MrBoomBoom
Chieftain
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Can you beg each and every civ every twenty turns or only one?
Pushing and begging
- Thread starter Gliese 581
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TheMeInTeam
If A implies B...
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All of them. Remember though that every 20 turns doesn't guarantee that it will have worn off, it's just more likely. It's 5%/turn that the AI forgets it, but you could go 1 or 1000 before they actually do. 20 is a pretty reasonable beg threshold, and of course anything under 10 is impossible to capitalize on anyway since you'll still have the forced peace treaty from the last beg job.
bobbyboy29
I was saying boo-urns...
Just one note, If you're going to demand gold from a cautious or annoyed AI, make it Ghandi, you don't get a -1 diplo hit for doing it. Also, I often find that just by opening borders early on, you can usually get a few ai's to pleased quick, then as soon as you hit alpha, they'll usually gift you cheap techs like monotheism or priesthood.
Gliese 581
Your average civ junkie
Theoretically you can get every last piece of gold that all AIs has combined during your turns for the entire game. Don't bet your house on it.
TheMeInTeam
If A implies B...
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Theoretically, you could defeat 18 deity AIs on a huge pangaea map by just attacking with warriors you build from turn 1. Also something one might not want to bet the house on (assuming it's still got a positive value).
Gliese 581
Your average civ junkie
Very true, now if humankind is able to survive and play CIV for all eternity then both of those things are going to happen!
Hmmm. Eternity is a long time. In this case it will probably need be longer than the age of the universe. 
CornPlanter
Emperor
Once AI offered me Fission. I didn't even ask, it started conversation itself and offered it. I was about equel with it in research and it was friendly to me obviously. It was Pacal if memory serves me well. Prince level. I was playing Churchill, if it matters. And no, we werent in permament alliance at that time
the AI didn't see you as equal in tech at all...Once AI offered me Fission. I didn't even ask, it started conversation itself and offered it. I was about equel with it in research and it was friendly to me obviously. It was Pacal if memory serves me well. Prince level. I was playing Churchill, if it matters. And no, we werent in permament alliance at that time
and permanent allies don't trade techs, they share them
TheMeInTeam
If A implies B...
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Hmmm. Eternity is a long time. In this case it will probably need be longer than the age of the universe.
Probably...but it could also happen in the very next game one of us plays....
obsolete
Deity
LOL, and do you often destroy your wfyabta tables for such cheap techs?
Gliese 581
Your average civ junkie
Sometimes AIs will give you more contemporary techs, I've gotten Construction, Currency etc when just entering the renaissance era.
Bleys
Deity
At lower levels, WFY isnt as big a factor, because by the late game, you are usually so far ahead it doesnt make a difference.
I have only stareted being concerned with WFY since moving to Emp level and in my last Immortal spanking, I hit it even earlier (which actually could have been a factor, ugh)
As for the topic, I beg gold and techs all the time. I dont keep track of it, but I do have a "feel" for when an AI is willing to give in.
TheMeInTeam
If A implies B...
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It's harder to trade for things at lower levels anyway
. If you want monarchy before 200 AD consistently, better get it yourself 
.Gliese 581
Your average civ junkie
Well you're not usually ahead of the entire field in immortal and deity games and AIs hit WFYABTA faster there. It's easy to hit WFYABTA with all civs at the beginning of the industrial era if you're not careful.
TheMeInTeam
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Yes, I'm well aware
.Friendly really helps, due to the abusive tech trading. If you get someone out of the loop that person is a sitting duck.
What I usually do :
as soon as an AI is pleased with me (some nice stories to follow), I beg all their gold (up to 250, I never ask for more).
I then try to beg every 20 turns. Often I forget and beg after 25 or 30 turns.
This way, I can often make 700+ gold every 20 turns. Enough to run 100% science for the early game, or for the whole game at low levels.
If the pleased or better AIs have no gold to offer, I ask them for all their gpt (up to 10, I never ask for more).
If the pleased or better AIs have no gold and no gold per turn, I sometimes beg a free resource (Free health, or free happiness).
If they have nothing of the totally free kind, I try to trade them something, so that they have gold again, then come back begging.
I like this idea but...
What if you are in between civ A, hindu, and civ B, buddhist. Both are pleased, but worst enemies with each other. You hit them up for freebies, and they both comply, but do free gifts constitute trading with my worst enemy? Also, why only a certain amount of gold, never more than 10 pt or 200?
if you're between the hammer and the anvil, better remove one of those...
I never said you should be a peacenik
I only ask for what they usually give. If you wait longer you can get more, but I like to run 100% science.
I also noticed it doesn't work that well in BtS, for some reason.
You can be successful at begging for techs that you have currently researched a majority of the beakers (75% or so, not sure) If the AI has no cash or resources to beg for, try for a partial tech.
On a separate note, if civ A has a defensive pact with civ B and you want to war with civ B, can a peace treaty "trump" a defensive pact? It is likely that you don't want war with civ A at the same time. If you beg/demand from civ A and form a peace treaty, then declare war on civ B, will civ A honor your peace treaty or honor the defensive pact? Perhaps in this situation, civ A will never agree to a demand or begging. Thoughts?
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