pre-release info New First Look: Charlemagne

[DogeEnricoDandolo]

We have three personas currently. Ashoka's, Xerxes's and Napoleon's. I assume another three will be revealed until the game's launch.

Yes, we still have 2 unrevealed personas we are guaranteed to have at launch, one from Deluxe pack and one from Founder pack. Probably 1 more from the base game, which is not out of the realm of possibility.

 

[Andrew Johnson [FXS]]

Observations on language are also right - he's speaking Frankish, which sounds to my ears sounds very German (I speak only a bit of German, so my ears aren't great at this).

 

[Lord Lakely]

Observations on language are also right - he's speaking Frankish, which sounds to my ears sounds very German (I speak only a bit of German, so my ears aren't great at this).

It sounds like Dutch. (then again Dutch sounds like most old germanic languages, like Old English and Franconian)

 

[foodyboi]

I feel that if Germany was a modern CIV the narrator would have included it as a link with Charla.

Makes me feel that its Britain/Russia as the last two modern civs.

 

[Uberfrog]

Charlemagne also never wore the Crown of Charlemagne! It's named after his legacy, not as a gift to him. And so yes we were left without a lot of reference for a crown!

Otto’s Imperial Crown is hands down my favourite crown in history, so I am more than happy to give the artists a pass!

If anyone is ever in Vienna, you have to visit the Kaiserliche Schatzkammer.

 

[Atlas627]

I feel that if Germany was a modern CIV the narrator would have included it as a link with Charla.

Makes me feel that its Britain/Russia as the last two modern civs.

That's a reasonable observation, but they didn't mention that the Normans were "his" civ either, just that they have synergy. And they didn't mention anyone as his civ, which seems unlikely.

 

[gdr_willter]

That's a reasonable observation, but they didn't mention that the Normans were "his" civ either, just that they have synergy. And they didn't mention anyone as his civ, which seems unlikely.

I think they always mentioned the leader-civ relation in that way in previous FL videos.

 

[FishFishFish]

I'm happy see a early middle age leader in Civ VII. There was a notable lack until now.

 

[Evolena]

Acceptable perhaps, but an error, I think. I would prefer Gaul as the Antiquity era representation of France, and I feel Franks and the crusades fit the games Exploration era quite well.

The first croisade is around the time when the Kingdom of the Franks became the Kingdom of France, and the king at that time was excommunicated, so he couldn't participate. Franks are still time-wise Exploration age (~500-~1100), but I would not link them to the croisades.

I think they always mentioned the leader-civ relation in that way in previous FL videos.

In some video they say "his/her native civ" in addition to "pairing".

 

[Atlas627]

I think they always mentioned the leader-civ relation in that way in previous FL videos.

I just went back to check them all. None have mentioned a Modern civ yet, Machiavelli mentioned only a single civ (like Charlemagne), Tecumseh mentioned only Shawnee but called them "historical", Isabella mentioned only Spain but called them her "home civ", Augustus called Rome an "obvious Antiquity civ choice" (though mentioned Greece and Spain), and Hatshepsut called Egypt "her native" civ (though also mentioned Abbasid). All the rest mentioned multiple civs and did not indicate which (maybe all) were unlocks.

 

[durfal]

As another Dutch speaker I can confirm that it sounds like Older Dutch as it should be, because the Old Low Franconian which he spoke is the same and just another name for Old-Dutch.
I'm happy Karel de Grote (Charlemagne) is in de game and they at least from what I heard made him speak Old Dutch instead of some kind of older French or High German.

As for the Franks themselves I would be happy to see them in the Antiquity age only (later on).
As they are the direct ancesters of the Dutch and Flemish people it would conflict with the Dutch in the Exploration age (I presume) in one of the DLC's/Expansions unless the Dutch are put in the Modern age which fits too but I expect they would go for our Golden Era in the Exploration Age.
But since they put him as a Civless leader in the base game I don't think we will see the Franks anytime soon.

 

[The Fanatical]

Dido doesn't really belong in the same category with Aeneas; most historians agree she was real. Her brother certainly was; we have some of his inscriptions. I think Dido works well because she ties together the Phoenician East and the Phoenician West, and most of the obvious alternatives are warmongers (sorry, Hannibal) or obscure (any Tyrian or Sidonian or Byblian king, for example) or debatably Phoenician (Azatiwadda, for instance)--and none can simultaneously represent both East and West like she does. Dido also embodies the Northwest Semitic admiration for cleverness (see also the Biblical Jacob or the Ugaritic Danel). So I wouldn't object to seeing Hanno the Navigator or Hamilcar Barca or Tabnit of Sidon or even Hannibal Barca again, but I think there are a lot of compelling arguments for why Dido is a rock-solid choice for Phoenicia.

