Patch v3.13 change list

[peter450]

Is an Explorer that beats the hell out of other explorers an excellent unit?

2 free scientists come way too late and do not contribute that much to space race victory, you should try it, in fact by the time I usually build the UB I already have half the spaceship, so yeah great UB...

Considering how many mounted units get fielded by other civs from the knights era onwards i'd say a unit that can easily counter a large part of your rivals army is very powerful indeed

If the explorer was a key military unit of it's time an got built in large numbers yeah another explorer that owned it would be very good indeed

 

[ButSam]

Added movie quality dropdown in user options graphics tab
- If your movies crash or stutter, try lowering your movie quality level

I do hope this works, as all movies currently crash my BtS (including the intro movies). This did not happen pre-BtS.

Impressive list of bug fixes, enhancements, and AI tweaks! In particular, it sounds like the AI values espionage about the same, but builds fewer spies, uses its spies in more ways, and seeks alternate methods (buildings) for espionage points instead of draining its commerce immensely. Also, although I don't play on speeds other than Normal in general, I am glad for the sake of others that the posion/foment bug has been fixed. Hopefully, the length is scaled but the degree of unhealthy/unhappy citizens is constant.

I do wonder for the colony cap whether this is before or after the versailles/forbidden palace calculations? Hopefully it is after (so versailles/fp do allow you to reduce costs on that continent significantly). This is much-needed for island maps.

Sam

 

[axident]

Blitz is freaking strong, now you can get away with building and upgrading fewer megaships. More GGs! Buffer Privateers! Yay!

 

[0R4NG3]

Considering how many mounted units get fielded by other civs from the knights era onwards i'd say a unit that can easily counter a large part of your rivals army is very powerful indeed

If the explorer was a key military unit of it's time an got built in large numbers yeah another explorer that owned it would be very good indeed

I think we should go to the Russian thread that I've created if we want to continue discussing this.
My counter argument is that the rifleman is just as well suited to counter cavalry and it comes 2 techs earlier than cossacks, so again the cossack is not an excellent UU...
http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?t=243504

 

[Virulent]

Blitz for ships is a great addition. Now you can get rid of a stack of transports with only 3 or 4 Blitz promoted ships. Before you had to one ship per transport if you had any hope of stopping the AI from dumping a huge stack of units on your shore.

 

[DWOLF]

So when exactly will this patch become available?

 

[Virulent]

So when exactly will this patch become available?

Probably sometime this week. I'm pretty sure not even Firaxis knows at this point as it's more than likely out of their hands and up to 2K by now.

 

[alvan]

damn cocktease!

 

[eoc]

waiting is a hard work !

 

[Plato90s]

Basically in answer to point one there is no paper, rock, sissors, in the late modern era naval game which kinda goes against the grain of practically all the combat units in civ, and means the combat lacks any real tactical edge.

I wrote up a guide to modern naval combat using BTS.

http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?t=243068

Even with the change to the Attack Sub, it's still true. Additional power to the AS is to just make it easier to nail other subs.

For example, your point about Stealth Destroyers are off-base

Take the stealth destroyer as an example, it's combat power is identical to a destroyers so the only reason you'd get one is it's advantage that it can't be seen by any other unit except itself, so whats everyone else do? get the same unit themselves to counter another player who has one. So everyones getting the unit to basically counter itself, it's a pointless addition with it's current stats since it's only reason for being is to counter itself.

Stealth Destroyers are ideal for cleaning up because the #1 drawback for naval battles is that you use up MP's to attack and then a cruise missle counter-attack means your injured units are dead meat. Using Attack-configured SD's means you can wipe up the remnants and leave nothing for the enemy to assault unless the enemy also has lots of SD's.

Trying to counter every unit with itself is just a war of attrition with no strategy. Instead, look at the fact that the Subs have no air-defenses. Your goal is to detect the attack sub and direct air strikes against them. Then you can finish them with Stealth Destroyers which have comparable attack power but more mobility. Withdrawl is meaningless when the subs are being attacked.

On top of that, I don't expect the AI to use a lot of attack subs because they tend to prefer the normal subs due to the penchant for missiles and tactical nukes.

