New Version - May 10th (5/10)

[randomnub]

*and play a different game

 

[ElliotS]

Yeah, if you want to play a full-earth game try EU4 imo.

 

[CrazyG]

That's not the math you have to do.
You're comparing "20 non-puppet cities without Empiricism" to "20 non-puppet cities with Empiricism", wherease a more reasonnable comparaison would be "10 non-puupet cities and 10 puppet cities without Empiricism" and "20 non-puppet cities with Empiriciscm"
However, even with "the good math", Empiricism is still very powerfull, and OP on big maps
(don't forget that the mod is balanced for standard map size)

I'll edit the comment to be more clear I am referring only to non-puppet cities. I did mention that these were the numbers for a standard map

You can have as many puppets as you want, they no longer raise tech costs. If you have 1 non puppet, whether you have 0 puppets or 20 puppets makes no difference. If you want to make that specific comparison, all the numbers you need are available in that post. Your costs would be 1990 with a 10/10 split. If you take empiricism and annex all puppets, the cost rises to 2,140. So you raise your tech costs by about 7.5%. Assuming you can handle the happiness and culture penalties of annexing it would probably be very worthwhile.

 

[Gazebo]

hell Government

Already living through this, thanks though.

In all seriousness, we're not adding any new features to VP. Just messing with numbers and fixing bugs.

G

 

[ElliotS]

I'll edit the comment to be more clear I am referring only to non-puppet cities. I did mention that these were the numbers for a standard map

You can have as many puppets as you want, they no longer raise tech costs. If you have 1 non puppet, whether you have 0 puppets or 20 puppets makes no difference. If you want to make that specific comparison, all the numbers you need are available in that post. Your costs would be 1990 with a 10/10 split. If you take empiricism and annex all puppets, the cost rises to 2,140. So you raise your tech costs by about 7.5%. Assuming you can handle the happiness and culture penalties of annexing it would probably be very worthwhile.

The point is that there are cities you'd keep as puppets without the policy that you'd annex with it, so rather than just measuring it as pure science gain it's closer to measure it as the ability to assume direct control of more satellite cities profitably.

As of right now I think it's balanced.

 

[CrazyG]

The point is that there are cities you'd keep as puppets without the policy that you'd annex with it, so rather than just measuring it as pure science gain it's closer to measure it as the ability to assume direct control of more satellite cities profitably.

As of right now I think it's balanced.

I wasn't advocating it was unbalanced

 

[randomnub]

This barbarian parked next to Madrid for 4 turns, simply fortifying after showing up and taking some damage, ignoring the nearby worker, and not razing any yeld as they used to do.

After being reduced to 1 hp (aww I missed culture) he ran away 2 tiles in direction to his encampment. :| Then moved back 1 tile and sit out of city bombardment range in fortified stance but not healing.

A bit annoying and not a real threat.

 

[Empiremaker]

Apostolic Tradition + Brazil...just wow. By renaissance get spread religion got me almost 1000 Golden Age Points per spread on Epic speed, so perpetual GA. But the UA also gives half the total accumulated, instead of the cost of the next GA. Massive gold and tourism and with rollover golden age points the yields are insane.

Even without Brazil, Apostolic Tradition seems to give way too big of yields, especially scaling with era and population, so double scaling.

Overall, seems way beyond intended synergy

 

[ofmiciv5]

is this change log the same as 2.5.11?

 

[Erikose]

Another great release, Gazebo!

Into the classical era, and trade values seem back to normal. Civs that like me give me one to one on luxury items(although a friendly Alexander won't trade me his whale for my lapis without a gpt sweetener!), and strategic resources seem to be valued appropriately again and make them worth considering for trades.

Can't speak to war AI yet, but will get that chance soon as our little continent is filling up with four neighbors. To echo randomnub, however, barb AI is definitely off. Will sit fortified right next to a city or one one of my units indefinitely until killed - and does not regenerate hit points. Swooping down on unprotected workers or pillaging improvements does not seem to happen. If next to city, they are still damaging/looting, but pillaging does not occur even if damaged and on top of one.

