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[Max M.]

Btw. one curious observation. When I had DLC civs (Spain, Inca, Babylon) disabled I have *never* seen those extra natural wonders (El Dorado, FoY) in any of my games (and that's a lot during December/January).
Now I enabled Babylon back a few days ago and boom! - face these broken NW in almost every game.
I.e., although these natural wonders are intended to be in game regardless of the paid DLCs, it looks like disabling (all) the DLCs (by hiding their folders) also disables new NW somehow. (Notice I moved only DLC_Deluxe and DLC_02 folders (i.e. Babylon/Spain/Inca) and did not touch DLC\Shared folder (where the definition of new natural wonders is)). Now I wonder how they work within a game with no DLC purchased .

 

[kcd_swede]

Btw. one curious observation. When I had DLC civs (Spain, Inca, Babylon) disabled I have *never* seen those extra natural wonders (El Dorado, FoY) in any of my games (and that's a lot during December/January).
Now I enabled Babylon back a few days ago and boom! - face these broken NW in almost every game.
I.e., although these natural wonders are intended to be in game regardless of the paid DLCs, it looks like disabling (all) the DLCs (by hiding their folders) also disables new NW somehow. (Notice I moved only DLC_Deluxe and DLC_02 folders (i.e. Babylon/Spain/Inca) and did not touch DLC\Shared folder (where the definition of new natural wonders is)). Now I wonder how they work within a game with no DLC purchased .

I've definitely seen ElDorado, and I have only free DLC. I've never received any bonus for NW's though. Maybe I'm too slow to explore or unlucky.

 

[Monthar]

I've definitely seen ElDorado, and I have only free DLC. I've never received any bonus for NW's though. Maybe I'm too slow to explore or unlucky.

The first civ to find El Dorado gets 500 gold. Any units that get near the Fountain of Youth get a bonus to their heal rate.

If you had purchased the Spanish/Inca DLC and played as Spain, then you'd get 500 gold for every natural wonder if you're the first to find it and 100 for them if you're not the first. If the Spanish find El Dorado first they get 1000 gold, the 500 everyone gets plus 500 for their UA.

 

[kcd_swede]

The first civ to find El Dorado gets 500 gold. Any units that get near the Fountain of Youth get a bonus to their heal rate.

If you had purchased the Spanish/Inca DLC and played as Spain, then you'd get 500 gold for every natural wonder if you're the first to find it and 100 for them if you're not the first. If the Spanish find El Dorado first they get 1000 gold, the 500 everyone gets plus 500 for their UA.

Sounds... game-breaking.

 

[MadDjinn]

Sounds... game-breaking.

pretty much.

1000g right off the mark? spam de spam of settlers.

 

[iggymnrr]

This sounds like a nightmare. There are two things I don't like about banning DLC. One, Freaksis made the right call with the original civs. Two, when Freaksis finishes development there is likely to be some kind of complete package available, putting all who played previously at a disadvantage.

 

[Denniz]

This sounds like a nightmare. There are two things I don't like about banning DLC. One, Freaksis made the right call with the original civs. Two, when Freaksis finishes development there is likely to be some kind of complete package available, putting all who played previously at a disadvantage.

Someone is at a disadvantage no matter what we do. Have's vs. Have not's. This way it might give HOF play a boost when/if they make the DLC available for free.

 

[Neuro]

Based on the assumption that all the DLC civs will be included in the first expansion pack, perhaps the HoF should be seperated into Base Game + Free DLC, and then a second category for Paid DLC. Once the expansion arrives, the Paid DLC category can be rolled into the Xpac HoF.

 

[Denniz]

The problem isn't with people playing the Civs themselves as much as them showing up as opponents. That can mess with the comparability of games on the same table.

 

[Sun Tzu Wu]

The problem isn't with people playing the Civs themselves as much as them showing up as opponents. That can mess with the comparability of games on the same table.

Of course paid DLC can't be included; it doesn't really matter whether as the Player Civ, Opponent Civ(s) or just being flagged as containing paid DLC; If submitted HoF Games can't be loaded by all players, what is the point?

I'm more concerned about being able to load saved Games that others have submitted that contain or more to the point are flagged to potentially have paid DLC when the downloader doesn't have the required paid DLC (as indicated in the save file flags).

In my opinion, this point hasn't been adequately addressed yet.

Sun Tzu Wu

 

[Denniz]

Of course paid DLC can't be included; it doesn't really matter whether as the Player Civ, Opponent Civ(s) or just being flagged as containing paid DLC; If submitted HoF Games can't be loaded by all players, what is the point?

I'm more concerned about being able to load saved Games that others have submitted that contain or more to the point are flagged to potentially have paid DLC when the downloader doesn't have the required paid DLC (as indicated in the save file flags).

In my opinion, this point hasn't been adequately addressed yet.

Sun Tzu Wu

Everyone being able to open all the saves is a luxury we may not be able to affort. We can police it but it is a huge pain for those that have the DLC to manage their DLC folders. Compliance is bound to be turn off a lot of potential players.

We have a mod that can ensure the none of the DLC is used. The best case scenario would be to come up with a utility to remove the DLC tags from the save. Of course, this only works if they truely haven't used the DLC.

