Gun Show Undercover

[FriendlyFire]

Gun Show Undercover

Today, New York City is releasing the results of a multi-state investigation into this activity: "Gun Show Undercover." We sent investigators with hidden cameras to seven gun shows across Ohio, Tennessee and Nevada, and we found out just how easy it is for criminals and the mentally ill to walk in and buy guns -- no questions asked.

Our investigator tells a seller that he "probably couldn't pass" a background check and tests a gun.

19 out of 30 private sellers made the sale.

These so-called private sellers are supposed to be making only occasional sales. According to federal law, they cannot be "engaged in the business" of selling firearms

http://www.nyc.gov/gunshow
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/michael-bloomberg/gun-show-undercover_b_312339.html

Selling AK47 and Famas is unamerican that gun dealer should be ashamed of himself.
I demand a four part series on fox news and tea parties.

(Thats so looks so awesome I would love to goto these gun shows.)

 

[Heretic_Cata]

SHOCKING

No wait, it isn't.

 

[IglooDame]

Ah, Mayor Bloomberg. Perhaps if your city didn't have a de facto ban on handguns we'd take your disclaimer that you're not trying to detract from anyone's Second Amendment rights at face value. But instead, stand by for SCOTUS to clear things up for you a little.

 

[Ecofarm]

It's absurd that gun-shows are exempt from doing background checks (and observing wait periods). I've always thought so.

 

[uppi]

Obviously, criminals need access to guns, so that there can never be any evidence of gun control working.

 

[.Shane.]

Ah, Mayor Bloomberg. Perhaps if your city didn't have a de facto ban on handguns we'd take your disclaimer that you're not trying to detract from anyone's Second Amendment rights at face value. But instead, stand by for SCOTUS to clear things up for you a little.

Wrong and right.

Wrong in that current precedent tells us that the NYC ban is not a violation of the 2A. It does not apply to cities. (or maybe I misunderstood what you wrote?)

Right in that the SCOTUS is most likely about to change this.... the question is to what degree.

 

[JohnRM]

I've been to enough gun shows to know that there is a serious lack of protection for the public against individuals, of a questionable, obtaining firearms with little or no delay. What bothers me the most is how some politically-motivated persons use the Second Amendment and Right to Bear Arms to justify their illegal activity, which is based almost entirely on their desire to make money rather than to prop up any particular Right of the People.

That said, the United States sells more guns to people abroad, who would not qualify to legally purchase them here, than all of the jackasses in these cases, combined.

 

[.Shane.]

That said, the United States sells more guns to people abroad, who would not qualify to legally purchase them here, than all of the jackasses in these cases, combined.

Pardon my ignorance, but if you have time can you elaborate? Thanks...

 

[JohnRM]

Pardon my ignorance, but if you have time can you elaborate? Thanks...

We've armed...

*Saddam Hussien's Iraq with chemical weapons against Iran and the Iraqi Kurds.
*Al Qaeda and other religious fanatics with weapons against the Soviet Union and the Communist Afghan Gov't.
*Adolf Hitler's German war machine prior to World War II.
*Various dictators and brutal death squads up and down Central and South America.

Need I go on?

Disclaimer; Russia, France, the UK, and most other countries have also done this from time to time.

 

[illram]

It seems like we all agree that this weird gun show loophole is questionable and possibly a bad thing? I've always wondered why gun shows basically get to go around the laws regular shops have to follow.

 

[.Shane.]

We've armed...

*Saddam Hussien's Iraq with chemical weapons against Iran and the Iraqi Kurds.
*Al Qaeda and other religious fanatics with weapons against the Soviet Union and the Communist Afghan Gov't.
*Adolf Hitler's German war machine prior to World War II.
*Various dictators and brutal death squads up and down Central and South America.

Need I go on?

Disclaimer; Russia, France, the UK, and most other countries have also done this from time to time.

Wasn't sure, before, if you meant private sales or you were alluding to this. While I'm not going to agree on the point by point, overall, I understand what you are saying.

 

[IglooDame]

It's absurd that gun-shows are exempt from doing background checks (and observing wait periods). I've always thought so.

