Master Map Change Thread

[BenZL43]

Oh, by the way, if anyone wonder why this is too swarmed at around the Fiji area.. well let me share a secret: This is based on the map Rhye give. There was already Vanuatu, New Caledonia, Fiji, Tuvalu, and FS Micronesia in the map. So I try to fit everything it between.

What make it worst, in the original Rhye's map, the Tuvalu are far too west, and Solomon Is. + New Caledonia was far too east. That's why the area between Fiji to Samoa is too cramped.

If we want to like, erase all the islands in the Pacific and starts anew, it won't looks as awkward as this.
Too bad I lost that "accurate version" I sketch in the beginning ._.
Note that this will require the Rapa Nui to be moved little bit more south and more east to give space for French Polynesian; unless we add 1-2 columns in the Pacific.

 

[Oregon Lee]

You should when you created a map, lest the map could look awkward in one end and beautiful in other end.

This is map change not map total makeover. It is way too big of a task to think of redoing the entire map.

What does BFC stands for? I often sees that in forum, but never understand. Ahaha.

City Radius. AKA Big Fat Cross

In this case, I use some of the adjacent islands as resource island, where the Western Samoa and Niue acts as resource sources for Manu'a, and Bora-Bora for Tahiti. It is done so not all of Polynesian resources are fishes or crabs. Probably we should put jungles there to indicate it isn't meant to be settled down there.

The AI can't improve islands, nor would the player ever want to settle several islands when one overpowered city could do.

 

[merijn_v1]

The AI can't improve islands, nor would the player ever want to settle several islands when one overpowered city could do.

It won't be a problem that the AI can't improve them, because IIRC Leoreth decided that Polynesia will be human player only.

The human players isn't supposed to settle all the islands. They only have to settle 1 island and then they can get the resources in the BFC by improvements.
Look at the screenshot in post 475. If you settle Fiji, you could get the improvements on Vanuatu, Western Samoa and North New Caledonia.

Probably we should put jungles there to indicate it isn't meant to be settled down there.

But then it's also impossible to improve them until biology or when the required improvement is a plantation.

 

[Oregon Lee]

I don't like how it looks, regardless of arguments you can give.

 

[Leoreth]

I don't like how it looks, regardless of arguments you can give.

Best argument.

 

[AtlantaMarty]

I know you already said you didn't think this was necessary Leoreth, but I beg you to read this post and reconsider:

I was playing around in world builder and I shifted the americas 2 tiles right to simulate adding 2 columns to the pacific, because actually adding 2 columns to the map requires recompiling the DLL, and I don't have the software or skills for that. After doing that, the pacific felt so much better and less cluttered. I tested it by moving Babylon to start Samoa, and then colonized the Pacific, first without the map shift, and then with it. It was so much more fun and engaging and realistic with the 2 extra columns in the Pacific.

It is also worth noting, that when Rhye made the map, he cut some regions off the map, including most of Antarctica (which is fine) and part of the Pacific (which was fine when there were no civs there)

Adding the 2 extra columns would be in effect adding back the regions that were cropped when the pacific wasn't very important to the game, and would also be very good for gameplay.

(It would also have the added benefit of making it harder for Japan, China, Korea, Khmer, and Indonesia to reach the Americas ahistorically early)

 

[merijn_v1]

@ bobby martnen

If you can provide us with a screenshot of your changes, so we can at least compare it to the current situation. Now, we can't see if it's better or worse than the current situation.


@ Benzl

Do you have a WB save of your changed map? I have some ideas I would like to test. But for that, I need the map.

 

[Leoreth]

It is also worth noting, that when Rhye made the map, he cut some regions off the map, including most of Antarctica (which is fine) and part of the Pacific (which was fine when there were no civs there)

But that is exactly the point, Polynesia is only added to populate that part of the map. The map shouldn't accomodate a new civ that isn't even added yet.

 

[BenZL43]

@ Benzl

Do you have a WB save of your changed map? I have some ideas I would like to test. But for that, I need the map.

You won't be able to open that, I think. I'm still at rev 592
Was in the middle of an interesting game since 2 months ago, but don't have enough time to play, probably only 5-10 turns / week

Anyway, I'm updating now, and I'll create the map again and post WB here.

