New Beta Version - March 2nd (3-2)

[Stalker0]

Here is an example of a game where I just can't seem to get happy, I have no earthly idea why.

Spoiler :

I'm top score, highly competitive in most areas, and I've built a public works in every city. Yet breaking 50 has proven to be impossible, and now I'm starting to slip towards 34.

Compared to my last several games (where happiness was a noticeable factor but a controllable one) is this more water heavy start. I am basically on a series of island chains compared to most of the main civs who are on a single continent. My guess is the water heaviness leads to more unhappiness, as the yields on water tiles tend to be poorer (though I do have imperalism now for better yields) and has faster growth.

I'm not in the spiral right now, and I may do another round of public works building in a moment, but I am going through the landmark phase that could help recover some happiness, so we will see how it goes. But I showcase this one as a datapoint.

Edit: So after getting some landmarks and securing peace, land, bread...I'm back into the low 40s. Still can't seem to break 50 this game, but at least I'm not in the red zone anymore. Back to more public works buildings.

 

[chicorbeef]

It's kind of funny, I remember one domination game where I was moderately unhappy most of the game, until I conquered more than half the world. Conquering all those cities brought the global median down apparently, so my cities just became happy. This was on a version with -% reductions in unhappiness modifiers from buildings though, so I'm not sure if it'll work as well in newer versions. Still though, it's something to keep in mind.

 

[2506]

Here is an example of a game where I just can't seem to get happy, I have no earthly idea why.

Spoiler :

View attachment 589234

I'm top score, highly competitive in most areas, and I've built a public works in every city. Yet breaking 50 has proven to be impossible, and now I'm starting to slip towards 34.

Compared to my last several games (where happiness was a noticeable factor but a controllable one) is this more water heavy start. I am basically on a series of island chains compared to most of the main civs who are on a single continent. My guess is the water heaviness leads to more unhappiness, as the yields on water tiles tend to be poorer (though I do have imperalism now for better yields) and has faster growth.

I'm not in the spiral right now, and I may do another round of public works building in a moment, but I am going through the landmark phase that could help recover some happiness, so we will see how it goes. But I showcase this one as a datapoint.

Good example of a persistent issue for a lot of players. What information would successful Deity players need to be able to comment on your situation?

 

[BornDownUnder]

Are you doing population control to mitigate unhappiness from growth? What sizes are your cities? It will be by far the biggest hindrance to gaining 50%+ happiness.

I have never had an issue with unhappiness on island chain plays (Though that was last year and prior) unless I specifically let population boom whilst remaining unconnected on all cities (Testing the most efficient path for returns/gains vs building costs, etc)

 

[azum4roll]

Have you maximized your happiness to your population? In the games where I'm leading, happiness has never been a problem.

 

[Ranslee]

Needs are influenced by the amount of cities you have (I think the unpuppeted ones) and tech level. Coastal cities tend to have a lot of food but comparatively poor infrastructure, and you have a lot of cities (15?), so it might be just overextending? I have a similar situation with the Netherlands in my current game where I am staying barely above 50% despite all the imports, all because I'm slightly ahead in tech and have a lot of cities.

Does the global median (of what?) influence city needs?

 

[youngsteve]

One area of the game I find really annoying & many cases pointless is the use of using Great Generals as citadels. I can understand strategicly placed ones but the constant laying of them is ridiclous & no one ever seems to use them to direct & help their troops. Just playing a game with the Huns, early on, & just take Portugal second city Porto, leaving it with the capital, & call peace. I can see she has one of these generals, but think surely she wont use it due to my massive forces next to her & would want to have good relations. Nope. Within two goes had plonked the damn thing down taking 3 tiles including my newly taken Iron which I had none off. What is even more annoying there is no diplomatic action to complain about this at all. So I did what anyone would do & declare war on the stupid idiot, not caring about the repurcusions, & wont end until she is gone.

I personally think if anyone lays one of these down & takes land, there should be an automatic option to declare war with no negative diplomacy. I remember Saddam using a similar tactic in Kuwait, & didn't end well for him.

 

[Ranslee]

From experience, AI uses them against you mostly when they dislike you, and you generally don't need more than 1 or 2 GG/GA alive at any time. It's just the correct use.

As for repercussions, war, sanctions and spies are the only major ways to screw over a civ regardless of whether it's for forward settling, forcing a religion, spying or stealing your territory.

 

[andersw]

You said it yourself, portugal stole back iron from you, clever girl.
Its annoying but its to be expected if you dont vassal or make sure to citadel into them before they do it to you.
If you took a city or two they are probably going to hate your guts.

 

[youngsteve]

You said it yourself, portugal stole back iron from you, clever girl.
Its annoying but its to be expected if you dont vassal or make sure to citadel into them before they do it to you.
If you took a city or two they are probably going to hate your guts.

