Overall single best node magic type?
- Thread starter strategynoob
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UnforcedError
Settler
I know this is an old thread 
I voted for Metamagic assuming I'm not the Amurites, for the reasons already mentioned in this thread. If I already had Meta I'd probably go with Body unless I'm planning to use golems.
I voted for Metamagic assuming I'm not the Amurites, for the reasons already mentioned in this thread. If I already had Meta I'd probably go with Body unless I'm planning to use golems.
army. fighting city defence while moving in and collateral when the stack arrives.
plasmacannon
Emperor
I picked Sun for Blinding Light (Sun2) and Summon Aurealis (Sun3) which is the only summon to get a +2 affinity from a mana type.
Crown of Brilliance too, since I usually go for Empyrean religion with this mana type.
I have to say Ice3's Snowfall trashes stacks. I used that as the Illians and did well.
Crown of Brilliance too, since I usually go for Empyrean religion with this mana type.
I have to say Ice3's Snowfall trashes stacks. I used that as the Illians and did well.
UnforcedError
Settler
Can't really count on it except for the Illians? (Who are deadly broken anyway
)
UnforcedError
Settler
Hm. In both the base version and MNAI their WS and priests of Winter are enough to conquer the whole map supported by warriors for the early conquest and by horsemen / HAs in the end. Haven't played Illian with EitB yet, don't know what Sareln changed there. Sure, Calabim, Keelyn, Clan or Volanna are powerful as well, but they also require more investments.
plasmacannon
Emperor
Illians OP?
I've looked up some of their end game capabilities, which are strong, but one requires them to declare war on everyone. I would call that a liability.
Recently, I discovered other problems with them. Such as no way to replace their snow if it changed to anything else, and no way to rebuild their workshops on snow once pillaged.
Also, remember they have no FIN or PHI leaders, just combat traits. So they tech slower and can't fund as large of a military.
I've looked up some of their end game capabilities, which are strong, but one requires them to declare war on everyone. I would call that a liability.
Recently, I discovered other problems with them. Such as no way to replace their snow if it changed to anything else, and no way to rebuild their workshops on snow once pillaged.
Also, remember they have no FIN or PHI leaders, just combat traits. So they tech slower and can't fund as large of a military.
UnforcedError
Settler
Plasmacannon: end game capabilities? All you need is tech (bulb) up to Philosophy. That's one my main problems with the Illians, they have tons of cool end game options which will never come into play if you raid the map with your three priests of winter, backed up by warriors, horses, adepts etc, which is all fairly early game stuff. Your traits aren't economically strong, but if you can back you conquest with some early cottages (and later Aristofarms, if you ever get there) defender & CHA are probably the best warring combo in this game as long as you use horses too.
Hint: only build Temples of the Hand in places where you actually want the terrain to become ice (tundra, desert, jungle tiles). These buildings are meant to grant the Illians very early terramorphing capabilities to utilize any land, they come even sooner than KotE (for a potential Scorch or Spring) and a LOT sooner than Vitalize which makes them really powerful. But you still don't want to shoot yourself in the foot and build them on a nice patch of FPs. They only grant +2
and don't return riverside commerce.
As an added bonus your neighbours are going to curse you for that
they don't really have any other early options but to scorch ice tiles and grow a forest on them and even that requires more technologies.
Illians are one of the earliest rushers in the game and their WS will guarantee that your first victim would sit there helpless while you get his land. If you go for a more traditional empire building game you will likely fall behind due to your lack of economic traits (in these cases building Samhain and casting Stasis when it completes might still help).
Hint: only build Temples of the Hand in places where you actually want the terrain to become ice (tundra, desert, jungle tiles). These buildings are meant to grant the Illians very early terramorphing capabilities to utilize any land, they come even sooner than KotE (for a potential Scorch or Spring) and a LOT sooner than Vitalize which makes them really powerful. But you still don't want to shoot yourself in the foot and build them on a nice patch of FPs. They only grant +2
and don't return riverside commerce.As an added bonus your neighbours are going to curse you for that
they don't really have any other early options but to scorch ice tiles and grow a forest on them and even that requires more technologies.Illians are one of the earliest rushers in the game and their WS will guarantee that your first victim would sit there helpless while you get his land. If you go for a more traditional empire building game you will likely fall behind due to your lack of economic traits (in these cases building Samhain and casting Stasis when it completes might still help).
What map/speed/difficulty are you talking about?
I'm not disagreeing though, they are certainly powerful, but I still think that's an issue with the AI then with the civ itself. If you play against intelligent opponents, then a Illian rush just doesn't have the power to run over them, as beyond 1-2 (max) they can tech or otherwise grow past it.
UnforcedError
Settler
I'm talking about IMM / Deity normal speed, standard, SP, and any map that gets you at least 2-3 AI neigbours reachable by land. If you're talking about MP that's totally different. The first thing an MP community would agree on is to disable Stasis nerfing Auric considerably. And obviously MP opponents would count on you building the White Hand and will be prepared for your priests. I think most of the community plays SP though around here. I never inteded to discuss MP tactics.
Yeah I understand that you look at things from a SP perspective, but I'm talking from an in-game perspective - i.e. a tactic is broken when you, as a player, would be unable to defeat it. So yeah, it is broken against the AI, but that is a fault of the AI not of the player.
Example: Aristograrianism is broken because there is no stronger alternative in base.
Worker stealing IMO is not broken, because though it is a lot stronger then not doing so, it is a fault of the AI that you can do it, not of the system.
Example: Aristograrianism is broken because there is no stronger alternative in base.
Worker stealing IMO is not broken, because though it is a lot stronger then not doing so, it is a fault of the AI that you can do it, not of the system.
UnforcedError
Settler
@Tasunke: I think it depends on how early you want to time your attacks. RAI is at a disadvantage at the early game while CHA matters less and less as the game moves on. With the Hippus DEF seems to be the better deal for me. That's guaranteed long lasting horse units. They can get that Combat I promo first if they want.
@Q: So how do you defeat Stasis as a player?
@Q: So how do you defeat Stasis as a player?
UnforcedError
Settler
Yes, that's exactly the pointYou get pissed
You don't. You outlive it/prepare for it. But when it comes, you're still pissed
IMO CHA matters more the longer a game goes - I'm only saving 1-2xp the first 3 promos, but lots more for the 8th promo or so.
And you might not be able to prepare for it either.With CHA the early +1
matters a lot early but a lot less after you already hooked up some happy resources. The promo advantage is relatively constant over the game IMO. And I think the early promo help is more important since it will affect more units (sure, the later promo gaps might matter for a hero, but how many heroes do you have, after all?)
plasmacannon
Emperor
I didn't try rushing with the Illians. That might have been how I got behind of cities.
I haven't been building Samhain.
It seemed like a waste to put more str 3 units out there for everyone else to earn xp on, when I usually need the prod for settlers and javelin throwers.
I've built the Priests of Winter and they hold their own.
IIRC, we can't build more than those 3?
So, if we lose one before they get upgraded to High Priests of Winter, then we are just out of luck.
I haven't been building Samhain.
It seemed like a waste to put more str 3 units out there for everyone else to earn xp on, when I usually need the prod for settlers and javelin throwers.
I've built the Priests of Winter and they hold their own.
IIRC, we can't build more than those 3?
So, if we lose one before they get upgraded to High Priests of Winter, then we are just out of luck.
UnforcedError
Settler
@Plasmacannon: building Samhain only makes sense if you combine it with Statis. You will be able to build units and kill the frostlings while the others won't. Otherwise it's a waste of hammers. In fact it may be a waste of hammers anyway. And no, you only have three priests and won't ever get more 
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