[Modmod]Dawn of Knoedel - Comprehensive Rebalance Project

[hnrysml]

I think if you ever added the limited-use workers, you'd also have to change the way improvements can be so easily pillaged. Because at the moment I think it would be too unfair to use up your worker on several improvements just to have them all pillaged in one turn by a stack of barbarian horse archers, or such.

 

[Imperator Knoedel]

I'm back!

After spending the summer doing nothing productive at all (even playing Civ5 worryingly often!) I finally got something done. For once I changed stuff in the DLL without anything going wrong at all. Not a single error or complication. Nothing. Everything worked perfectly exactly the way I wanted it to. That was refreshing! I used this opportunity to fix some minor issues that had been bothering me for a long time. Capitalism now is below Caste System in the civics screen, Egypt starts with Caste System instead of Slavery, and Persia starts with Vassalage because Satraps. Towns now have a small chance of discovering hit single, movies or football events.

On a less positive note this means that from now on I will have to keep track of the C++ source files I changed, and merge and compile anything Leoreth does in the DLL instead of just copying his DLL wholesale. Ah well, I'll get used to it.

 

[need my speed]

Towns now have a small chance of discovering hit single, movies or football events.

This is a very ingenious and interesting idea that I might totally steal.

 

[MISER SVM]

Great job, err.. "comrade"! I was impatient and didn't install properly, but only checked the civilopedia. Like most of the changes! Especially dating back the UHV conditions for the Maya (really, really hard to pull off before... ) among others. Many UBs also give a much needed shot in the arm for a lot of civs. However, there are a few things (might have more to do with the original modcomps for 2nd UUs and UBs): I find the Sepoy as an Infantry replacement a bit late. Also, the Kobukson only showing up with Chemistry... I don't know. Furthermore, most UUs are quite good, but I find the Ethiopian ones a bit generic and uninspiring. Surely there must be more information about Ethiopian military history around (not just the battle of Adowa etc)- if push comes to shove, why not use Civ5's Mehal Sefari. Dito about Naffatun for the Iranians... What about: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Military_of_the_Safavid_dynasty
Furthermore, this might have to do more with my lazy way of installing the mod-mod-mod, but I noticed several naval units only have a movement of 1 ! First I thought this was intentional and Oil or Coal would enable movement only (now that would be a nice, if practically annoying idea for more realism), but then I figured out it was all across the board (incl. Ship of the Line, Man-o-War, but submarines were fine)- so I don't know what to make of this.

 

[Imperator Knoedel]

Great job, err.. "comrade"! I was impatient and didn't install properly, but only checked the civilopedia. Like most of the changes! Especially dating back the UHV conditions for the Maya (really, really hard to pull off before... ) among others. Many UBs also give a much needed shot in the arm for a lot of civs. However, there are a few things (might have more to do with the original modcomps for 2nd UUs and UBs): I find the Sepoy as an Infantry replacement a bit late. Also, the Kobukson only showing up with Chemistry... I don't know. Furthermore, most UUs are quite good, but I find the Ethiopian ones a bit generic and uninspiring. Surely there must be more information about Ethiopian military history around (not just the battle of Adowa etc)- if push comes to shove, why not use Civ5's Mehal Sefari. Dito about Naffatun for the Iranians... What about: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Military_of_the_Safavid_dynasty
Furthermore, this might have to do more with my lazy way of installing the mod-mod-mod, but I noticed several naval units only have a movement of 1 ! First I thought this was intentional and Oil or Coal would enable movement only (now that would be a nice, if practically annoying idea for more realism), but then I figured out it was all across the board (incl. Ship of the Line, Man-o-War, but submarines were fine)- so I don't know what to make of this.

