pre-release info New Civ Game Guide: Meiji Japan

[Lonecat Nekophrodite]

Good find, and I must agree it's a little disappointing. I suppose I had a slight hope for a Japanese ground attack aircraft variant, or at the very least a German one with the Stuka. Not that we still couldn't get one; the assigning of cultural variants to generic units is bit confusing in the modern age.

Still, it is a great unit model and the color change at least helps it both stand out and match some of the colors of the Japanese air force.

It is Mitsubishi Ki-30 'Ann'. Exported to Siam, which locally nicked 'Nagoya' after a city where manufacturing plant is located.
I think Fxis even has skins for Siamese as well.

 

[Boris Gudenuf]

Are 'pagoda' towers a distinct feature of Japanese dreadnoughts? did they design these themselves or someone else did design this type of tower before?
And did slant smokestack also a distinct feature?

The 'pagoda' towering superstructures were pretty distinctive feature of the Japanese battleships designed and built in the 1920s and modernized before WWII. The US Navy's ship recognition manual of 1942 identified the Pagoda Tower as one of 5 superstructure types and unique to the Japanese capital ships.

Slanted funnels/smokestacks are quite common in both warships and commercial vessels. The Titanic, for example, had slanted funnels. as did many Royal Navy light cruisers, the US Navy's Cleveland class cruisers, several classes of US and other destroyers, most WWII German torpedo boats, etc.

 

[Lonecat Nekophrodite]

Meiji was incredibly charismatic and a good figure to rally the populace around through change. He was an absolute monarch for quite some time after the restoration. Part of the problem is that when Japan made their constitution they adopted the British model, as they thought the German model gave too much power to the monarch, and Meiji retained the power of the bully pulpit. He could use that, his son that inherited the throne however was certainly not Meiji. He was a bad speaker and probably had some sort of mental disability or speech impediment. This lead the military faction of the Japanese Diet to basically control the government without an Emperor providing a check on it.

The face of Meji Restoration was actually Itou Hirobumi.

Itō Hirobumi - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

 

[Lonecat Nekophrodite]

The 'pagoda' towering superstructures were pretty distinctive feature of the Japanese battleships designed and built in the 1920s and modernized before WWII. The US Navy's ship recognition manual of 1942 identified the Pagoda Tower as one of 5 superstructure types and unique to the Japanese capital ships.

Slanted funnels/smokestacks are quite common in both warships and commercial vessels. The Titanic, for example, had slanted funnels. as did many Royal Navy light cruisers, the US Navy's Cleveland class cruisers, several classes of US and other destroyers, most WWII German torpedo boats, etc.

1. Did Japanese designed 'Pagoda superstructure' as per their naval doctrine to add more sight ranges since their guns tend to be bigger.
Interesting enough this feature is very iconics that not only Leiji Matsumoto adopted it for his space warship designs after Space Battleship Yamato (1974). with second space dreadnought he designed (Arcadia), and slightly later 'Deathshadow' also has exactly the same pagoda tower.

^ Note that in Arcadia of My Youth. there's a scene where Arcadia gun sight broke mid battle, and Harlock ordered Tochiro to unshelf Revi C-12D gunsight of the previous millenium and installed it on the tower top and aim (and 'pull the trigger') with this archaic sight.
The same pagoda towers were also adopted for Star Wars warships.

https://www.starwars.com/databank/imperial-star-destroyer

2. What actually are better? Single slanted smokestacks or dual crooked end stacks (commonly featured in US Navy BBs)

 

[Phrozen]

The face of Meji Restoration was actually Itou Hirobumi.

Itō Hirobumi - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

One of the driving forces. Meiji didn't leave much written correspondence or diaries behind and first hand accounts are often contradictory about his personality and political stances. Most likely he was an adept politician playing the genro off of each other curbing the more extreme factions.

 

[Alexander's Hetaroi]

2. Only Zaibatu is unique (Corporations founded by member of Samurai caste, I think the oldest standing - Mitsubishi - is founded by a Daimyo even, and the founder is shown up in Ryoma drama.), other UIs are a mere translations of someone else's generic choices'
- Ginkou is literally bank (Silver shop).
- Jukugyo is factory

Well Zaibatsu were created by families owning banks and heavy industry factories. So, in that regard, it fits.

 

[Lonecat Nekophrodite]

Well Zaibatsu were created by families owning banks and heavy industry factories. So, in that regard, it fits.

And both Banks and Factories are parts of Zaibatu?
To this. Zaibatu (office) should be build first (anywhere) and then followed by banks and factories (not neccessary in the same city but if both are, there should be a bonus to boost each other).

 

[Alexander's Hetaroi]

And both Banks and Factories are parts of Zaibatu?
To this. Zaibatu (office) should be build first (anywhere) and then followed by banks and factories (not neccessary in the same city but if both are, there should be a bonus to boost each other).

