New IGN Preview...

I find most interesting the attention they're giving to the music.
well, I play Civ without any sound nor music, so that's the last issue I would bother. Give us graphics that stun.

As for now, the units are multimess units, the mountains look like volcanoes and the landscape is out of proportion and a bit kiddy :( Hope they will improve that. That they create a so called world view, to give us a the rectangle map rolled onto a sphere :nono:
 
Well, Firaxis, methinks you might have converted me to the game with music. :D Who knows, I may actually buy it now when it comes out. :)

Graphics still leave something to be desired... Multiple peaks in a mountain tile would be nice... and the borders are actually kinda ugly, though I absolutely LOVE how they follow a river when one is on the edge of the civilization's boundary.
 
MishGolden said:
The Saladin leaderhead looks great, but I'm somewhat disappointed with this choice to lead the Arabs. Although he must have led mostly-Arab armies, he was knows as Salah al-Din the Kurd -- he was a Kurd, not an Arab.

The background of Jerusalem also looks great with the Dome of the Rock there, but, again, I have a quibble. Why Jerusalem for the Arab leader? It was never the center of the Arab world, as Mecca, Medina, Baghdad, and Damascus have been. I think I understand why Firaxis did it -- Jerusalem is much more recognizable, but still. In all, if I were an Arab, I don;t think I would be happy with that picture.

I am an Arab, and I am happy with that picture.
 
close up and w/ the camera tilted, the mountains look ok, but from the top down bird's eye view, the mountains all look alike, and don't really seem to connect. i think part of it is that the tiles r still a bit too squarish.

i think religion's just being pushed to the front as it's one of the larger additions to the game that reaches so many facets of the game- as it affects ur cities, units, improvements/wonders, gov't, etc.
 
PC.IGN article quoted and commented.

We went to Firaxis and all we got was this awesome preview.
I wouldn't use the word "awesome", maybe "barely adequate" might be better, mainly because the amount of info is quite little (and mainly concentrated into graphics, music and religion) but the game isn't even in beta yet so every new little bits of info makes us happy

The actual game map now reveals which terrain tiles are being worked and shows off a number of civic improvements.

Each city improvement will list the specific bonus it imparts to a city's coffers, contentment and culture.
That surely sounds like good improvement when it comes to the interface. I like all these improvements. It also means you don't need to use time into activity you don't want to and help is near all the time.

Each ruler has two defining characteristics, each of which grants them a unique bonus and lessens the cost of two city improvements by half.
Very much what I wanted to hear. Each leader will play the game differently and give different experience. Maybe the traits make sense and have actual effect into game of course while maintaining balance.

As I said, some civilizations only have one ruler, so you'll be stuck with their characteristics.
Very bad news which of course we already knew. Every civ should have two choices for leaders. Period.
I have hard time believing people in Firaxis didn't come up with two leaders for many of the civilizations. Back to the books, one might say.

Throughout the game you'll have the opportunity to gain a number of great leaders in a variety of areas -- artistry, commerce, war, etc.

Unlike the previous versions, Civilization IV will allow for multiple Golden Ages in the course of a single game.)
All these ideas about leaders sounded good. So there is also leader of war?
Multiple Golden Age sounds reasonable especially since after the first one there would be otherwise no point of trying to do certain things.

The new version of the game has no set eras and requires only that you reach one of the pre-requisites for a given technology rather than obtaining all of them. Who needs Pottery anyway? This makes it much easier to research along specific lines, focusing exclusively on either military, commercial or cultural technologies.
Even though I think flexible technology tree is very good and removing eras is very much an improvement, I am total disbelieve if there is option just to concentrate example into military aspects of the game. In my opinion even though different playing styles should be emphatized equally the game will take direction where there's no need for historical realism (simple realism). Different "advances" of human kind of different fields of life have always been linked together. Even though prewriting history is nice, in my opinion there should be certain basic follow up because just like in history different events and advances have followed each other from all parts of life and not independently from each other.

If that is taken away it will mean that some people only will concentrate example into military aspects of game. I would rather try to make people play more "balanced game" were you have to sometimes choose that library over temple or over barracks especially since the times of civilization change. It's the matter of degree between in which people can concentrate into certain field of advances and the need for study the other fields of advances in order to actually handle the test of time. IMHO of course.
No civilization has ever been able to stay in the power just making militaric advancement (look Mongols).