 

[molst]

New info for me, thanks! Does Recycling Center remove that power base unhealthiness?



What makes the upgrade path weird, is that:
- Missile Cruisers can't see Submarines
- Missile Cruisers can't intercept aircraft
- Missile Cruiser move slower than Destroyers

Also, is still that after you're able to build both SDs and MCs you're only units that can see Submarine units are Submarines and Attack Submarines (I think that Submarines aren't considered as "Stealth units")? And why can Stealth Destroyers see Stealth Destroyers, is it because of the game balance? I've understood that stealthing a ship doesn't give it ultimately advanced radar in case of meeting another stealth ship.

I think destroyers should exist side by side with all the other modern era ships. They should just be weaker and cheaper. Probably the battleships could co-exist too. In the real modern times, many ship classes have evolved since the post WW1 era. It would be nice if there were a few ship types so that the composition of a naval group would be a bit more challenging to do.

 

[DMO]

Hello!


How this patch affects Solver's patch?Does 3.13 obsolete it?
Do we need both patches for enhanced gameplay p ) ?


Thank u!

 

[DMO]

My bad:this patch wasn't released yet.

 

[RedRalph]

Any chance do ye think that eventually we could have a couple differeny graphics for some late-era units? It would be nice to have some varioation in Tanks, Warships, Infantry etc

 

[Molon Labe]

Very excited for this. Hope it comes soon, I've got a new game to start.

 

[LDiCesare]

About the vote thing, does it mean you can no longer win by a diplomatic victory with the UN if you have a majority of votes yourself? Does team include vasals?
I understand it may have been needed to avoid silly Apostolic Palace victories, but if it works the way it looks like, it'll ruin the end game for me as I often vote myself into victory rather than spend 30 more turns of pounding helpless enemies.

 

[remko]

regarding the navel warfare
ATTSUB.str 24 +100% vs Battleship/Missilecruiser
MISSILECRUISER.can see Stealthdestroyer can only carry guidedmissiles
(guided missile should give collateral damage)
CARRIER.str 24 only defend (not my idea but a good one )
the rest should be unchanged

by this way (ATTSUB)→(BS/MC)→(DES/STDES)→(ATTSUB)
submarine carrier and transport stay specialized.

this is my vision on how i think it should be

 

[MrCynical]

About the vote thing, does it mean you can no longer win by a diplomatic victory with the UN if you have a majority of votes yourself?

It looks like it will work this way, and it certainly should. It makes no sense to be able to declare a diplomatic "victory" without any diplomacy any more than the cheesy AP "win" made sense.

it'll ruin the end game for me as I often vote myself into victory rather than spend 30 more turns of pounding helpless enemies.

All you're doing is short changing the domination victory condition. That way of getting a diplo "victory" was broken, and badly needed a fix.

 

[_alphaBeta_]

I must admit, I haven't played a BTS game far enough into the modern era to fully understand the modern naval debate. The last I left off, there was an escort problem with stealth destroyers not defending the stack. Does that still exist?

I was going to comment on the power issues, but then I saw someone's answer. So power always causes 2. The only difference is, the coal plant building produces another 2 if it is the only source of power (not being overridden by hydo/nuclear). Is that how it's going to work? I know we couldn't make sense of it before this patch.

The blitz to ships is excellent. Too many times I would be waiting on the coast with destroyers and couldn't stop a fleet of frigates because I didn't have enough destroyers. Didn't make much sense.

I'm also ecstatic to see that the city governor doesn't re-assign worked plots when a worker completes an improvement.

 

[mudfoot]

Great list of neccessary changes, thanks to the team

One important question: Will savegames be compatible to v3.03? It would be very important to know for us succession game players.

First off, looks like a great patch! I'm going to have to be a little bit more careful in the early expansion phase though!

I didn't read every letter of this thread, but I can't seem to find an answer to Mr. Blonde's question.

I don't play succession games, but I'm doing a PBEM game at the moment (which will take some months), so I also want to know whether the save games will be backwards compatible (to any version)?