Is this the Atheist Fanatics Forums Off-Topic?

[Winner]

I noticed you yourself avoided an outright statement: God does not exist, my dear fellow agnostic.

Time to rectify that:

I am sure that the Judeo-Christian God doesn't exist, as his description in Jewish, Christian and Islamic tradition is contradictory to the findings of modern science, ego this God has been disproved.

It is theoretically possible that a God-creator as an intelligent entity which somehow created this universe and then left it to its own devices exists (or existed), though I find that idea excessive and useless, since even if such entity existed, there would be no way how to observe it from within this universe.

Wiki says: "Theism, in this specific sense, conceives of God as personal and active in the governance and organization of the world and the universe."

Such a God doesn't exist, ergo I am an a-theist.

 

[illram]

Why cannot you know? When you say you cannot know, you give up on the concept of rational, scientifically explainable Universe. That's not acceptable and it's dangerously close to a religion.

In a way I just think the entire question is silly and pointless because you don't know whether you will ever know one way or the other. And knowing the answer might not even really be relevant.

I mean on the one hand, there are things in life you can be sure of to such a degree that questioning them is not only pointless, but a little strange. For instance I am 99.9999% certain that there is a coffee cup next to my computer screen.

There are other things where even how you ask the question is extremely difficult if not impossible. How can I even begin to fathom the idea of something that is everywhere, all the time, controlling or not controlling everything in dimensions of existence that I can't even perceive, or that I may not even be aware of? Even if I wanted to know this thing existed, or that it didn't exist, I wouldn't know what questions to ask or how to find the answers. If the answer was given I might not even realize that is the answer.

To me, believing that you "know" the answer one way or another involves making an assumption. Now assuming things isn't always bad, for instance although I cannot see my cat right now I am assuming he is still alive, as any other assumption would not be very productive or rational based on the information I currently have. I know nothing other than when I left my house this morning, I fed the cat, and the cat was alive and healthy, and my house was not in any immediate danger of being destroyed. Ergo assuming my cat is still alive, even though I am not totally certain he is alive, is the rational thing to do.

In a personal matter such as this there are a variety of reasons to make the necessary assumptions to come to the necessary conclusions, some of which are eminently reasonable, some of which are downright foolish. But, one must make an assumption regardless. For whatever personal reasons some choose to make that choice regarding the existence of God or some higher power, some do not. For my own personal reasons, most of which would probably bore you and everyone else to death, I have decided to make the choice to not make the choice, because I think making the choice doesn't matter.

 

[civ_king]

ie, being told "Go to church & accept Jesus, or else you'll burn in hell" daily.

I meant the part about homeopathic medicine

 

[Ziggy Stardust]

It is theoretically possible that a God-creator as an intelligent entity which somehow created this universe and then left it to its own devices exists (or existed), though I find that idea excessive and useless, since even if such entity existed, there would be no way how to observe it from within this universe.

This is agnostic.

Wiki says: "Theism, in this specific sense, conceives of God as personal and active in the governance and organization of the world and the universe."

Such a God doesn't exist, ergo I am an a-theist.

This is atheism.

We can shake hands. We're both agnostic atheists We acknowledge there's no way to make a definitive statement on God's existence, but we do not buy into theism.

 

[civ_king]

This is agnostic.

This is atheism.

We can shake hands. We're both agnostic atheists We acknowledge there's no way to make a definitive statement on God's existence, but we do not buy into theism.

then I guess I fall into that category too, scientists are never 100% certain about something, to wait until you are 100% certain of something would mean being paralyzed for ever, scientist are not even 100% certain of the Theory of Gravity, heck they sent up a probe not that long ago trying to find anything to disprove it, only by attempting to tear down your argument can you make it stronger

 

[Death_Machine]

No, thanks. If there's God, there must be proof of his existence. If the religious people can't prove it (by using a scientific method), the God-theory is unsubstantiated and thus irrelevant.

If the nonreligious people can't prove it (by using a scientific method), the Big Bang -theory is unsubstantiated and thus irrelevant.-------------- see how stupid that kind of post is?

I think atheists like to discuss religion more than religious people. Since their central dogma is already established since long ago, there is not that much for them to really discuss. The only religious people that ever actively have tried to convert me is Jehova´s Witnesses, and I like talking with them, since I like to argue about religion.

Dead ass wrong. There are many people of different faiths, and even those among different factions of the same faith who have great discussions and disagreements on dogma.

Yes, this is the Atheist Fanatics Forums Off-Topic. Flawless logic:

1. People who play video games tend to be nerdy.
2. Nerds are smarter than average.
3. As intelligence increases, religiousness tends to decrease.

