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pre-release info New Civ Game Guide: Persia

pre-release info
Still waiting for the day when the system of Satrapies is given a decent shake by Firaxis… we passed on it last installment when we had a perfect Governor system!

Still, I’m glad it’s getting referenced at all. If peacefully annexing territory exists in Civ VII, I would have given the Achaemenids some bonuses towards it.

At least we still have paradise gardens, and Xerxes to boot. Can’t get too mad.

Not to say I’m happy about my sworn enemy being in Civ or anything, no, never…
 
Still waiting for the day when the system of Satrapies is given a decent shake by Firaxis… we passed on it last installment when we had a perfect Governor system!
Yeah, it was a missed opportunity. Would have preferred the Satrap to be the unique civilian unit instead of another unique commander honestly.
 
Yeah, it was a missed opportunity. Would have preferred the Satrap to be the unique civilian unit instead of another unique commander honestly.
It wouldn't have suited the hyper-aggressive direction they decided to take the civ, but it would have been nice to make the civ more flexible.
 
I really wish they had revealed Persia sooner if they were just going to relegate it to the “stupidly good at war civ.” Feels a little boring compared to what they started with.
 
It wouldn't have suited the hyper-aggressive direction they decided to take the civ, but it would have been nice to make the civ more flexible.
Yeah, when I think of "hyper-aggression" I also think of building "beautiful paradise gardens" as well. :lol:
 
A military historian, though, pointed out that with Alexander guarding its flanks, the Macedonian phalanx on level ground was unstoppable except by another pike phalanx, a contention borne out by experience against the Swiss pikes in the 15th - 16th centuries and the experience of a Roman who commented that seeing the mass of pikes coming out of the dust clouds in one of the battles against the Macedonians was the most frightening thing he saw in 20 years in the Legions.

Conquering Rome would never have been easy, but unlike Hannibal Alexander was an expert at Siege warfare and never failed to take a walled city that he wanted: Rome's walls would have been a historical speed bump and the man who in his stride figured out how to deal with massed horse archers (Sogdiana) and Elephants (Hydaspes) would not have been long disconcerted by massed swordsmen (Legions).

Also, don't forget that Alexander didn't just have the assets of Epirus, but of the entire eastern half of the Mediterranean basin and the Middle East behind him: he was planning a fleet of 200 Septiremes ('7s') just for the jaunt around Arabia, The mind boggles at what kind of force he could bring to bear against Italy.
You forgot the most important thing. Supply lines. Alexander had fresh troops arrive to reinforce his army after any loses of lives he had suffered during his battles and sieges, even if those loses are considered minimal for the task Alexander undertook. Had Pyrrhus or Hannibal got reinforcements during their wars with Rome, Italy would have been conquered before the Ostrogoths. Hannibal lacked the necessary support from the Carthaginian fleet, and armies sent from the Alps and by sea failed to reach him. Pyrrhus despite his underrated brilliance waged war with a loaned army apart from the Epirote troops, and he never received reinforcements to replace his lost soldiers after each battle with the Romans.

Now that I'm thinking about it, a healing ability on military units fits Alexander rather well, but it needs to work more consistently than the version of Civilization VI where the healing triggered only when a city with a World Wonder was captured. Perhaps, it will work better if the healing triggers on every conquered city or would that be too powerful? We are talking about Alexander the Great though.
 
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Humans are fans of lions. So, so, so many groups used lions (and eagles) as their symbols. I guess something about apex predators is appealing to megalomaniacs? :mischief:
Fun Fact: despite all the lions, eagles, etc, the most common heraldic animal (aside from Fantasies like dragons and griffons) is:

Bears.

Especially in the emblems of individual cities and principalities, where they appear all over Europe: Berlin and Berne (both named after bears) most prominently, bu they are, literally, Everywhere.

You forgot the most important thing. Supply lines. Alexander had fresh troops arrive to reinforce his army after any loses of lives he had suffered during his battles and sieges, even if those loses are considered minimal for the task Alexander undertook. Had Pyrrhus or Hannibal get reinforcements during their wars with Rome, Italy would have been conquered before the Ostrogoths. Hannibal lacked the necessary support from the Carthaginian fleet, and armies sent from the Alps and by sea failed to reach him. Pyrrhus despite his underrated brilliance waged war with a loaned army apart from the Epirote troops, and he never received reinforcements to replace his lost soldiers after each battle with the Romans.

