My idea for a new form of government

[Bill3000]

Oh, how adorable. I created an unoriginal mismatch of poorly thought out leftist ideas, called it a new government, and posted it to a Civilization forum for the posters to criticize mercilessly when I was 13 too. You're not my clone reliving my life, are you? If you are, I'd suggest you stay away from NESes considering what would happen next.

 

[Thoughtful Thug]

Oh, how adorable. I created an unoriginal mismatch of poorly thought out leftist ideas, called it a new government, and posted it to a Civilization forum for the posters to criticize mercilessly when I was 13 too. You're not my clone reliving my life, are you? If you are, I'd suggest you stay away from NESes considering what would happen next.

Self-hatred by any chance?

 

[Bill3000]

Self-hatred by any chance?

immense

 

[Thoughtful Thug]

immense

At least you can pat yo-self on the back by saying that at least you're evolving.

Me, on the other hand - de-evolving.

 

[aneeshm]

This a form of government that I have thought of:

• It will be a combination of Communism and Democracy.
• Everyone will be equal and free.
• There will be no discrimination on grounds of gender, race, religion, sexuality, etc.
• There will be no capital punishment.
• The government will consist of representitives from every administrative region, the amount of representitives depending on the population of that region.
• Anyone over the age of 16 will be able to run for a position in government.
• Anyone over the age of 16 will be able to vote in elections.
• Elections will be held every two years, with 50% of the vote needed to stay in power.
• You can run for a position in government as an idependent or in a party.
• Once in power, a person or party can propose to change any law. The law will be changed if 90% of the population vote to change it in a referendum.
• The country will only have a reserve army, air force and navy. It can only use it in self-defence.
• Health Care will be free and everyone will have access to equal care.
• Higher Education will be free.
• Criminals will do unpaid work in prison (such as making clothes), but rehibilitation will be the ultimate goal.

So what do you think? Ask me any questions you have on things I've missed out.

You've just described what you thing would be good if true. You haven't, however, given any indication of how your proposed government is actually going to achieve any of them, nor how to go from here - the situation as it currently is - to your proposed utopia.










(If you want to get serious about 'government design', I suggest you start by studying these books:

Introduction to Logic, Copi and Cohen
(For the rest of the trivium I'm afraid you're on your own - I have neither the time nor the energy to look up the relevant material. The work of the modern home-schooling Classical revivalists could be useful here.)

The Iliad, Homer
The Odyssey, Homer
The Aeneid, Virgil
(The above three are purely for historical context regarding the self-perceptions of peoples, and how they are formed and how they change. I suggest personally the Fagles translations.)

The Old Testament, The Bible, RSV
On the Genealogy of Morals, Nietzsche (That old Kantism, 'Awaken from dogmatic slumber', would be appropriate here.)
(These two so that you have a nice exposure to two poles of philosophical thought.)

On the social sciences and economics:
Investigations Into the Method of the Social Sciences, Menger
Human Action, Mises (There are many easier alternatives to this one.)
Theory and History, Mises

On government itself:
Patriarcha, Filmer
On Liberty, J.S. Mill
Leviathan, Hobbes
Reflections on the Revolution in France, Burke
Liberty or Equality, Erik von Kuehnelt-Leddihn
The Menace of the Herd, Erik von Kuehnelt-Leddihn
Democracy in America, de Tocqueville

Note that I am no authority in any of these subjects, I merely happen to have an interest in them.)

 

[Thoughtful Thug]

Hell of a list. Not sure if he want to persue an academic approach to political philosophy. It's way high in the clouds for most people that can't even breathe in.

Sad to see "all series of footnotes to Plato" isn't even mentioned at all.

 

[Zardnaar]

The problem is how your government would actually pay for all of this. University education is horrably expensive so to make it free you're going to have to either have high taxes or limit the numbers attending.

If you go down the high tax path you have a situation similar to the problem virtually every western country has. An aging population and a proportionally smaller number of workers to pay for health care and retirement costs and the like. Put taxes up to high and your educated and reasonably affluent people start looking for jobs in other countries. They leave leaving behind the lower paid, stupid and old AKA a brain drain.

Welcome to reality. Sucks doesn't it.

 

[Bast]

This a form of government that I have thought of:

• It will be a combination of Communism and Democracy.
• Everyone will be equal and free.
• There will be no discrimination on grounds of gender, race, religion, sexuality, etc.
• There will be no capital punishment.
• The government will consist of representitives from every administrative region, the amount of representitives depending on the population of that region.
• Anyone over the age of 16 will be able to run for a position in government.
• Anyone over the age of 16 will be able to vote in elections.
• Elections will be held every two years, with 50% of the vote needed to stay in power.
• You can run for a position in government as an idependent or in a party.
• Once in power, a person or party can propose to change any law. The law will be changed if 90% of the population vote to change it in a referendum.
• The country will only have a reserve army, air force and navy. It can only use it in self-defence.
• Health Care will be free and everyone will have access to equal care.
• Higher Education will be free.
• Criminals will do unpaid work in prison (such as making clothes), but rehibilitation will be the ultimate goal.

So what do you think? Ask me any questions you have on things I've missed out.