Personally I've always thought that mandatory wait periods were pretty stupid in the first place. I'm perfectly okay with - actually, I support - background checks required of/by FFLs (and those that should be FFLs via selling as a business). But the people that want to close the "gun show loophole" are in many cases simply looking to get the gun shows closed down completely by requiring the waiting periods as well as the background checks.

Wrong and right.

Wrong in that current precedent tells us that the NYC ban is not a violation of the 2A. It does not apply to cities. (or maybe I misunderstood what you wrote?)

Right in that the SCOTUS is most likely about to change this.... the question is to what degree.

You might have misunderstood - yes, I'm aware that the 2A is still unincorporated against states and cities. But clearly Mayor Bloomberg isn't concerned with 2A rights in the first place, despite his protestations, else there would be NYC gun control laws that he would actually oppose.

 

[Ecofarm]

We've armed...

*Saddam Hussien's Iraq with chemical weapons against Iran and the Iraqi Kurds.

No dude. We sold him enough agricultural grade anthrax to innoculate Iraq's cattle. This was required under the agreements of sanctions. If we did not provide the innoculation, we would have been branded mass murderers for letting the country's herds die and we would have violated the stipulations of the sanctions.

Saddam managed to hide and then refine the anthrax during a time period when NO international inspections were being allowed.

Get your facts straight before spewing this kind of crap.

*Al Qaeda and other religious fanatics with weapons against the Soviet Union and the Communist Afghan Gov't.

Bin Laden probably wasnt even alive and AQ didn't exist then.

*Adolf Hitler's German war machine prior to World War II.

No more than anyone else. We had no way of knowing he would completely lose his mind anymore than anyone else.

*Various dictators and brutal death squads up and down Central and South America.

Small factions of SOME of the freedom fighters we supplied went nuts. Big deal.

I hope you don't believe what you wrote. If you do, then you need a new fact source.

 

[Leonel]

It doesn't matter if the gun is Russian or French, guns are guns and the mere ownership of one is American enough!

 

[Bugfatty300]

It's absurd that gun-shows are exempt from doing background checks (and observing wait periods). I've always thought so.

Only federal firearm dealers have to follow those dumb laws.

Dealers at gun shows don't have any special exemption.

 

[Ecofarm]

Dealers at gun shows do have special exemptions. At least in Florida.

Go to a gun show and get a gun... no background check. Any gun show in Florida. If I go to a store that sells guns... background check. But at the show? "Put it in ma han, lil man" and off you go. Maybe the wait is not reasonable, but the background check is (heck, walmart can manage a background check).

 

[Flying Pig]

Maybe there should be some sort of certificate of having had a background check that you could present? It's a bit craxy to make people at a gun show chase up the police for every customer, but equally crazy to just give the things out

 

[Bugfatty300]

Dealers at gun shows do have special exemptions. At least in Florida.

Go to a gun show and get a gun... no background check. Any gun show in Florida. If I go to a store that sells guns... background check. But at the show? "Put it in ma han, lil man" and off you go. Maybe the wait is not reasonable, but the background check is (heck, walmart can manage a background check).

Federal law is pretty clear on this Eco.

Licensed dealers MUST have the buyer complete a 4473 and then do a NICS background check over the phone and then register the purchase on their books.

Yes they do this at gun shows. They bring their forms and do the background check with their cell phones. If they don't do this then they are committing a federal felony and can go to prison for a long long time.

There is no exemptions to this. It doesn't matter if he is selling the gun in a store, in the parking lot, in his home or at a gun show. Its federal law.

I don't care what Florida says or does.

Now, as I said before, private sellers (people without a license) are exempt from this. But as the article says making a living off of selling guns without a license is also a serious federal crime.

 

[Mad Man]

Oh GOD I need to get to one of these things!!!!!!!

 

[Bugfatty300]

If you enjoy criminally-high priced ammo and guns then a gun show is the right place to go. On top of that you have to pay just to get in to browse the stuff.

I went to one once and that was enough. I think I'll just stick to normal stores and buying online.