I mean, they exist in the same epic. Her existence is uncertain at best in my opinion. What's certain is that the founding myth of Carthage wasn't real. The city was created by Punic traders and settlers, and no wealthy fugitive queen created it in order to escape her tyrannical brother. Such an event doesn't even make sense because she would have been slaughtered along her husband in the first place if her existence remotely threatened her brother's ascent to power.

Pygmalion might have been real, but any connection to a Dido is absent from surviving inscriptions of his era, and the representation of both West and East that you mention is weak. Even if she existed, did she even rule a united Punic empire that included both West and East Punic colonies? A historical figure (from the Magonids or the Barcids) that existed at the height of Punic power (Carthaginian Empire) seems more fitting to me than a legendary queen with dubious events surrounding her (unproven) life. And even if she was real, she would be categorized as semi-mythical based on her fictional actions alone.

 

[Trav'ling Canuck]

There's a massive imbalance of western/european leaders though.

There are TWO EURO CIVS PER ERA. And so far we know about Augustus, Isabella, Machiavelli, Charlemagne, both Napoleons, Franklin and if the rating spoiler is true, Frederick II and Catherine the Great. (This is the mean reason why Charlemagne was such a surprise to me - the Euro market is already oversaturated)

That's a lot of Leaders competing for essential two puny slots (three in Modern)

Nobody is going to complain about having extra European leaders to rule over other civilizations.

 

[Hellenism Salesman]

Just now seeing this- awesome!

But am I the only one who thinks he looks at least a little bit like Kurt Russell?

 

[Zaarin]

I mean, they exist in the same epic.

A yes, a self-aggrandizing piece of Roman propaganda is a great source. Elissa Dido is well-attested in Phoenician/Punic inscriptions--granted, as a divinity. (At an earlier time, I admit I doubted Dido's existence, assuming she was probably a goddess all along. I've since changed my mind. I think she was a real person who was deified, not unlike Augustus or Kubaba.)

Her existence is uncertain at best in my opinion. What's certain is that the founding myth of Carthage wasn't real. The city was created by Punic traders and settlers, and no wealthy fugitive queen created it in order to escape her tyrannical brother.

So?

Even if she existed, did she even rule a united Punic empire that included both West and East Punic colonies?

Did Pericles? Did Pakal or Lady Six Sky? Being a unified empire is irrelevant for being a civ, or a leader of a civ.

A historical figure (from the Magonids or the Barcids) that existed at the height of Punic power (Carthaginian Empire) seems more fitting to me than a legendary queen with dubious events surrounding her (unproven) life.

And they're all going to be warmongers from the Punic Wars, which fits very poorly with a good Phoenician/Punic design, which should be focused on trade, colonization, and thalassocracy. As far as Iron Age civilizations go, the Phoenicians were relatively un-warlike, and centering their civ design around the Punic Wars is a very poor design IMO. About the only historically attested person I can think of who would fit well would be Hanno the Navigator, and by your own metrics, he's only attested by Greek sources--which arguably makes him more mythical than Dido, who is at least attested in Punic.

And even if she existed, she would be categorized as semi-mythical based on her fictional actions alone.

Again, I don't see this as a problem. The woman herself was almost certainly real; she was a culture hero and minor divinity to her people; and she does a good job representing Phoenician cultural values in a way that a Punic Wars-era Carthaginian sufet or general would not. I simply can't imagine a leader design for Hannibal or Hamilcar Barca that would synergize well with Phoenicia/Carthage unless the civ is designed around the Punic Wars, which IMO feels as poorly though-out as designing the Shawnee around the War of 1812.

 

[ehecatzin]

Really happy Charlemagne is in, obvious choice under civ VII rules for leaders, seems very well balanced for either tall specialists or domination. I imagine seeing his abilities that if we get a HRE civ later on it might be more about adjacencies, sort of like China.

 

[Krajzen]

I love the fact we got Father of Europe in the game - there has always been this problem of including him in the old system, while here he fits perfectly.

The only thing missing is HRE / Franks / Carolingians as a civ - fingers crossed for HRE in particular.

 

[kryat]

Shoutout to that fantastic model of Notre Dame at the end. It’s lovely to finally see a full 3D model

 

[Eagle Pursuit]

Shoutout to that fantastic model of Notre Dame at the end. It’s lovely to finally see a full 3D model

I really like the glowy window effect, even if it should be reversed. It's a gothic cathedral, sunlight should be illuminating the interior in an awesome display of colors, not interior lights illuminating from within.

 

[Jkchart]

A little disappointed as I was looking forward to William the Conqueror, and he seems very unlikely wedged between Charlemagne and 2x Napoleon. I hope we get him eventually, though. This just blew the door wide open for Zenobia.

Zenobia would be fantastic