@Bobby Martnen

Please also provide us your savegames of America moving two tiles east as you aforementioned, so we also can try for ourselves

 

[Leoreth]

Changed maps should work between different revisions after 1.11.

 

[BenZL43]

Oh, that's a good news. I'll create the in-game map right now then

Spoiler Don't open :

 

[BenZL43]

Here's the savegames, latest revision.
I tried to create this one as accurate as possible, and (I think I) move around all the pre-existing islands (including Hawaii! 1NE) , unlike the previous map proposal

Spoiler :

 

[merijn_v1]

Thanks.


It seems there will be a small problem to get to some islands. Especially Hawaii and Easter Island. Even with the suggested UP, ships can't reach the shore of those islands.

Spoiler :

As you can see, you can reach the Island of Abdju from Lagash. If you have the 2nd cultural expansion, you can enter the indicated tiles. But when you try to go to Rapa Nui, you can't reach the shore. We could change the yellow striped tiles to coast, so Rapa Nui will be reachable with island hopping.
(I used different colors so it's easier to see which culture belongs to which city.)

Spoiler :

Same problem for Hawaii. If we only change the pink tiles to coast, Hawaii would be reachable with island hopping. But I suggest also changing the yellow tiles. (I think that would look a bit better)
The island with a red circle has the same problem.

 

[AtlantaMarty]

You won't be able to open that, I think. I'm still at rev 592
@Bobby Martnen

Please also provide us your savegames of America moving two tiles east as you aforementioned, so we also can try for ourselves

I will try tomorrow, but I have been having internet connectivity problems.

One note about my savegame:

North

 

[citis]

Let's add a cape column between polynesia and australia/philipines/Japan. This way Polynesian civs won't be able to expand to Australia for example.

 

[Leoreth]

Let's add a cape column between polynesia and australia/philipines/Japan. This way Polynesian civs won't be able to expand to Australia for example.

You can pass capes when they are culture covered though.

 

[merijn_v1]

I think there will be a huge disadvantage to settle Australia (if you go for the UHV): time.
Assuming that one of the Polynesian UHV will be "settle Hawaii, Rapa Nui, Madagaskar(?), Philipins(?) and maybe some other islands as well by a certain date.

Let me explain.
To reach some islands, you need to do some island hopping. That requires building culture. But that takes time. It's very likely their only source of culture will be a pagan temple and the artist slot from their UB.

The pagan temple won't be a good solution. It's cheap, but it only provides 1 . It think it's better to spend your on more important things. Especially because the amount of is quite low for Polynesia.

So your mayor source of culture will be what you get from the artist from your UB. But you still have to build that UB first, which will also several turns. And then, you have to hire an artist, which will cost a very valuable pop. Still, you have to wait 25 turns to get to the 2nd expansion, which, if my suggestions in the screenshots a few posts above will be applied, will give you access to the new island. (We can also decide you need the 3rd expansion.)

To get to Rapa Nui, this has to be twice! You can culture bomb 1 city with a great artist and skip all the above, but you still have to do it for the other cities.

And then you also have to do other things as well in the meantime.

 

[citis]

You can pass capes when they are culture covered though.

Let them be excluded from polynesian UP.

 

[DC123456789]

I'm pretty sure that rule applies for all civs though.

 

[BenZL43]

I think there will be a huge disadvantage to settle Australia (if you go for the UHV): time.
Assuming that one of the Polynesian UHV will be "settle Hawaii, Rapa Nui, Madagaskar(?), Philipins(?) and maybe some other islands as well by a certain date.

I don't agree with this one, sorry. Perhaps what you're referring to while writing this are Austronesians, not Polynesians

Austronesians people get out from Taiwan and spread to Philippines, Indonesia, Melanesia, Micronesia and last, Polynesia.

Who colonize Madagascar? In DoC term, it's Indonesia.
Because Madagascar was colonized by settler from Barito in Borneo islands.
One of the place they settled down is Analamanga (hill), which evolve into Tannarive and now Antananarivo (the capital city of Madagascar, now)
Perhaps this could be an interesting UHV for Indonesia, but that's another story.