[Modmodmod] RFC:Europe Extra Civs

[civ_king]

Spain and Portugal are absent from the pedia as well.

I easily enacted the Aragon/Leon as Spain, as they were my vassals. France is very powerful but fortunately it cannot resist to a united Spain (not Iberia yet). Aragon and Portugal were my best friends and my vassals for most of the game.

Poland collapsed soon after its union with Lithuania (Krewo). I'm not sure it's related but it may be.

An issue I see with the France+Burgundy union is how powerful France would be if it won. In my game I had the luck of conquering most of Burgundy before the union happened so France got only Beaune.

I think corporations are flawed in their current state and should probably be changed à la Sword of Islam.

Finally, I had a python exception around 1526, for the Spanish Netherlands union:

Traceback (most recent call last):

  File "CvEventInterface", line 23, in onEvent

  File "CvRFCEventManager", line 134, in handleEvent

  File "CvRFCEventManager", line 145, in _handleDefaultEvent

  File "CvRFCEventHandler", line 551, in onBeginGameTurn

  File "RiseAndFall", line 937, in checkTurn

  File "RiseAndFall", line 3373, in doUnions

AttributeError: 'module' object has no attribute 'iUnionProvs2'
ERR: Python function onEvent failed, module CvEventInterface

a Franco-Iberian union? That's a powerful Popish state

I played as Poland and the union of Krewo nearly collapsed me, it could have easily killed an AI.

The France Burgundy union happens at an appropriate time and the French completely came out ahead.


It appears that Novgorod is founded too early

If the primary country is master of the secondary country it should be automatic.
What currently happens when a third country owns both the primary and secondary countries (peace vassals), does it proceed as normal?

 

[Morholt]

Spain and Portugal are absent from the pedia as well.

I easily enacted the Aragon/Leon as Spain, as they were my vassals. France is very powerful but fortunately it cannot resist to a united Spain (not Iberia yet). Aragon and Portugal were my best friends and my vassals for most of the game.

Poland collapsed soon after its union with Lithuania (Krewo). I'm not sure it's related but it may be.

An issue I see with the France+Burgundy union is how powerful France would be if it won. In my game I had the luck of conquering most of Burgundy before the union happened so France got only Beaune.

I think corporations are flawed in their current state and should probably be changed à la Sword of Islam.

Finally, I had a python exception around 1526, for the Spanish Netherlands union:

The missing Civilopedia entries should all be fixed for the next version.

Next version will have improved stability maps after enacting a union, should help the AI a bit. Also when you would have collapsed while having a union the union is broken first instead, with the subject civ respawning.

The French Burgundian inheritance did happen historically and I'd actually prefer slightly weakening France overall over taking it out. France does seem to be a bit overpowered in Beta 12, it's not that rare that they conquer and capitulate both Burgundy and Germany.

I've no plans for changing the corporations at the moment. Not saying that it won't happen but not now.

The exception will be fixed for the next version.

True. But it still feels odd that the major challenge for UHV3 is crushing the Ottomans. Their first two nicely cover both expansion and trade, so I fully see how the third got included as the "wanted but didn't" goal. It's just that compared to the other two it was easy, and just needed many end of turns.

Another suggestion: no farms/towns in Anatolia by a certain date, preferably really early, to represent the change to a pastoral/trading economy that they facilitated. Then it would be possible to win before the Ottomans showed up.

Hmm, I don't think they need another early UHV since in my experience the early game is already pretty tight, especially if you get powerful Byzantines. I'd rather make the late UHV more difficult.

a Franco-Iberian union? That's a powerful Popish state

I played as Poland and the union of Krewo nearly collapsed me, it could have easily killed an AI.

The France Burgundy union happens at an appropriate time and the French completely came out ahead.

It appears that Novgorod is founded too early

If the primary country is master of the secondary country it should be automatic.
What currently happens when a third country owns both the primary and secondary countries (peace vassals), does it proceed as normal?

France-Spain actually can happen, but if it succeeds it will trigger a world war (see War of the Spanish Succession)

Yes Novgorod spawns when the city of Novgorod became capital of Rus', even though it was not yet a separate state from Kiev. I think they do a good job of representing the northern Rus' though.

When one civ is master of the other the union is much more likely to happen. When one or both is vassal to a third civ the union can never happen (would be annoying and unrealistic for the master). For the next civ the likelihood of countries agreeing to unify will also be modified by their attitude to each other.