Yes, but it is not sensible, & in a little while she will be no more. Citizens, we will not stand idly by whilst an agressor takes our iron. It will probably be the end of our civilization but I am sure you will agree it will be worth it. Sure. The idiotic thing is to the south & east of her is loads of iron, & she even has a settler ready in her city. So in my opinion her move is a very poor one. As to your question about vassalage. It is too soon. I cannot build a citadel because despite my constant warring (though against barbs) haven't got a Great General, though for some reason peaceful Maria manages to have one somehow.

 

[LifeOfBrian]

Youngsteve, Maria gets GG points from her UA (from caravans), that's why she usually has a lot of great generals compared to most civs.

 

[Ranslee]

Portugal's UA lets her get free GG/GA without breaking a sweat, and you were at war as well.

Taking the last of your iron is a clever move, even if she has a lot, precisely because now you can't flex with swords/longswords. As for being mean against you despite being militarily outmatched, it's a fair point? AI should avoid invoking your wrath if they have the AFRAID approach, but only then.

 

[andersw]

Yes, but it is not sensible, & in a little while she will be no more. Citizens, we will not stand idly by whilst an agressor takes our iron. It will probably be the end of our civilization but I am sure you will agree it will be worth it. Sure. The idiotic thing is to the south & east of her is loads of iron, & she even has a settler ready in her city. So in my opinion her move is a very poor one. As to your question about vassalage. It is too soon. I cannot build a citadel because despite my constant warring (though against barbs) haven't got a Great General, though for some reason peaceful Maria manages to have one somehow.

Oh its a death sentence for sure but its one that you delayed by peacing out before taking her capital.

 

[youngsteve]

Youngsteve, Maria gets GG points from her UA (from caravans), that's why she usually has a lot of great generals compared to most civs.

Of course. I knew about the great admiral points due to her trading but forgot that also applied on land for Great General. Thank you for reminding me.

 

[youngsteve]

Ranslee. She didn't have any linked up ironically, & I do have some in my vacinity but not yet in my land. This shouldn't be long due to The Huns ability of gianing titles. Also, as the Huns, Swordsman are not their main strength anyway.

andersw - I hadn't planned on taking her capital, as this was a war done on the spur of the moment, & hope to vassalise her when I get to the medieval age. Everything fell into place at first. It started when barb camp came into play other side of her empire so sent a horseman round, who killed/gained an axeman, then Portugal had sent a Spearman in play with a settler in water, which was injured by archer in barb camp. I knew then that this was a good chance, so moved my other horseman next to Porto. The next go settler landed on my tile with horseman, so declared war hitting spearman, & other horseman pillaging Porto's horses. Porto hadn't walls yet, though on coast, & after around dozen goes it fell. What was great was a mission with CS 88 influence & an amazing 26 experience points. Never had that before, & promoted up around 14 units. Unfortunately Capital has walls & on coast & next to mountains so is hard to take so thought I would peace out, if idiot Maria hadn't wanted to play silly nonense with citadels. As Huns you can war for ages, not sure if Maria can.

One thing I have noticed is Marathon seems so much easier than Standard, which I always play, though I do prefer this as units stay in play for a long time, & don't disappear after a few turns.

 

[Maximo the Xth]

Do you report these non-EUI issues on GitHub?

There has been a thread about some of them for 9 months now with the Spain thing added immediately when it was introduced.

 

[Stalker0]

There has been a thread about some of them for 9 months now with the Spain thing added immediately when it was introduced.

Github is the way to get bugs fixed, no reports can mean no fixes.

 

[Pal Laki]

Just achieved an cultural victory with Japan on epic/immortal with the latest version. Last game i played was a few months ago i guess. I like the changes since then. More wars going on, nice diplomatic changes and in some situations i thought i play vs human and not an AI Very good job! There were also many voluntary vassalages in my game and sometimes the vassal was at least equal if not stronger than the master. Maybe this aspect could get some tuning but i like it very much that stuff like this is even possible! Thank you for your work on this project, i love it!

 

[Stalker0]

Have you maximized your happiness to your population? In the games where I'm leading, happiness has never been a problem.

This is a good note, so I looked through my cities, and yeah I don't max pop happiness like I normally have had at this point in the game (post landmarks). Some of my cities are even 4-5 happiness down.

Hmm, so what would account for the gap? My luxs seem good, I'm not sanctioned or anything. Could be maybe a happiness quest or two didn't go my way, its definately not a lack of public works I've built more this game than the last several. Maybe less admiral bulbs. Its not my musicians, I have been making them works and not bulbing them in all of my recent games, so its not the happiness from that.

So I'm not really sure to be honest.

 

[LifeOfBrian]

Stalker0, could the main reason be unhappiness from urbanization/working specialists? To me that's often the biggest problem because it's not capped by city size and because there are so few buildings that reduce unhappiness from urbanization.