Another big change for the game is the introduction of specific religions.
I think many of the innovations about religions sound promising but what is still unclear how big effect these are on game and do you actually benefit having same religion as someone else. We need to know more in order to evaluate opinions about them but they are must have even though they are sure to stir some controversy.

We also found out a bit more about the different promotions you can assign to your units. Since there are different upgrade paths for different types of units, you'll wind up having a pretty specialized fighting force as the game progresses.
This is very much and outstanding idea if the strategy behind combat engine actually works and example AI makes good use of it.

The game's presentation relies very heavily on music,
Sounds and music are very big part of the experience and if I have to choose between average graphics and good score of music against superb graphics and lousy pieces of music, I would pick the one with better music.
Of course this again raises the question have they concentrated too much into audio-visual output and into interface rather than actual depth of strategy. But of course we all have different views what Civ is and what it should be.

The game is still on target to ship this Fall and is already being tested pretty heavily. Since all the big features are in place, the team will be spending the time between now and the release tweaking the math and balancing the game's AI. If all goes according to plan, the developers will have a beta build by August.
"all the big features are in place", hmm...Firaxis doesn't want to show too much now as they are still testing and it could mean the details of the game are still little bit obscure in a way that some things might still change.

the new game seems much more streamlined and full of personality. Combat animations are specific to the units involved in the fighting, the diplomatic screen shows lively and expressive opponents, and short movies once again announce the completion of specific wonders. Gamers who have been turned off by the drier presentation of previous versions are likely to find Civilization IV to be much more engaging this time around.
This is my biggest fear considering Civ IV. There's too little to be know have the changes been good for the "strategic gaming" Since the game is more flexible, streamlined and graphically impressive (compared to earlier versions) there's chance that the whole game is geared towards even wider audience. I wish "drier presentation" doesn't mean that actually strategic parts of game have been changed into simplicty and obscrutiny in order to achieve better status in audience that likes RTS. What I wouldn't really want is to see Civ as a game change into some kind of "Semi-RTS", even though option to play it like that wouldn't of course hurt if you have option to choose play the game the old way and if there are still complexity in the strategic side of game. (Complexity doesn't mean hard to control or hard to understand)Good looks, Easy to use interface and complex strategies hardly ever go hand to hand. Maybe it is different this a way around.

The units seem to do look little (or more) clunky and big when looked from close-up but from farther away they look OK to me. And for me the real deal is to have working graphics that give you insight what unit is where rather than seeing whether they scratch their crotch or not. Even though battle animation might be nice to see eventually you get used and possible dulled to them so the first priority should be somewhere else than in those. Very much same goes to wonder movies and leader animation. They are eye candy but hardly contribute nothing signifant to the game. Of course overall feeling of the game might change towards "greater, more tasteful and fuller experience" but it would need also that there is strategic depth rather than shallow and fleeting experience of movement of different shapes and colors of light in one's eye.

I was sure that Civ IV would take step into 3D enviroment and add more these "multimedia" events including music (which isn't surely bad) but it's the matter of degree were the game turns from dull strategy game into impressive artistic show. Example I did like the first generation of Panzer Generals much more than the follower Panzer General 2.
As said it's not the size of the dog in the fight but the size of the fight in the dog. Maybe Civ IV isn't as shallow as it might look from the surface, it's sure that we need to know more in order to make valid judgements.

What comes to Saladin, he did lead the arabs so I would say he is definately fit to lead the Arabs. And the picture looked very good.
Doesn't make me drool though and neither does Civ IV yet.
 
Quentin said:
I find most interesting the attention they're giving to the music.

Yes, this is what made me the most excited. Especially the fact that each country diplomacy gets different music (finally!!! This is one of things i loved about civ1). And the fact that music changes as things get more modern gave me an orgasm. It reminds me of how they took the same music in Pirates! for each country, and varied it in the cities depending on the type of city and its condition.
 
Quentin said:
I find most interesting the attention they're giving to the music.

Not really surprising considering how many Firaxians are musicians.
 
The attention their giving to music really has me excited about the presentation in the game. It could easily pass Alpha Centauri.
 