 

[rigo92]

Why do the french start with double the usual units? IIRC that was a mistake in an earlier beta, but has since been fixed. You can change it by editing the rfceuropextravcivs file in public maps and removing ALL of the french units (dont worry, you will still get units, just not double anymore).

 

[ozqar]

Hey, just finished the Novgorod UHV and it was quite fun. I have a some observations/questions:

- For the 10 furs victory, I noticed I got it on the moment the 10 furs were inside the reach of the fat crosses of my cities. What I mean is that, when I got the condition approved, 4 of the furs where out of my cultural borders, but inside the soon-to-be fat crosses of my cities. Also, I noticed that one fur I was obtaining trading was not considered towards the count. Is all this intended?

- For the unions. Once a union is enacted (I saw only two, France-Burgundy and Spain-Aragon), I saw the message saying that Burgundy and Aragon had descended into civil war and had been destroyed. I know this is inconsequential to the game, but at least in the case of Spain (I don't know of France's), Aragon was not really destroyed nor it had fallen into civil war. Could it be possible to disable these messages?

- Also about Spain, could it be possible to name the nation "Castille" instead of Spain? As far as I know, Spain didn't become Spain until the union had been enacted. I think "Spain" should be the dynamic name it gets once it either conquers or absorbs Aragon.

- Finally, could it be possible for absorbed civs to respawn later? In cases of future unstability or when there were historical rebellions/revolutions?

 

[Morholt]

Why do the french start with double the usual units? IIRC that was a mistake in an earlier beta, but has since been fixed. You can change it by editing the rfceuropextravcivs file in public maps and removing ALL of the french units (dont worry, you will still get units, just not double anymore).

Whoops, can't believe I missed this one. Thanks! Maybe this is why France seemed overpowered.

Hey, just finished the Novgorod UHV and it was quite fun. I have a some observations/questions:

- For the 10 furs victory, I noticed I got it on the moment the 10 furs were inside the reach of the fat crosses of my cities. What I mean is that, when I got the condition approved, 4 of the furs where out of my cultural borders, but inside the soon-to-be fat crosses of my cities. Also, I noticed that one fur I was obtaining trading was not considered towards the count. Is all this intended?

- For the unions. Once a union is enacted (I saw only two, France-Burgundy and Spain-Aragon), I saw the message saying that Burgundy and Aragon had descended into civil war and had been destroyed. I know this is inconsequential to the game, but at least in the case of Spain (I don't know of France's), Aragon was not really destroyed nor it had fallen into civil war. Could it be possible to disable these messages?

- Also about Spain, could it be possible to name the nation "Castille" instead of Spain? As far as I know, Spain didn't become Spain until the union had been enacted. I think "Spain" should be the dynamic name it gets once it either conquers or absorbs Aragon.

- Finally, could it be possible for absorbed civs to respawn later? In cases of future unstability or when there were historical rebellions/revolutions?

The intention is having 10 furs improved and inside your borders. Since the countOwnedBonuses function is behaving oddly, I'll probably just switch it to "export 10 furs".

I'll disable those messages. EDIT: Actually it seems those messages only happen when a minor civ survives the union, and then collapses because it lost a lot of stability when it lost the cities.

I'll keep the adjective "Spanish" and short description "Spain" since they also represent Leon in the early game but the dynamic name will not be Spain until they absorb Aragon.

 

[Caliom]

When one civ is master of the other the union is much more likely to happen. When one or both is vassal to a third civ the union can never happen (would be annoying and unrealistic for the master). For the next civ the likelihood of countries agreeing to unify will also be modified by their attitude to each other.

Why not? The two unite to break free from their master. I can imagine that that happened alot. Would also be a nice way to end some long game vassalages.

A minor thing, the starting culture in rome is still assigned to player 22, that is serbia now, should be player 32, or whatever the pope is at the moment.

Spoiler :

RFCEuropeExtraCivs.CivBeyondSwordWBSave, line 23477

        BeginCity
		[COLOR="Red"]CityOwner=32[/COLOR]
		CityName=Roma
		CityPopulation=5
		BuildingType=BUILDING_PALACE
		BuildingType=BUILDING_WALLS
		BuildingType=BUILDING_CASTLE
		BuildingType=BUILDING_BARRACKS
		BuildingType=BUILDING_GRANARY
		BuildingType=BUILDING_MARKET
		BuildingType=BUILDING_CATHOLIC_TEMPLE
		BuildingType=BUILDING_CATHOLIC_MONASTERY
		BuildingType=BUILDING_CATHOLIC_SHRINE
		ReligionType=RELIGION_CATHOLICISM
		HolyCityReligionType=RELIGION_CATHOLICISM
		[COLOR="Red"]Player22Culture=2000[/COLOR]
	EndCity

 

[Morholt]

Why not? The two unite to break free from their master. I can imagine that that happened alot. Would also be a nice way to end some long game vassalages.