In order to create the Zaibatsu you have to build the Ginko (bank) and the Junkogyo (factory) on the same tile. That goes for all civs that has a unique quarter and two buildings. The unique buildings are the ones that create the quarter.

 

[Lonecat Nekophrodite]

In order to create the Zaibatsu you have to build the Ginko (bank) and the Junkogyo (factory) on the same tile. That goes for all civs that has a unique quarter and two buildings. The unique buildings are the ones that create the quarter.

And only with this Meiji Japanes cities can earn Zaibatu bonus? this is similiar to Egyptian Necropolis.

 

[Alexander's Hetaroi]

And only with this Meiji Japanes cities can earn Zaibatu bonus? this is similiar to Egyptian Necropolis.

Yes. Building Egypt's Mastaba and Mortuary Temple buildings on the same tile will create the Necropolis Quarter.

 

[Wohlauf]

It is Mitsubishi Ki-30 'Ann'. Exported to Siam, which locally nicked 'Nagoya' after a city where manufacturing plant is located.
I think Fxis even has skins for Siamese as well.

While it would be cool if it was the Ki-30, two major things stand out. First is the visable machine guns mounted on top of the engine. That is a reason in itself, but the shape of the engine cowling to fit the guns and the way it obscures the bottom of the front of the cockpit is just not present on the Ki-30.

The dead giveaway is the antenna. The Ki-30 has the antenna protrude from the center of the top of the front of the cockpit and run to the tail. The SBD Dauntless has the antenna in front of the cockpit, on the left side, which matches the plane in Himiko's video.

I'd rather you be right. Firaxis just isn't giving the modern age the cultural variation to generic units that it could. Though, at least to me, it's a small smudge on an otherwise spotless presentation.

 

[AriochIV]

Are 'pagoda' towers a distinct feature of Japanese dreadnoughts? did they design these themselves or someone else did design this type of tower before?

The pagoda superstructures were a uniquely Japanese development of the commonly-used tripod superstructure. They were added to support searchlights and lookouts for night fighting.

 

[Rac]

Meiji's Background Art

 

[Zaarin]

I mentioned this in the music thread, but I like the bold color contrast that we haven't really seen in a lot of these illustrations.

 

[TheGhostEnthusiast]

Nice to get an unobstructed view after the Himiko trailer. It's a nice piece of art, and I like the colors, but I must admit that I'm not certain about it as a representation of Civ VII's Meiji Japan... The gameplay is very much about industrialization and science and militarism and expanding as much as you can, so a peaceful scene focused on elements of Japan's cultural reputation (cherry blossoms) that is framed completely inside of a gate (makes it feel somewhat cramped) feels at odds with that.

 

[Uberfrog]

Nice to get an unobstructed view after the Himiko trailer. It's a nice piece of art, and I like the colors, but I must admit that I'm not certain about it as a representation of Civ VII's Meiji Japan... The gameplay is very much about industrialization and science and militarism and expanding as much as you can, so a peaceful scene focused on elements of Japan's cultural reputation (cherry blossoms) that is framed completely inside of a gate (makes it feel somewhat cramped) feels at odds with that.

I feel like most of the artworks we’ve seen have skewed towards the peaceful?

The only ones I would describe as even vaguely warlike are America, France, Ming and Chola.

 

[8housesofelixir]

Interestingly, there is almost nothing "modern" in this background art. Besides the cupola roof on the left, you may safely say this is the background art for Edo Japan.

 

[Boris Gudenuf]

The pagoda superstructures were a uniquely Japanese development of the commonly-used tripod superstructure. They were added to support searchlights and lookouts for night fighting.

Exactly. The Japanese navy emphasized training and techniques for night fighting, because the Washington Naval Treaty/Conference of 1922 legally limited tre size of their fleet in relation to their two most potentially dangerous opponents: the United States and Britain. Their answer to that was to fight battles at night where better training and preparation could make up for being outnumbered, as they assumed they would be.

The result was actions like Savo Island off Guadalcanal in which 4 Allied heavy cruisers were sunk by a Japanese task force in a night action with guns and torpedoes, for no loss to the Japanese. Unfortunately for all the preparations, RADAR up-ended all the plans and by 1944 made any surface action by the Imperial Navy almost suicidal - see the Leyte Gulf battleship actions which were egregiously one-sided, even though most of the American battleships there were old vessels recovered from the bottom of Pearl Harbor!

 

[queenpea]

Oh it's so pretty! I don't think I'll ever select them as I'm not a military player, but points for style.

 

[Alexander's Hetaroi]

Interestingly, there is almost nothing "modern" in this background art. Besides the cupola roof on the left, you may safely say this is the background art for Edo Japan.

Could have used a hot-air balloon, at least.