 

[Robert Smith]

Everyone being able to open all the saves is a luxury we may not be able to affort. We can police it but it is a huge pain for those that have the DLC to manage their DLC folders. Compliance is bound to be turn off a lot of potential players.

We have a mod that can ensure the none of the DLC is used. The best case scenario would be to come up with a utility to remove the DLC tags from the save. Of course, this only works if they truely haven't used the DLC.

I agree to 100%. I fully understand if people don't want to buy DLC over internet/steam. But the New World scenario was funny and so was Mongol scenario (and hard). Both was worth the money. Why not add scenario to HOF

 

[Monthar]

Until all DLC is allowed, even if it's in a separate category from the current chart, I for one will not be participating in the HoF.

 

[Sun Tzu Wu]

Until all DLC is allowed, even if it's in a separate category from the current chart, I for one will not be participating in the HoF.

Consider how many players will not participate if non-free DLC is permitted in the main category.

The Civ V HoF has already started accepting submissions. The Rules are quite clear and extremely unlikely to change.

I don't think your qualification for HoF participation will be acquiesced by the HoF Staff. That would involve a major change to the current rules.

You might try the Civ V GOTM. Perhaps they allow all DLC. I honestly don't know.

Sun Tzu Wu

 

[iggymnrr]

Consider how many players will not participate if non-free DLC is permitted in the main category.

The Civ V HoF has already started accepting submissions. The Rules are quite clear and extremely unlikely to change.

We may see the day where a generic game is available with no civs and the option of picking a certain number from an available pool.

 

[Monthar]

Consider how many players will not participate if non-free DLC is permitted in the main category.

Clearly you didn't read all of what you quoted. I said in a SEPARATE category, not the main.

Just to be perfectly clear so those with trouble reading can understand this. Two categories, the current one and a 2nd category for those of us who don't want to deal with the BS of removing our DLC just to participate.

 

[ImperialGuard]

Any units that get near the Fountain of Youth get a bonus to their heal rate.

Not to mention if you settle a city with FOY in your "realm" you get +10 happiness ... this is an insane additional bonus !!

 

[Ozbenno]

Just to be perfectly clear so those with trouble reading can understand this. Two categories, the current one and a 2nd category for those of us who don't want to deal with the BS of removing our DLC just to participate.

Please watch the tone .

We have made the call on DLC after carefully considering all sides of the argument, knowing that we would make some people unhappy whatever we chose . In the future there may be some relaxation or change to this but not at present sorry. It is early days in the Civ 5 HOF, certainly the rules/tables etc of the Civ 4 HOF are quite different now than when I first started submitting games there 5 years ago.

We certainly don't think that choosing your opponents to avoid DLC is that onerous a task when you set up the game.

 

[Sun Tzu Wu]

Until all DLC is allowed, even if it's in a separate category from the current chart, I for one will not be participating in the HoF.

Consider how many players will not participate if non-free DLC is permitted in the main category.

Clearly you didn't read all of what you quoted. I said in a SEPARATE category, not the main.

Just to be perfectly clear so those with trouble reading can understand this. Two categories, the current one and a 2nd category for those of us who don't want to deal with the BS of removing our DLC just to participate.

I did read what you wrote. I thought I understood what you meant in your single sentence (in your first post quoted above), but obviously misunderstood based on your feedback. I thought you meant you didn't want a separate category. I agree with you that does make a huge difference. Please understand that I was less sympathetic your post (message), because I thought you wanted the main (meaning "only") category to have all DLC allowed.

Perhaps the single sentence in your post had too many clauses for my brain to parse correctly. You might try using more short sentences to get your point across clearly.

I promise to think more carefully when responding to posts. I usually do. In this case I agree with you that I did not spend enough time trying to understand what you meant.

Sun Tzu Wu

 

[Robert Smith]

Just to be perfectly clear so those with trouble reading can understand this. Two categories, the current one and a 2nd category for those of us who don't want to deal with the BS of removing our DLC just to participate.

We certainly don't think that choosing your opponents to avoid DLC is that onerous a task when you set up the game.

I have all DLC and have already 30+ submitted games without removing DLC. For me it's no differences compare to Civ IV. I always use advanced settings to select my opponents depending on type of game (newer select Inca, Spain, Polynesia or Babylon).

And pls compare to Civ IV there we were not allowed to play as Inca, maybe Babylon and Polynesia anyway should be banned due to overpowered?
EDIT: overpowered is not a problem due to change of how the HOF table is constructed in Civ V compare to Civ IV.

So owning DLC is no excuse for not participate in HOF

The only problem is for them how want to check my files and not have all DLS. Today they want be able to open my save files, but what is another story that might be possible in the future.

Everyone being able to open all the saves is a luxury we may not be able to affort. We can police it but it is a huge pain for those that have the DLC to manage their DLC folders. Compliance is bound to be turn off a lot of potential players.

We have a mod that can ensure the none of the DLC is used. The best case scenario would be to come up with a utility to remove the DLC tags from the save. Of course, this only works if they truely haven't used the DLC.