Hey there, thanks for the feedback!
Funny you'd mention Uniques, I am in the middle of systematically going through each and every unique unit to make sure it is somewhat historically accurate, and share your thoughts on the Kobukson and Ethiopia. Hell I even made a thread complaining about Askaris recently. I already shifted some units around (I removed the Marine unit entirely, Navy SEALs now replace Paratroopers and have been renamed US Marines and Brazil's Guarda Nacionale replaces Police) and once I am done with minor adjustments I will completely revamp Ethiopia's and France's UUs. Ethiopia will get Oromo Warrior (or maybe Oromo Militia?) as a Musketman replacement back and the Savannah Hunter will indeed be replaced by Mehal Sefari, however I'm unsure if they should replace Riflemen, Infantry or Cavalry.
As for France, I am thinking Musketeer and Fusilier. I would have loved to give them the Foreign Legion, but it would just not be historically accurate seeing as it was established after Napoleon and I really don't see the point in giving them an UU that only becomes available after their conquest UHV has been accomplished. Fusilier is a bit generic, but so is the Heavy Cannon, and I definitely want an UU that represents the Grandè Armeè. Haven't thought about Iran's Naffatun, I'll look into your suggestion.
That is an interface bug, you will notice that the Civilopedia also only shows 1 movement for SAM Infantry and Mobile SAM even though they have more movement. All these ships have the ability to range bombard, so the Civilopedia replaces their movement speed with their range, but they still move fine in action.
Seeing as you have the last version I committed, could you do me a favor? I'd like you to pick any autoplay civ in 3000BC and one in 1700AD scenarios. In my local working copy there is a mysterious crash that happens on the fourth turn in 3000BC and around 1765 in 1700AD, but curiously never in the 600AD scenario. If you told me whether or not these crashes also occur in your version I could hopefully narrow the possible causes for these crashes down to something I did after the last commit.

 

[ales_]

Grandè Armeè

Grande Armée

 

[merijn_v1]

The Oromo Warrior isn't suitable either as UU for Ethiopia, as the Oromo were enemies of the Ethiopians. That is the reason why they were renamed to Askari in DoC.

I am interested in your ideas for new UU/UB though. I might include some of them into my 2nd UU modcomp.

 

[Imperator Knoedel]

Grande Armée

Do I look like I care about the correct spelling of a glorified Latin dialect?

The Oromo Warrior isn't suitable either as UU for Ethiopia, as the Oromo were enemies of the Ethiopians. That is the reason why they were renamed to Askari in DoC.

I am interested in your ideas for new UU/UB though. I might include some of them into my 2nd UU modcomp.

The Oromo are to Ethiopia kind of what the Vikings are to England, yes? That is, they once were conquerors that have since been incorporated into the cultural fabric of the unified nation that formed later? Because if so they are still a better fit than Askaris, which are just NO.

There is another thing that bothers me: The Brazilian Guarda Nacionale replaces Marines, even though it was dissolved in the early 20th century. While I already changed it to a Police replacement, I am not sure what to do about the skin, what with its modern assault rifle.

 

[merijn_v1]

If you go that way you could say that the Berserker is a fitting UU for England. I think you have to take the perspective of the time the unit appeared. At the time of the Berserker, the Vikings were not yet incorporated into the English culture, so it the Berserker is not a good UU for the English. Same is for the Oromo Warrior; at the time of the Oromo Warrior, the Oromo and Ethiopia were enemies. So I don't think they are very fitting.

The Brazilian 2nd UU is one of my least favorite ones. It's a bit the least worst UU for Brazil I have. The only other possible UU I could think of is the Osorio tank UU. But I don't think that will have any use in the game.

 

[Imperator Knoedel]

If you go that way you could say that the Berserker is a fitting UU for England. I think you have to take the perspective of the time the unit appeared. At the time of the Berserker, the Vikings were not yet incorporated into the English culture, so it the Berserker is not a good UU for the English. Same is for the Oromo Warrior; at the time of the Oromo Warrior, the Oromo and Ethiopia were enemies. So I don't think they are very fitting.