Well, looking at the Screenshots a second time, it definitely appears that mixed unit types will 'mingle' together-for want of a better word. This makes true simultaneous stacked combat a real possibillity this time around, though I still hope to see some grouped combat before the game ships.
As for those still complaining about graphics, might I remind you that this is an ALPHA or-at the very latest-Mid Beta version of the game, and I am sure that the Graphics will be the last thing they clean up (given that I have been told it is the easiest part of the game to do). If people would only remember how CRAP the Civ3 graphics appeared just 4-5 months before the game shipped, then they might be a little more forgiving of Civ4's early graphics. Also, the screen is only truly cluttered when you are at maximum zoom, which is a lot closer than in civ2 or civ3-and will probably only be utilized when you want to fight IMO. At 'normal' zoom it looks no better or worse than civ3 graphics.
Its also good to see that they have rebalanced the old Expansionist trait, to make it truly worthwhile (I remember it was kinda pathetic in Civ3, especially after the Ancient age). I wonder, though, are these ALL of the traits-or are there more? I would love to see Agricultural and Seafaring traits make a comeback, personally.
Oh, and I think the reason they have the background of Jerusalem behind Saladin is because-lets face it-that is what he is best known for, historically. I mean, they have Ghandi outside of the Taj Mahal-in Agra-which is miles from the Capital of Delhi. I feel certain the Mecca and Medina will still be the chief cities of the Arabs.


Yours,
Aussie_Lurker.
 
crap. I don't have internet at home for the time being (I'm changing my provider) and at work the links are blocked... GRRRRRRRRRr!!!
 
I strongly hope Mecca and Medina won't be the first cities of the Arabs, they'll come later on in the first 10, but not as number one and two, please. At least, they've added Susa to the Persian list.
I myself think, Saladin is the excellent leader for the Arabs, but I'm somehow sad that they just got one leader. We have now only two civs left for two leaders. What are your assumptions? Rome certainly, but then? Greece, Egypt to add some more ancient ones? Or Japan to add importance to Asia? Spain or Germany would also be a possibility, the first allowing another female leader. We'll need to see.

I want to comment further on one special screenshot:

http://media.pc.ign.com/media/620/620513/img_2872470.html

Here we see a world from above and we can see that all the cities are painted either in green, grey or pink. What do these colours mean? I first thought of religions. But I just saw that although all green cities are Hindu and the pink one is buddhist, grey represents both Judaism and Christianity. Otherwise, it would've been a great example to show the different modes one can look at a map.
but in this case, my creativity just left me. What could that screen show us?

mfG m
 
A stunning piece of music. If the rest of it keeps this quality I might buy Civ IV just for the sound :goodjob:
 
ign mentions that "about" 8 of the 18 civs have 2 leaders - ne ideas which ones for wut... so far i got:

two rulers:
chinese: qin shi huang/mao zedong
english: elizabeth/victoria
french: naploean/louis xiv
mongols: genghis khan/kublai khan
americans: washington/fdr
indians: ghandi/ashoka

one ruler only:
arabs: saladin

unknown no. of leaders:
japanese: tokugawa
greeks: alexander
romans: julius caesar
egyptians: hatshepsut
persians: cyrus
aztecs: montezuma

unknown:
germans: ?
incans: ?
russians: ?
spanish: ?
mali: ?
 
the philosophical leader trait has me drooling that Marcus Aurelius might be Romes second leader :drool:
 
mitsho said:
Here we see a world from above and we can see that all the cities are painted either in green, grey or pink. What do these colours mean? I first thought of religions. But I just saw that although all green cities are Hindu and the pink one is buddhist, grey represents both Judaism and Christianity. Otherwise, it would've been a great example to show the different modes one can look at a map.
but in this case, my creativity just left me. What could that screen show us?

mfG m

Population growth/loss?
 
So you mean:
The spanish possess the holy city of hinduism, they see and know (pretty much) everything of the cities were this religion is predominant. The player has set the mode here to show growth. So, he/she sees this in every city that is hinduistic, they are shown either green (growing) or pink/red (starving). The grey cities are not hinduistic, and thus the player has no information wether they grow or not.

Pretty good, this screen also shows the line of sight within religion, cool ... :)

Another fact that occured to me when looking at this screen: They probably scrapped the pangaea/continent/archipelago model, because we have here a map that is entirely land. I'd prefer a CTP style of map-creating. and perhaps they have done quite this.... :)

mfG mitsho
 
One thing that I noticed in one of the videos (don't remember which one) is that there are units armed with crossbows!
 
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