Medieval European Mod II 2016-10-05

[Ciceronian]

Thanks Yoda and ED for this wonderful mod! It's made me come back to civ3 for the first time in ages. It's got a really authentic medieval feel to it. Unfortunately I haven't really had time to play it yet, and I will have to wait until after exams to give it another go and make some more insightful comments in this thread.

 

[Plotinus]

Ciceronian! Good luck in the exams.

 

[jetha]

Wow guys, each time I visit this thread it tickles me more. I can hardly wait till I get some time off from school to play this exciting and (judging from what I read here) superbly designed mod. Keep up the good work!

 

[oldboy]

does MEM II use the same settings for the difficulties as civ?

 

[Yoda Power]

I'm not 100% sure, but I don't think anything has changed in that area, except the names.

 

[St Exupère]

ed,

What do you mean? Sanitation requires medicine which is indeed redundant but has no effect whatsoever. The intended order is Medicine -> Canals -> Sanitation, and that's what I see.

That is also what I see yet it is not the reality since in effect Canals only requires Companies to discover. Which makes a big difference, considering the Arsenal GW is at stake. There is either a mistake in the tech tree, or in the editor/pedia.

This was indeed intentional. If you remove the link to Anatolia, several gameplay issues pop up:
- Constantinople becomes a rather insignificant city
- The Muslim/Turkish vs. Byzantine conflict has no ground
- The Byzantines don't settle Anatolia at all, which is all under Turkish control since the start. Byzantines have to push into Balkans which are already too crowded, so either Serbia or Bulgaria would have to be removed (MEM 1.0 had the Bosphorus, and no Serbia).

Fully agree and it works very well; the Byzantines are a key civ of the mod, Constantinople is by far the most important location on the map and fighting in the Balkanic/Anatolian zone is constant. Yet, the Black Sea is a closed body of water (except for whomever holds Constantinople) and it affects maritime gameplay. You have no doubt made the better compromise though.

VP is not in default settings (and it gives a leg-up to Italy/Byzantines/Fatimids). It is up to you to turn it on or off (remember this setting rolls over from previously played games/scenarios). With VP off the game should be a bit longer.

In my new game with Poland VP scoring seems more in-line with the max number of turns. I know I can turn VP scoring off but I like the feature a lot; I would just like to assess whether 50K limit is balanced vs the other historiograph/cultural limits you have set.

A general note: the AI situation looks different in every game. Although some civs are weak or strong by default because of their starting locations (e.g. Ireland vs. Fatimids), you'll sometimes see the same civ being #1 and another time #20.

I am already noticing this in my 2nd game, and the north/south balance of power seems better than in my Armenian game. Except for the Turks who got crushed on both occasions - maybe their janissary and SW are coming too late in the game to provide the dominant historical impact they started having from 1200's onwards.

Note: Pospolite Ruszenie for the Poles is big...

cheers

 

[oldboy]

... since in effect Canals only requires Companies to discover. Which makes a big difference, considering the Arsenal GW is at stake. There is either a mistake in the tech tree, or in the editor/pedia.

the pedia is correct, the arrow in the tech tree is just kind of "mislinked"

 

[embryodead]

Thanks for explanation St. Exupere, I finally get it... I don't really remember what I had in mind 2 months ago, but more likely the tech tree is right and BIQ not updated In other words Canals should require Medicine in the BIQ. This will be included in a patch, I'm just waiting till there's enough new stuff for an update.

VP scoring uses default Civ3 values and in Civ3 it's a "short game mode". I guess it could be adjusted to end around the time a long game would end - if you have any ideas for a good value, let me know.

@oldboy
Difficulty settings are the same as in standard Civ3:Conquests with two exceptions:
- the AI gets one free defensive unit in their capital on all levels (one of the means to stop warrior-rushing)
- max. govt transition time is reduced on easy levels so that it's never higher than 4.