1. While this stereotype may have been true @ one time I think you are totally off base right now. All kinds of people play video games, dummies, regular folks, and nerds.
2. Somebody could suck at school but have total dominant Star Trek knowledge & be a D&D master, yet they're a nerd. So now we have a second faulty premise on the heels of your first.
3. Is this your opinion?

Biologists are a better authority on this topic than priests, don't you think?

(Are you a Creationist?)

The person we were talking about has a Masters Degree in Biology, so I guess I was talking about the authority, eh?

I am a creationist.

DM, this isn't a creation/evolution thread. Take it outside.

I responded directly to the poster who introduced the idea, and you're not a mod, so you take it outside & then leave it there.

Isn´t that the point of a religious faith? That is it very hard to prove or disprove? I didn´t attack her religious faith here though, I attacked her Biblical Young Earth Creationist beliefs.

Maybe I'm missing something here, but aren't the 2 the same in her case?

 

[El_Machinae]

I am a creationist.

Really?

What type? "The world is only a few thousand years old, and there was a world-spanning Flood"? Or the "God created individual species over the course of tens of millions of years"?

I wasn't expecting more Creationists! How come you're a Creationist?

 

[Bill3000]

2. Somebody could suck at school but have total dominant Star Trek knowledge & be a D&D master, yet they're a nerd. So now we have a second faulty premise on the heels of your first.

Those are geeks, not nerds. (It's possible to be both.)

 

[Winner]

If the nonreligious people can't prove it (by using a scientific method), the Big Bang -theory is unsubstantiated and thus irrelevant.-------------- see how stupid that kind of post is?

Saying that there is no evidence supporting the Big Bang theory is... well, immensely stupid to begin with.

 

[El_Machinae]

Time to stop with the insults, okay?

 

[Ziggy Stardust]

edit: Nevermind

Good night and drive safely!

 

[Death_Machine]

Really?

What type? "The world is only a few thousand years old, and there was a world-spanning Flood"? Or the "God created individual species over the course of tens of millions of years"?

I wasn't expecting more Creationists! How come you're a Creationist?

I am a creationist because I believe in intelligent design. I do not subscribe to some kind of chaos/big bang theory, nor to I believe that we are descended from monkeys or apes. I believe in God & it is my testimony that he sent his only son down here on this rock to die for our sins.

I don't spout off in these topics too much because I don't dig anybody trying to tell me what's what when they don't know any more about the afterlife (or lack thereof) than anybody else who hasn't died does.

My faith (even as weak as it is) is based on observing my mother. She converted to her religion as an adult and her faith was like a rock. If anybody is genuinely interested in this they can PM me.

Those are geeks, not nerds.

I defer to your expertise in this matter.

Saying that there is no evidence supporting the Big Bang theory is... well, immensely stupid to begin with.

Are you really going to make a statement like that given our teeny tiny knowledge of the universe?

 

[El_Machinae]

"Intelligent Design", as in the idea that there are components of biology that could not be arranged through natural means, and had to be placed deliberately?

I cannot think of any examples of intelligent design that haven't been disproven. Why do you believe in it?

 

[Winner]

Are you really going to make a statement like that given our teeny tiny knowledge of the universe?

Big Bang theory make sense, it fits to our knowledge of Universe's past and present and there is a plenty of evidence suggesting this theory is right.

In science, every theory can be disproved/adjusted in time, because in science all concepts are open to re-examination and review.

Religion is just a dogma, a rigid, unchanging set of primitive superstitions codified centuries ago by pseudo-prophets. It explains nothing and it can't even justify its own existence.

 

[Death_Machine]

"Intelligent Design", as in the idea that there are components of biology that could not be arranged through natural means, and had to be placed deliberately?

I cannot think of any examples of intelligent design that haven't been disproven. Why do you believe in it?

Before I go on about why I believe in it, how about you show me some examples where it has been disproven.

 

[Moss]

Before I go on about why I believe in it, how about you show me some examples where it has been disproven.

Fossil evidence is one example.

 

[Death_Machine]

Big Bang theory make sense, it fits to our knowledge of Universe's past and present and there is a plenty of evidence suggesting this theory is right.

Ok, so given our limited knowledge of our solar system & our even infinitesimal knowledge of the universe I suppose damn near any theory could be put forth & not disproven.

 

[Death_Machine]

Fossil evidence is one example.

Dude, Miles Tag is gonna jump on your ass, don't you know this isn't an evolution thread?

The fossil record does nothing at all to disprove intelligent design. In fact some might even say it strengthens the proof of it.

 

[Mowque]

No, this board is actually less anti-religion then some I've wandered across. Also, us religious people are too touchy...

 

[Aegis]

I meant the part about homeopathic medicine

Ah. That means that he can worship/observe a deity in his own way and does not need the Religious folks to come around proselytizing/ranting.