copenhagen on Nelson given that it took place two years after he was killed at Trafalgar. Bear in mind that there are two battles of Copenhagen during the Napoleonic wars (1801 and 1807) and the bombardment followed the second, not the first.