Punching Nazis

[Timsup2nothin]

Nah. Btw I redact my comments about Malcom X. Malcom X was wonderful.

The funny part is that this "reversal," which I assume is totally lacking in sincerity, is still just as irrelevant to the premise that MLK didn't prove that peaceful protests will work in the absence of violent alternatives, since the violent alternative was there. What you are thinking about that alternative from moment to moment (no matter how wildly that thinking may fluctuate) really makes no difference.

 

[Hygro]

Naw bro he got us

 

[Senethro]

I was kind of puzzled by the inability to empathize with a guy rejected a name assigned by a slaveowner.

 

[Lohrenswald]

Malik L?

since L is the first letter in "Little", he'd probably not at all like being called that

 

[caketastydelish]

One non-trolling, on topic thing I want to bring to the table is the implications of punching a Nazi, at least in the United States. 22 percent of Americans own at least one fire arm. That's more than one in five. What are the odds that a Nazi, of all people, would own a gun? And even if they don't (which they probably do) there is very good odds that at the very least, they'll fight back. Honestly the Nazi getting punched in that video probably would have fought back, the only reason why he didn't is he knew he was on film. There were also protestors around him who were willing to take the assaulters side. If you met a random Nazi in the streets, the situation would have been very different.

From a moral standpoint I've got no problem with punching Nazis. I am coming from a realistic standpoint.

I also don't buy 'the holocaust wouldn't have happened if only the Nazis got punched'. The Nazis would have shot you on the spot if you punched them, which goes right back to what I'm saying.

 

[Timsup2nothin]

One non-trolling, on topic thing I want to bring to the table is the implications of punching a Nazi, at least in the United States. 22 percent of Americans own at least one fire arm. That's more than one in five. What are the odds that a Nazi, of all people, would own a gun? And even if they don't (which they probably do) there is very good odds that at the very least, they'll fight back. Honestly the Nazi getting punched in that video probably would have fought back, the only reason why he didn't is he knew he was on film. There were also protestors around him who were willing to take the assaulters side. If you met a random Nazi in the streets, the situation would have been very different.

From a moral standpoint I've got no problem with punching Nazis. I am coming from a realistic standpoint.

I also don't buy 'the holocaust wouldn't have happened if only the Nazis got punched'. The Nazis would have shot you on the spot if you punched them, which goes right back to what I'm saying.

First off, gun owner, does not equate to gun carrier, so the one in five stat doesn't really apply.

Second, the guy in the video took a hit and run, almost certainly because of the camera and the crowd. In normal circumstances an 'out of the blue' punch like that can be followed by probably three to five more before there is any sort of organized response, because getting punched out of the blue is a very confusing thing. Of course taking the out of the blue shot with nothing but a fist is a waste anyway...the opportunity to end the fight before it even really has a chance to start shouldn't be thrown away like that. Weapons of opportunity are everywhere.

Anyway, I basically agree that in a country full of gun owners gone fascist if you are going to punch one you should be prepared to make sure they stay down and don't shoot you. I recommend either a string of punches or some sort of augmentation to make sure they go down, then either boot them unconscious or stomp their hands, or to be safe do both.

 

[caketastydelish]

So in the best case scenario you'll go to prison. Is that worth it?

 

[Timsup2nothin]

So in the best case scenario you'll go to prison. Is that worth it?

I would say that the best case scenario you put down the Nazi and walk away. The guy in the video I think was a bit foolish, because there was obviously a video. Even so, to the best of my knowledge that guy hasn't been identified or prosecuted, much less imprisoned.

Meanwhile, if I was going to prison I can't think of anything that would make it more worthwhile than if it was for standing up to a fascist. Heck, I've gone for a far less worthy cause.

 

[Kyriakos]

^Most people wouldn't survive in prison - well, even a larger majority in the computer game nerd forum

Anyway, i am not into using violence for anything other than clear self-defense (and/or protecting family members in equally clear situation of imminent danger from a specific person). Hitting someone cause they may do some harm sometime in the future doesn't cut it. Hitting them because their views are disgusting also doesn't cut it.

 

[W|M]

What's the line between clear and unclear self-defence?

 

[Kyriakos]

What's the line between clear and unclear self-defence?

As "clear" i mean that it is logically evident that the person is about to attack you and harm you physically/seriously. In such a case one is perfectly entitled to hit back, or even pre-emptively if the attacker is logically expected to be about to strike (eg maybe the other is 'only' trying to scare you, but if you actually thought you'd be hit you should protect yourself).

 

[W|M]

What if you're facing down a group of Nazis trying to intimidate you to, say, leave the country?

 

[Kyriakos]

What if you're facing down a group of Nazis trying to intimidate you to, say, leave the country?

Carry a crowbar?

 

[W|M]

That implies attacking the Nazis

 

[Timsup2nothin]

^Most people wouldn't survive in prison - well, even a larger majority in the computer game nerd forum

If people really knew what prison was like it would lose most of its value as a deterrent...and it doesn't really have much to start with. As the quote says: "I have gained this by philosophy, that I do without being commanded what others do only through fear of the law." We live in an extremely philosophical era. People obey the law because they want to, mostly, not because they fear the consequences if they don't. Despite how full of themselves our 'law enforcers' have become, if it was really just them that was 'keeping people in line' they would all be dead in a day.

 

[AmtrakQuebec]

... seems legit

 

[AmtrakQuebec]

One non-trolling, on topic thing I want to bring to the table is the implications of punching a Nazi, at least in the United States. 22 percent of Americans own at least one fire arm. That's more than one in five. What are the odds that a Nazi, of all people, would own a gun? And even if they don't (which they probably do) there is very good odds that at the very least, they'll fight back. Honestly the Nazi getting punched in that video probably would have fought back, the only reason why he didn't is he knew he was on film. There were also protestors around him who were willing to take the assaulters side. If you met a random Nazi in the streets, the situation would have been very different.

From a moral standpoint I've got no problem with punching Nazis. I am coming from a realistic standpoint.

I also don't buy 'the holocaust wouldn't have happened if only the Nazis got punched'. The Nazis would have shot you on the spot if you punched them, which goes right back to what I'm saying.

Here is your decision flow...

 

[Kyriakos]

If people really knew what prison was like it would lose most of its value as a deterrent...and it doesn't really have much to start with. As the quote says: "I have gained this by philosophy, that I do without being commanded what others do only through fear of the law." We live in an extremely philosophical era. People obey the law because they want to, mostly, not because they fear the consequences if they don't. Despite how full of themselves our 'law enforcers' have become, if it was really just them that was 'keeping people in line' they would all be dead in a day.

I think that, still, most people would not survive easily in a prison setting. And most prisons are not the hospitable/ civilized kind that looks more like a hotel (eg prisons in Norway)
Or even a mental asylum ward.
Seems that most prisons have serious violence of inmate vs inmate on a daily basis (?).

 

[Hygro]

lolirl

 

[caketastydelish]

I would say that the best case scenario you put down the Nazi and walk away. The guy in the video I think was a bit foolish, because there was obviously a video. Even so, to the best of my knowledge that guy hasn't been identified or prosecuted, much less imprisoned.

Meanwhile, if I was going to prison I can't think of anything that would make it more worthwhile than if it was for standing up to a fascist. Heck, I've gone for a far less worthy cause.

You can do things to stand up for social justice without going to jail. In jail it will be very hard to accomplish much. As a free man you can do far more.

Second: The man in the video was wearing a mask. This would make it hard to identify him. In real life are you going to wear a mask everywhere you go just in case by some random chance you'll encounter a Nazi?