A minor thing, the starting culture in rome is still assigned to player 22, that is serbia now, should be player 32, or whatever the pope is at the moment.

I can't think of any examples, really.

Good catch on the WBS thing.

 

[civ_king]

I was playing as Poland and when I united with Lithuania I nearly collapsed within a couple turns. In 1449 my stability is still hovering at -9, before union I was at +9

1566, stability is still crap.


EDIT: It appears that it makes it extremely difficult to win as Poland since Crimea will raze Ukraine you have to found several cities in unstable locations crapping your stability. I think it needs to be lowered to 10 cities from twelve or unions need a serious stability buff such as solid provinces getting added along with OK provinces with stability registering on city transfer

 

[alpav]

the union between france and spain occured in my game triggering the war of the spanish succesion. The only civs at war with france were the ottomans and their vassal bulgaria.The ottomans aren't even a european civ. France was extremly strong owning all of spain and being very solid at the same time. Is this a bug or a coincidence.

 

[Morholt]

Bug, meant to make it so that everyone who was less than Friendly with France would declare war, messed it up so that only people less than Cautious would declare. Fixed.

 

[Opera]

I won a game as the Prussians on Monarch difficulty.

It was pretty easy -- by the end I had 38 units per city, with 14 cities. Cities I owned which I probably shouldn't have included Novgorod (got it during war and it had a lot of specialists settled so I kept it) and Krakow (for the sulphur).

It was pretty annoying IMO to have to settle a city in Silesia which is a small, nearly useless province.

Having the Teutonic Order at hand is handy (hurr hurr) but the costs are tremendous due to not having the HQ. That said, the Teutonic Knight makes up for it.

Poland collapsed early on after I conquered Danzig/Gdansk, right before Lithuania spawned. Got Kaunas from them and they collapsed sometime after. Livonia was tough because Novgorod was powerful but in the end the #1 UHV was easy.

#2 UHV was kinda boring I must say. It felt pretty good to have such an army though and no one dared attack me afterwards.

For #3 I never expanded to keep stability up and not risk secessions. The Prussia/Germany union makes it very easy to get Brandenburg though.

I'd suggest maybe tweaking the UHV for a more active historical-victory game.

Also, it seems Hungary is really strong but I guess it's due to the map changes in this area.

At one point I had Portugal ruling over all Iberia (due to the Portugal/Spain union) but they collapsed soon after due to stability plumeting. What could have been!

 

[Morholt]

You don't actually have to settle provinces when the UHV says "conquer", covering every square of the province in your culture also works.

And I'll replace Prussia's UHV as soon as I think of something better. Something about spawning Great Generals? Something related to the Seven Year's War?

 

[civ_king]

So I actually got that condition as Poland by shoving two cities in Brest and by the end had five in Lithuania.

 

[Buddhafish]

Playing as Novgorod. Lithuania was my vassal and the still formed the Union of Krewo I think it was, the exact turn the Muscovy came (1380). Is that a bug or can Lithuania still do that within the game?

 

[ezzlar]

I noticed if you name the folder anything else than the name in the original post the game will crash and show a strange start page. Could be worth mentioning clearer?

 

[Morholt]

Playing as Novgorod. Lithuania was my vassal and the still formed the Union of Krewo I think it was, the exact turn the Muscovy came (1380). Is that a bug or can Lithuania still do that within the game?

Sounds like a bug. I can't say I've seen that happen, do you have a save?

 

[Opera]

Covering Silesia with culture might be tricky due to its weird shape. Also, it's safer to put a city there so it doesn't get overruled by some kind of culture calculation right before the deadline

As for the UHV, what about something regarding Austria and/or Germany, like conquering them or some of their provinces? Maybe once you've got your HRE system running they could get a related UHV.

Any progress on Scandinavia?

 

[Morholt]

Scandinavia is coming along nicely, ready apart from some tweaking. I'm not sure a HRE based UHV would make sense for Prussia since they were near constantly at odds with the HRE (proclaiming themselves a kingdom, wars with Austria).

 

[Buddhafish]

Here's the save from 1380. Next turn the Muscovites will ask for my city Moskva(two plots to the left of Muscovy Moskva), and the Union of Krewo will be enacted, sending Lithuania into civil war.

 

[Morholt]

Got it, will be fixed for next version.