Now that I'm thinking about it, a healing ability on military units fits Alexander rather well, but it needs to work more consistently than the version of Civilization VI where the healing triggered only when a city with a World Wonder was captured. Perhaps, it will work better if the healing triggers on every conquered city or would that be too powerful? We are talking about Alexander the Great though.
I never forget supply lines. My professor, Dr Borza, had every one of his graduate students working on a Travel Time project for the classical middle east for several years - gleaning every tidbit out of every account in Latin, Greek, Aramaic, et al to put together a data base of just how long it took to get anywhere from Afghanistan to Spain. They were still working on it when I left academia to get a job, and I don't know if they ever finished it.

In game, much I would love to see such a thing attached to Alexander for the sheer historicity of it, putting such a mechanism together required a considerable organization of the entire economy and strength of Macedon: recruiting people from 'home areas' for each taxeis of the phalanx and having an organization to move them from Macedon to whatever End of the Earth Alexander had taken the army to. They did it brilliantly - as well as any army in history up to the Modern Era, but it either has to be a Given for Alexander or require a considerable alteration of Macedon's normal economy and structure.

Good thing about that, though, is that a similar organization of recruitment and resources also appeared in Sweden under Gustaphus and Oxenstierna in the 17th century CE and in Prussia under Fred the Great that was one of the great strengths of those states and armies, so any mechanic need not be unique to Alexander and the Macedonians.
 
Fun Fact: despite all the lions, eagles, etc, the most common heraldic animal (aside from Fantasies like dragons and griffons) is:

Bears.
Not surprising, actually; bears are more widespread than lions (though many places have lions in their heraldry but no lions in their territory :p ).
 
Fun Fact: despite all the lions, eagles, etc, the most common heraldic animal (aside from Fantasies like dragons and griffons) is:

Bears.
The bear even won against the tiger on the competition about who will be the holy mother of Korean nation :D
 
Lion is widely considered the King of animals. Eagle is also widely considered the King of birds, it is pretty normal leaders want them in their arms.
For cities and countries, Bears simbolyze strength, wealth (big, fat animals) and stability. No doubt they are also a prime choice.

Probably more fun and interesting stories are those that include mice, shrimps or capybaras in coat of arms (if any)

BTW, Chola is a tiger, not a lion, right?
 
Lion is widely considered the King of animals. Eagle is also widely considered the King of birds, it is pretty normal leaders want them in their arms.
For cities and countries, Bears simbolyze strength, wealth (big, fat animals) and stability. No doubt they are also a prime choice.

Probably more fun and interesting stories are those that include mice, shrimps or capybaras in coat of arms (if any)

BTW, Chola is a tiger, not a lion, right?
A lot depends on the culture:
In classical Greece, the Owl was considered the 'King of Birds', a fact that Aristophanes used in his play: The Birds

In medieval Europe, the Boar also appears frequently in personal heraldry, for its fierceness and aggressiveness.

A lot also depends on what animals are familiar in a given culture: the elephant and crocodile do not appear much in European symbolism, for instance. That fact does argue in favor of the Lion, Bear and Eagle, all of which once lived in various sub-species in virtually all areas where people started concentrating in large numbers: middle east, Europe, India, East Asia, etc. Familiarity makes it easy to incorporate into symbols.
 
Feeling confident in this path
Alternately, Persia > Mongols > Ottomans.

My only holdup with Russia is that I can’t think of a second “historical” path into it - which I think is needed for every Exploration/Modern civ, so that AI doesn’t get bricked if their only historical path is taken by the player + they have also failed to achieve any gameplay unlocks. Yes, AI could be coded to just pick a completely random civ from the pool at that point, but I feel like FXS would at least have a second historical option ready before resorting to such extreme approach.

Ottomans seem like they could house both Abbasid and Mongolia paths, while I don’t quite see a secondary path into Russia. Maybe Norman’s and Ming, but that’s a lot of stretching needed to see that pipeline.
 
BTW, Chola is a tiger, not a lion, right?
You are right. I should have figured a tiger makes more sense than a lion for the Chola. They had the icons originally mixed up on the panel so in my mind I was still thinking the animals were the same. :crazyeye:
Okay so only 3 civs currently have a lion in their icon.
 
Persia and Rome have the +2 Settlements Limit
Aksum and Khmer have +0
Other ancient Civs have +1
Interesting that this encourages Khmer and Aksum to play tall, which is quite historically appropriate, especially for the first one.
 
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