 

[oldboy]

i have played so far germany and irleand ( i enjoyed both games to the fullest ) and wanted to play now as byzantines.

normaly i try to build citys with a good production, but with the byz it isnt that easy i think.

where would you build your towns/citys/(metros)?

greece 152 kB

their area in the west (greece) is tricky, there are 2 nice spots for citys and another good spot with a lot of fields with shield production around it but not enough food production to use them.
in the south of greece there are no rivers, so just coastal towns with low production there, but with a port in each of these they give some cash.
[would prefer 1/2 rivers for citys => unit production]

 

[Kumquat]

Make sure you build cities south of the capital or else the turks will be up against your capital in no time

 

[St Exupère]

oldboy,

Byzantines: Constantinople is IMO the best location on the map - Victory location, controls Bosphorus, amazing bonuses around (incl. wheat, quarry, silk). A Royal Port will turn it from a huge pop/trading center into a production power-house as well. However it is surrounded by many great powers and where you settle your colonies is a very tough decision.

On the European side Serbs and Bulgars are both very close to you, and should not be neglected. Historically they delt terrible blows to the empire. Your goal should be to move along the coast towards Greece securing the absolutely key location around Thessalonica (horses + timber) and then rushing to get the iron in Macedonia, which is eaqually important. If you win this race you will get Hellas and Pelopponese where your cities will be limited to 6 pop indeed, but will get you gold, tar, wine and olive oil - nothing less. Further down the road, conquest of rich Crete should also be your objective. This of course means you leave both northern most red points on your mini-map to Bulgars/Serbs.

Settling in Asia is also key and eventually the biggest threat should come from there - either the Turks themselves, or more likely as I found out Fatimids/Abbasids pushing towards Europe. You have 2 locations to target: one south in the Bursa-Bergama area, and another on the Anatolian northern coast in the area of Amastris. You can develop there 2 big, rich cities that will be the sentinels of Constantinople in Asia and the future basis for conquests there.

I would build Thessalonica + Larissa first, then Bergama + Amastris if there is still time, and then turn to Greece proper with 2/3 more colonies before sailing to Crete and other Aegan islands if there is still time. That will give you 7/9 cities around the best one in the world potentially, and a good shot at victory from there on if you play it well. An issue though is that Constantinople is very well placed to build key early GWonders, which will go against your expansion plans.

Good luck!

 

[oldboy]

thanks for your tips.

an irrigated field in city radius does it count as a fresh water source?

 

[Virote_Considon]

Nope. Only a lake or a river does

 

[Azmorg]

Ah, the sweet taste of victory!
Let it be said, Islam shall not be stopped.
Charles the Hammer was a simple aberration. This is the true Europe in the eyes of Allah.





As has been said, this is a truly superb mod. Most excellent.

 

[Yoda Power]

Wow, that's quite impressive.

 

[Virote_Considon]

And we, unlike the French, didn't get touched

 

[Svetovid]

Hey guys, this is a really amazing mod. Wow. It is very easy to discern the amount of thinking that went into making this mod. From barbarians to the map.

I noticed, however, that when I start playing the Serbian civ I don't get the organized armies tech, instead I get mythology. This was probably intended since in the civ screen it states that the Serbs have "mythology" under religion (probably got the two mixed up or something).

 

[jetha]

Downloading now! Woot, can't wait to play, and play, and replay, and play it over and over again.....

 

[embryodead]

Hello,
We're working on some changes/fixes, and there's an issue that needs more input. A late-game amphibious unit was suggested earlier in this thread. There's also the problem of some early amphibious units not being used. Our basic idea is:
- Byzantine Aegean Sailor becomes 4.2.1 and replaces Man-at-Arms (also upgrades to Arquebusier)
- Slaver becomes 6.1.1 and replaces Crossbowman (also upgrades to Arquebusier); possibly comes with Companies, not Military Drill
- Crusaders also upgrade to Arquebusier
- Arquebusier and its replacements: Spanish Tercio, Bohemian Hussite and Turkish Janissary all become amphibious
- Venetian Sailor gets a boost, probably to 8.4.1 like Janissary

The basic idea would be that "all Renaissance era infantry gets +1 hp and can attack from directly from ships". That's how we see it; if you think Tercios or Hussites with amphibious assault capability are terribly wrong say so... but remember it may be less wrong than Crusaders being the marine unit of Renaissance.

 

[Stormrage]

I almost never use amphibious assaults, so I can`t comment on those but I trust you are going in the right direction