History questions not worth their own thread IV

[Crezth]

Y'know. it would really help if people, y'know, could read a little better. As you quoted yourself: Ho didn't pursue a hardline Commmunist line in Vietnam until after it was clear to him that the US weren't going to support an independent Vietnam.

Indeed: by irrelevance. Let me repeat again: Ho's intentions were always focused on an independent Vietnam, before and after he joined the Communist party.

Source missing.

What? He asked you a question. Let me paraphrase:

Misquoted. Oh wait, there isn't even a quote in there... Alot of misparaphrasing though. And followed by a misconclusion. Does that mean you've given up argueing?

What Masada said you said: "To be precise, you argued that it was only after American blew him off that he 'become a Commie'."

What you actually said:

*Fun fact: Ho Chi Minh actually wanted the US to support his independence movement, but got blown off; it was only after this that he turned Commy. So in the end the US produced their own Communist threat in Vietnam.

Well, at least things can't get any stu-

Brilliant argument.

Thanks.

 

[LightSpectra]

At work I just had a phone call where I literally had to scream every letter in my email address to a gentleman that was hard of hearing and had lapses of memory mid-conversation. Awfully funny how that got mirrored here...

 

[Symphony D.]

Let me repeat again: Ho's intentions were always focused on an independent Vietnam, before and after he joined the Communist party. What the rest of your rant has to do with anthing said is beyond me.

No. Stop moving your position. You just said:

Now if Ho would have been pursueing a hardline Communist policy in Vietnam from the start, there would have been little point in trying to get US support for it - either after WW I or WW II.

You just said that Ho Chi Minh was not pursuing a hardline communist policy from the start.

You just said that he did not pursue a hardline communist policy until after being rebuffed repeatedly by the US.

You just said that Ho Chi Minh did not become a hardline communist until 1947.

You seem to be unable to distinguish between two concurrent arguments that are occurring. What Ho Chi Minh wanted for Vietnam is not what I am questioning. I am questioning your hilarious assertion that he was not a hardline communist until 1947. You have repeatedly stated this position and then totally failed to back it up every single time.

You just said he could not have been a hardline communist prior to 1947 simply by virtue of the fact that he tried to work with the US.

This is what the words that you have said mean. You are not Mitt Romney. You do not get to say things and then pretend you didn't a post later.

Hold a position and stick to it or stop arguing and concede your point.

 

[Agent327]

Sigh... I guess it's really true what that 19th century writer said: "Reading is dif-fi-cult."

(I snipped the other irrelevant bits)

What Masada said you said: "To be precise, you argued that it was only after American blew him off that he 'become a Commie'."

Which is exactly the point. Last time:

Ho approached Wilson after WW I (never got an audience). 1922 Ho joins CP (in Europe). After WW II Ho again approaches US for support (US prefers to support France, so again no go). So yeah, big surprise the Vietcong rely on Communist support for the liberation of Vietnam from the French.

I fail to see how I am "shifting position" anywhere.

Last misquote:

You just said that Ho Chi Minh did not become a hardline communist until 1947.

Not really: I said if.

 

[Flying Pig]

Not really: I said if.

'If he would have been pursuing' implies 'he was not pursuing' - the correct way to suggest 'he was pursuing' is 'since he had pursued...'. So you really did.

 

[Symphony D.]

So yeah, big surprise the Vietcong rely on Communist support for the liberation of Vietnam from the French.

Again asserting the Vietcong and Ho Chi Minh were not dedicated communists until 1947 when US support was out of the question. You keep all-but stating this, and then come back and use a bunch of weasel words and qualifiers to say that you're not. Back it up with some sources or stop talking. You're not Winner either, you don't get to make up facts and act like they're true.

 

[Masada]

Ho approached Wilson after WW I (never got an audience). 1922 Ho joins CP (in Europe). After WW II Ho again approaches US for support (US prefers to support France, so again no go).

Irrelevant.

So yeah, big surprise the Vietcong rely on Communist support for the liberation of Vietnam from the French.

So Ho wasn't a Communist?

 

[GoodGame]

Ignoring the lack of material potential, how close was WW2 Germany to discovering how to build an atomic bomb (or 'Davy Crockett' recoilless rifle)?

 

[Cutlass]

As I understand it, not very. But not for lack of ability. Germany had back-burnered the program on the belief that the war wouldn't last long enough for it to pay off.

 

[bombshoo]

Ignoring the lack of material potential, how close was WW2 Germany to discovering how to build an atomic bomb (or 'Davy Crockett' recoilless rifle)?

Very far off. Their science was totally wrong. There is a bit of a myth that the German scientists purposefully sabotaged the efforts because of moral resistance. This is false. The captive German scientists were bugged and Heisenberg himself thought the A-bomb needed way more uranium than was necessary. He thought it might be possible, but he wasn't going to make a promise to Hitler he couldn't keep.

 

[r16]

if you are really into the La La Land , the Japanese were far ahead of the Germans .

 

[Flying Pig]

Very far off. Their science was totally wrong. There is a bit of a myth that the German scientists purposefully sabotaged the efforts because of moral resistance. This is false. The captive German scientists were bugged and Heisenberg himself thought the A-bomb needed way more uranium than was necessary. He thought it might be possible, but he wasn't going to make a promise to Hitler he couldn't keep.

Not to mention that the Germans frequently had to deal with their major research facilities - particularly a Norwegian heavy-water plant - being blown up by the Allies in various ways, something which the Manhattan Project did not have to worry about.

What were the main reasons for Nazi Germany claiming New Swabia out of Antarctica?

...do you really need to ask 'why did Hitler do grandoise but pointless things?'

 

[LightSpectra]

What were the main reasons for Nazi Germany claiming New Swabia out of Antarctica?

 

[Dachs]

What were the main reasons for Nazi Germany claiming New Swabia out of Antarctica?

Hitler wanted to build a secret U-boat base there.

 

[LightSpectra]

I assume that didn't happen because it was impractical?

 

[Cheezy the Wiz]

Hitler wanted to build a secret U-boat base there.

You're thinking of Yuri's secret mind control base.

 

[History_Buff]

I assume that didn't happen because it was impractical?

That, and they didn't get back until the spring of '39. They couldn't have even started on such a project until the winter (antarctic spring), but by then, the war was on. I doubt anyone would have pressed on, given Germany's inferior presence in the Atlantic.

 

[Cheezy the Wiz]

Good point, The River Plate had already happened by that point.

 

[GoodGame]

What's your favorite b'ak'tun?

 

[Dachs]

I assume that didn't happen because it was impractical?

I was actually joking. I don't know why the Nazis laid claim to it other than "we need to participate in this sort of thing or we suck" mentality.