New and Changed Civilizations in 1.18

[TsimTsigal]

Technically the US runned Slavery until 1862, when they finally changed it to Individualism after their low Stability from running outdated civics led to a third of country going Independent.

Also I'd like to point out that citizenship in Rome/Greece was an actual privilege and was much harder to acquire (less so in Imperial Rome) than in the US, especially early.

 

[Bu77Trout]

I'm assuming the civs are unplayable at this point. Are they publicly viewable by launching the game through the map branch?

EDIT: In case my question was unclear I'll make it even less clear by adding more words... Does a pleb like me with at least the basic understanding of how to switch branches using TortoiseGit have the permission and/or the ability to open the game in the map branch to see the awesome new map and pretty colours of the new civs? Or is that not possible/privileged?

 

[Leoreth]

You need to have access to the map branch. I don't recall everyone I have granted access to, if you still need it send me a PM with your github username.

Once you have access you can simply clone the repository and switch to the map branch.

Please note that access to the map branch is only intended for viewing game content, not for actually playing the game.

 

[1SDANi]

Technically the US runned Slavery until 1862, when they finally changed it to Individualism after their low Stability from running outdated civics led to a third of country going Independent.

Also I'd like to point out that citizenship in Rome/Greece was an actual privilege and was much harder to acquire (less so in Imperial Rome) than in the US, especially early.

...what? You do realize that voting rights were constrained by more than just whether people were enslaved, right? Women's right to vote was constitutionally protected in 1920, the last state removed its landowning requirement for voting in 1856, the last state removed its religion requirement for voting in 1828, I could go on. Slavery alone doesn't encompass the scale of the early USA's selective suffrage.

 

[Logoncal]

Also, US without Individualism is like Cheeseburger without the cheese. Its America, baby.
Them starting with Isolation is strange but ungodly broken, because all cities run 2 extra specialists, with 100% GP generation.

 

[1SDANi]

Also, US without Individualism is like Cheeseburger without the cheese. Its America, baby.
Them starting with Isolation is strange but ungodly broken, because all cities run 2 extra specialists, with 100% GP generation.

The USA was isolationist when it came to joining overseas wars they weren't already involved in until after WWII, which I think is where it came from, though the lack of foreign trade routes is odd.

 

[Logoncal]

in gameplay sense, i prefer it.
3 free specialists as a democracy is beyond powerful AND USA has an abysmally low GP cost.

 

[Dracosolon]

I feel like this isn't the right thread for discussing what the civics represent.

 

[TsimTsigal]

...what? You do realize that voting rights were constrained by more than just whether people were enslaved, right? Women's right to vote was constitutionally protected in 1920, the last state removed its landowning requirement for voting in 1856, the last state removed its religion requirement for voting in 1828, I could go on. Slavery alone doesn't encompass the scale of the early USA's selective suffrage.

I wasn't referring suffrage when I mentioned Slavery, and you kinda missed the joke, let alone the fact that Slavery isn't connected to Government civics in DoC.

---
Regarding the map branch - it still can be used for some early testing, like trying some old UHVs?

 

[Leoreth]

Regarding the map branch - it still can be used for some early testing, like trying some old UHVs?

No.

 

[need my speed]

(as a sidenote on this debate about 'democracy = universal suffrage = the USA at year xxxx': Think of the biases you might have because of the world you are living in; do prisoners get to vote? Do children? Do women? Do non-landowners? And so there can be many more categories - if you try to reduce 'universal suffrage' to this black-white definition then I do not believe literally any polity in our history has had universal suffrage, so the whole debate is rather meaningless (especially because 'universal suffrage' isn't even in this mod))

 

[TsimTsigal]

(as a sidenote on this debate about 'democracy = universal suffrage = the USA at year xxxx': Think of the biases you might have because of the world you are living in; do prisoners get to vote? Do children? Do women? Do non-landowners? And so there can be many more categories - if you try to reduce 'universal suffrage' to this black-white definition then I do not believe literally any polity in our history has had universal suffrage, so the whole debate is rather meaningless (especially because 'universal suffrage' isn't even in this mod))

Universal suffrage ensures the right to vote for as many people who are bound by a government's laws as possible, as supported by the "one person, one vote" principle - something that Ancient Republics never ever tried to achieve (the U.S. is a good example of de facto slavery being at odds with equality explicitly noted in the constitution), being quite content with "only the worthy vote/can influence decision making": in Republican Rome, Athens and Carthage voting citizens were minority, composing no more that a third of total adult male population. That's what i meant when i called Republics elitist - voting class was relatively small and relatively closed, contradictory to modern understanding of "goverment of the people, by the people, for the people".

 

[Askii2D]

so if I play:



Vikings, capital in Stockholm, 25 stability

Sweden spawns?!




Rus, 30 stability,
historical borders: Moskow. Ryazan, Vladimir, Tver

Russia spawns?!



can I reform my civ via decision?

"yes" - save territory, play new civ
"no" - don't spawn it

 

[Logoncal]

Dear god no, i oppose civ formation in this mod because Germany exists.
It was already mega exploitative with units flipping before Leo changed to straight up expelling to capital

 

[Cypriot]

so if I play:



Vikings, capital in Stockholm, 25 stability

Sweden spawns?!




Rus, 30 stability,
historical borders: Moskow. Ryazan, Vladimir, Tver

Russia spawns?!



can I reform my civ via decision?

"yes" - save territory, play new civ
"no" - don't spawn it

I would like if you could have prevent spawning Sweden and Russia as Scandinavia and Rus. The same with HRE and Germany. After all, Rome can (or could) prevent Byzantium spawning.

 

[Dracosolon]

Don't play the big map dudes. Or at the very least don't post about it.

 

[Leoreth]

No. Just don't play on it.

 

[TsimTsigal]

The first rule of the new map: we don't talk about the new map.

 

[FishFishFish]

I found this neat guy. A Malay king who launched two invasions of Sri Lanka, to get a sacred relic tooth.

He was actually able to occupy the kingdom of Jaffna in the north, as such I think it would be cool if northern Sri Lanka was included in the Malay conquest area.

 

[Bu77Trout]

I found this neat guy. A Malay king who launched two invasions of Sri Lanka, to get a sacred relic tooth.

He was actually able to occupy the kingdom of Jaffna in the north, as such I think it would be cool if northern Sri Lanka was included in the Malay conquest area.

Though he occupied the North it seems he was vassalized by the Pandyas so seems more like a Tamil project in the end.