And Askaris only existed outside of Ethiopia, and when they appeared in Ethiopia in the 19th century they were the enemy too.

Also it depends on what you define as Ethiopia in the first place.

 

[merijn_v1]

I just think that the Oromo Something aren't a suitable name either. I'm not saying that the Askari fit better.

I consider the kingdoms/dynastys mentioned as Ethiopian Kingdom/Dynasty in the History of Ethiopia as Ethiopia.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/History_of_Ethiopia

 

[civcivcivcivciv]

there s crash

when i tried to play scenario ad 1700

 

[Imperator Knoedel]

there s crash

when i tried to play scenario ad 1700

I assume you downloaded the zip version?

 

[civcivcivcivciv]

yes

is there other download site ?

 

[windman007]

Many thanks to Imperator Knoedel! Nice work!

I have played several rounds of the latest version from GitHub. I would like to share sth. on the gameplay! I mainly played Greece and China.

Greece: A LOT of modification, truly!

1. Number of cities. At the beginning, Greece has one city on Crete, not rhode, one city in minor Asia, and two settlers. This is much more historical sounding, but also more maintenance cost starting from the very beginning! The good thing is that there are gold and silver around (enough turns before they are drained!). Due to this, it is always good to research Currency, and build Great Lighthouse early! Otherwise the economy would suck. This would potentially change the order of techs, and math would be brought much early as well.

2. Egypt tends to build a second city before or on Greece' birth. If it happens to be Alexandria, that would be fantastic, since Greece can simply occupy them at the beginning.

3. The cumulative happiness and health can give Greece a surprisingly gift at some point!

China: The map and initial indie city setting are unchanged. However, the play style could be much different thanks to the cumulative happiness and health mechanism!

Usually China should not be building too many cities. Previously, at some point the stability of China is low, so it was good to keep large cites in the core, and minimize the number of cities (and the population) outside the core. This usually leads to 5-6 cities in the core at most. However, for this version, China can SPAM cities all around. In its core, I managed to build 9-10 cities! And more in its historical area.

Why did I spam cities? Because I can. More importantly, I keep the happiness and health surplus maximized! So do not worry the slow growth of too crowded cities. After several turns, health surplus gives each city a free citizen! Each city in theory only needs 2-3 tiles (low food, high production or commerce) to work on, and the growth is granted by surplus health!

Still, Religious Victory of Taoism is like impossible to achieve, even I use the above strategy. I found there is almost always one guy having a longer expected life than me, even my cities are small and VERY healthy. I guess it is an independent city? Another possible reason is that there is less building to increase health (smokehouse and granary do not provide health anymore). It would be excited to see anyone can have the Taoism religious victory.

(of course for a large number of cities you should avoid Guild economy at all cost.)

Cheers!

 

[Publicola]

Rhode Island

Rhode Island is the territorially smallest state in the U.S.A.

The 'Isle of Rhodes' is the Greek-colonized island in the Aegean sea.

...The More You Know...

 

[hnrysml]

In Knoedel's map, is there a new tile for the Isle of Rhodes? Or is the island in reference actually Crete or Cyprus? (Sorry I can't figure this out myself because I haven't had a proper PC for a while)

 

[windman007]

In Knoedel's map, is there a new tile for the Isle of Rhodes? Or is the island in reference actually Crete or Cyprus? (Sorry I can't figure this out myself because I haven't had a proper PC for a while)

Sorry my bad.. should be Crete. Knoedel did not add more islands in the Aegean sea.

 

[soul-breathing]

I wonder what does Healthcare bar mean at the left side of screen. Is it a concept from Civ5? What will be when this bar filled?

 

[Imperator Knoedel]

I wonder what does Healthcare bar mean at the left side of screen. Is it a concept from Civ5? What will be when this bar filled?

You get an extra population in all cities. It's not exactly taken from Civ5 as it doesn't have health, but it was included in the same mod I have taken the Happy Golden Age thingy so I thought I might as well add that too.