Cheers!



- E

 

[Takagi Hiro]

Minor bug; if anyone wishes to report to Github, good on you and thanks!

Mercantile luxuries (glass, porcelain, etc...) now stay on conqest, which was fixed by my request some time ago, but sadly, these do not count to your city's resource diversity on trade routes unlike when it was owned by a city-state.

I captured Colombo, which had glass, and it never showed in the trade calculations, so I then captured Hong Kong as well to be sure, which also had glass, and again, it was not added to the diversity totals (0.5 or 1 for monopoly). The luxuries are still tradeable and count towards monopolies as intended, but they become sort of "invisible" after capture, perhaps because they're exclusive luxuries with no actual "improved by" tile.

 

[ElliotS]

AI still seems to offer 0 gpt for horse/iron sometimes. Not just when you approach them and they don't need it, but they'll send me multiple offers per game offering me nothing for 2-3 horses/iron in ancient-classical-medieval. (value 10-18. Standard speed.)

Also is the Deity AI supposed to get free promotions? I think I've heard you say otherwise, but they do for sure.

 

[LukaSlovenia29]

AI still seems to offer 0 gpt for horse/iron sometimes. Not just when you approach them and they don't need it, but they'll send me multiple offers per game offering me nothing for 2-3 horses/iron in ancient-classical-medieval. (value 10-18. Standard speed.)

Also is the Deity AI supposed to get free promotions? I think I've heard you say otherwise, but they do for sure.

I too have been getting some very low trade offers.

Yes, they get free promotions, you can change it in difficultymod.xml file by changing the value of "AIFreeXP". They also get more XP from battles than the human player, you can also change that.

 

[ElliotS]

Has anyone made it to turn 100 in Deity without getting declared on? It seems to happen like clockwork before I hit horsemen as Songhai, even if I build archers and such to defend myself.

I've yet to lose anything in these early wars (actually they feed me culture via authority) so I figured it might make sense to see if this is prevalent. This is clear AI error to think they can win these wars with warriors and an archer or two. They'd need at least 4-5 archers to take my cities.

 

[bigcat88]

Has anyone made it to turn 100 in Deity without getting declared on? .

In all my deity games, I always get 1-2 wars till 100 turn On Immortal got the same. First war is almost always safe, if the AI is not Aztecs that is very near to me.

 

[kawyua]

Has anyone made it to turn 100 in Deity without getting declared on? It seems to happen like clockwork before I hit horsemen as Songhai, even if I build archers and such to defend myself.

Well every single game someone somewhere goes and declares a war on me. I was taken by surprise once by an early warrior and archer rush one game which followed by horse people 10 turns after - I gave up on that. AI can get some good follow up if they have horses, but other than that its pretty weak. Most of the time the attack can be ignored and they'll just give up the attack after losing some units.

What can be very scary is those delayed declarations with turn 70 swordman and catapult armies. I was not prepared for that =(.

It really does seem like clockwork though as nearly everyone wants to have a go at war at some point in the first 100 turns. However, I don't find it bad anyway whatsoever. These are rather judicious strength tests!

 

[bigcat88]

Guys I don't know if it is a bug or not(so I prefer to ask it here, before find it in a new game and post to GitHub). If res is not present on map and I get it throw GA -> looks like I don't get a monopoly.
It's normal or not? I don't know cause all other games last 2 months a play with 43 civs and there was always all res on maps. Now I play only 33 civs and see a few days ago such situation with coffee.

 

[tu_79]

I think you only get monopolies for resources that you control. Gifted by states or traded doesn't count.

 

[bigcat88]

It is resource from Great Admiral. I can get monopoly for glass for example or some other lux res if it is on map only one (so I get 200%) I see how AI get res monopoly for copper from GA (the only one copper in world was on my territory).

 

[Gazebo]

It is resource from Great Admiral. I can get monopoly for glass for example or some other lux res if it is on map only one (so I get 200%) I see how AI get res monopoly for copper from GA (the only one copper in world was on my territory).

It does not count as monopoly as it is not technically on the map.