You had me at Communism.

 

[aneeshm]

Hell of a list. Not sure if he want to persue an academic approach to political philosophy. It's way high in the clouds for most people that can't even breathe in.

Sad to see "all series of footnotes to Plato" isn't even mentioned at all.

Plato, Aristotle, Descartes, Locke, Hume, Kant?

I didn't include "pure" philosophy because, though it's quite useful, all the works from that tradition on political theory have a very bad tendency to neglect some essential element of human nature, and thus go catastrophically astray if you follow them to their logical end. Aristotle is, of that bunch, the best when it comes to having his feet firmly planted in political reality.

(I should have included Dawkins' The Selfish Gene after logic in that list - it sheds a revealing light on everything that follows.)

 

[Thoughtful Thug]

Plato, Aristotle, Descartes, Locke, Hume, Kant?

Yeah, the heavy weights with a lot of titles.

I didn't include "pure" philosophy because, though it's quite useful, all the works from that tradition on political theory have a very bad tendency to neglect some essential element of human nature, and thus go catastrophically astray if you follow them to their logical end.

Kinda similar to what Karl Popper once said of about Plato.

Which comes to my mind. "The Open Society and Its Enemies" is a good read also

Aristotle is, of that bunch, the best when it comes to having his feet firmly planted in political reality.

How's that so?

 

[aneeshm]

How's that so?

He's the one most willing to change his ideas when they clash with reality, instead of trying to bludgeon reality into submission until it fits his framework.

 

[Camikaze]

Money. Universities like Oxford and Cambridge cost thousands of pounds a year (and they'll cost waaaay more in a few years, with the cap on fees being lifted), and if you come from a poor family, you won't have the money to study there.

The only real costs that aren't covered by student loans and such are living costs. They are a few thousand pounds a year (especially in second year when you move out of college), but can be covered by more allowances and loans for those from a lower income background. And when you throw in the high paying internship you're more likely to get going to Oxbridge, you're costs are well and truly covered. Of course, it's easier if you are richer, but don't worry, the UK system is certainly not the least equitable or accessible.

 

[tycoonist]

It's good, but it could be improved. Particularly the voting system (the age to vote is fine, nay great, but 50% is going to unworkable), and the constant need to take referendums (what's the point? the party has already been elected... they should be obliged to take referendums on anything that wasn't party policy before the election + 90% is far far far too high. 60% would be more realistic) would make this unusable.

Socially however, you got most things right.

 

[Bill3000]

If you go down the high tax path you have a situation similar to the problem virtually every western country has. An aging population and a proportionally smaller number of workers to pay for health care and retirement costs and the like.

I'm pretty sure high taxes doesn't cause a low birthrate

 

[Darf Spud]

The problem is how your government would actually pay for all of this. University education is horrably expensive so to make it free you're going to have to either have high taxes or limit the numbers attending.

If you go down the high tax path you have a situation similar to the problem virtually every western country has. An aging population and a proportionally smaller number of workers to pay for health care and retirement costs and the like. Put taxes up to high and your educated and reasonably affluent people start looking for jobs in other countries. They leave leaving behind the lower paid, stupid and old AKA a brain drain.

Welcome to reality. Sucks doesn't it.

I was think that of you don't have a standing army, navy or air force, you could spend the money saved on education.

 

[Ajidica]

A standing navy and air force are needed. If only to serve as a deterrant and for peacekeeping missions.
Plus you can't really 'draft' a navy or airforce.

 

[Quackers]

Money. Universities like Oxford and Cambridge cost thousands of pounds a year (and they'll cost waaaay more in a few years, with the cap on fees being lifted), and if you come from a poor family, you won't have the money to study there.

You can get loans for tuition/accomadation at low reasonable rates.

That is not an excuse anymore.

If your smart enough to be applying to Oxbridge you would have worked out the temporary indebtedness is going to be a small cost to the education your getting and your future earnings.

 

[Zardnaar]

I was think that of you don't have a standing army, navy or air force, you could spend the money saved on education.

NZ spends FA on its military but its the social costs to the government specifcally health spending and the pensions that soak up a huge amount of our government spending. Welfare for the unemployed etc is reasonably small by comparison but still alot. Disbanding the military wouldn't make that much difference in the grand scheme of things. Its like people who think cutting politicians benefits and redirecting the money will make a difference.

 

[Darf Spud]

You can get loans for tuition/accomadation at low reasonable rates.

That is not an excuse anymore.

If your smart enough to be applying to Oxbridge you would have worked out the temporary indebtedness is going to be a small cost to the education your getting and your future earnings.

You do know that government are scrapping caps on tuition fees? The fees for a place like Oxford will go up by thousands, so even if you get a loan for it, chances are you'll be in debt for the rest of your life (university graduates aren't getting as many jobs now, and the ones they do are paying less).

 

[Zardnaar]

Darf Spud where would the governemt get the money to offer free university education? Would you be willing to cut student numbers to do it, and theres downsides to putting up taxes? Generally the working class people who don't go to university tend to get annoyed when middle class uni students bleat on about free education. Its not free it just means someone else pays for it via taxes one way or another.