PW-01: Holy word

[stuge]

If my count is right, no less than five spies were stumbled upon in our lands in these ten turns. The water supplies in Thebes and Alexandria got poisoned. No biggie, I just whipped a buddhist temple in Thebes and removed one specialist in Alexandria, but we still need to focus on espionage a bit more. Spies are cheap to build, so we should station one in each one of our cities. Our core cities got spies this round but the minor cities will grow eventually. And since we're going for democracy, jails and security bureaus shouldn't be negleted.

Speaking of techs, none of the AIs still have paper. I researched nationalism and constitution is six turns away. We'll have to research printing press too but the democracy slingshot looks very possible.

The AP proved handy again:

Good, that would have been annoying as hell.

In other diplomacy news, Shaka asked for OB, which I graciously granted him. Also, JC declared war on Alex and this popped up.

Hope it passes before we get any relation hits for "You refused to backstab your friend blah blah blah..."

I made this deal with Alex, mostly for the health bonus with grocers.

Oh by the way, Notre Dame finished. (Memphis killed drama with a lead pipe.) The city had some turns to spare before Taj became available, so two settlers
were trained.

Right now our GA is five turns away.

Our cities surrounding Rhodos are now both running two artists. It might be worthwhile to switch to caste system for a while to speed up the inevitable. The city is at 90% Greek after only three turns of pressure.

I decided to start the Moai statues in Heliopolis. We should probably decide on where to put the NE soon. Oxford should go in Thebes and Ironworks in Memphis, just to state the obvious.

SAVE

 

[pawelo]

Save please stuge.
I think you mis-copy/pasted a link in your post

Anyway, from your report seems that things are going pretty well.

I can't play before this evening or tomorrow morning, so if r_rolo1 wants to swap, feel free.

Regarding the cities, do you think we should continue to expand into our backlands ? We seem in overall nice shape, no ?

Victory wise, we head for space I presume ?

Faith spreading wise, where are our missionaries now ?

 

[stuge]

Crud... okay, working now.

We had two missionaries en route to Rome and they both succeeded. Caesar didn't convert, though. We also had success in Uruk, although Gilgamesh will take some work, all of his cities that we know of seem to have judaism.

The isthmus road is all done now.

I don't think there are many places worth settling left. There's one spot in the far west with cows, gold and iron that could be considered.

 

[r_rolo1]

I'm not sure if I can play today..... If I don't post anything until tomorrow, resume the game, pawelo.

A thing is strucking me.... why do we still have cities without budhism, with all the bonuses that budhism and his religious buildings give to our cites. Especially the cooper/cow city would benefit a lot.....

 

[Zargon]

I think moai statues in Heliopolis should be canceled, and that should be the globe + NE city. It has 9 seafood resources, and it's already up and running, which means we would be able to get it cranking out great persons faster than any of the other seafood cities.

With respect to Rhodos, I'd say start whipping the two surrounding cities aggressively to get religious buildings up for the 5 culture Sistine bonus. Fire the artists to whip the granary, followed by the buddist temple, monastery, & cathedral. That will push the culture output up to 30 per turn without any artists & without free speech. After two artists are hired back after those 4 buildings are built and free speech is adopted, they will put out 80 culture per turn.

To do this, be sure to get buddism into the western bordering city asap, it doesn't have it yet.

 

[pawelo]

Got & played it
Expect a report during next few hours.

 

[pawelo]

As I left our friends in Thebes, the party was on the run. Next player will have some more merry production and commerce to manage

Hey, lets start from the beginning.

Having taken careful notes of wise words spreaded around by my venerable team-mates p), I fired the save.

At first, I canceled the Moais in Heliopolis and granaries in both border cities.

181
Budh Missionary @Thebes - B Miss
Granary@Akhetaten - B Temple
Granary@Hierancopolis - Lighthouse - I dispatched my first missionary on this one
Our AP resolution stopped the war between JC and Alex.
I traded Gold for Shaka's fur, raising a little bit the happy whipping cap
Changed espionnage - put 50% on Mao, 25% on Stalin and Alex each.
We got a Great Prophet in Alexandria - I sent him to Thebes for further use.

IBT
Gilgamesh builds Chitchen Itza

182
I whip the temple in Akhetathen

IBT
Stalin & Gilgamesh adopt Bureaucracy

183
B Miss @Thebes - B Miss
B Temple @Akethaten - B Mona
Spread Buddhism @Hierancopolis and whip the lighthouse asap.

IBT
Stalin wants 400 gold and Music for Optics. I send him away with nothing.

184
B Miss @Thebes - B Miss
Christ Mona @Heliopolis - Library
Knight @Elephantine - Knight
University @Alexandria - B Mona
Lighthouse @Hierancopolis - B Temple
Spread Buddhism @Pi Ramesses
I continue whipping our two monster culture cities. It will just be a matter of time...

IBT
Mao & Shaka DoW Gilgamesh
Buddhism spread in Eridu (Gilgamesh)

185
B Miss@Thebes - B Miss
Not a great surprise, still a nice thing enough to take and serve a screenie :



Party time for 12 turns
Taj @Memphis - B Mona
Courth @Pi Ramesses - University
Granary @Giza - B Temple
Forge @Byblos - Jew Mona
B Mona @Akhetaton - B Stupa
Buddhism spread @Pi Ramesses, Byblos
Some more whip You-Know-Where

IBT
Buddhism @Kish - looks like Gilga does a nice job spreading the true faith for us - I target Rome with next missionaries

186
(IT) Constitution - Printing Press - quick check on AI, no Paper around
B Miss @Thebes - B Miss
B Mona @Memphis - Confu Mona
Knight @Elephantine - LBow
B Mona @Alexandria - Hindu Mona
B Temple @Hierancopolis - B Mona

We are 10 millions, and everyone dances in the streets

I switch University to B Temple @Pi Ramesses
Revolt from Theocracy to Pacifism to get another GP boost.

IBT
Shaka and Gilga both ask to join the war effort - sent them both away
Some unfortunate spread : Hindu@Rome and Tao@Asyut. At least the latter is our city.

187
B Miss @Thebes - B Miss
Confu Mona @Memphis - Tao Mona
LBow @Elephantine - Knight
Granary @Abydos - Courth
whip, whip, whip you city, gently down the stream, merrily, merrily, merrily, merrily, sistine soon will work - ok, it doesn't rime, though I tried hard to make it

IBT
Someone build HS - though we could have done it at least three times @Memphis
JC is now bureaucrat

188
B Miss @Thebes - Jew Mona
Tao Mona @Memphis - Library
H Mona @Alexandria - Versailles (for denial, culture, and some egyptian £)
B Mona @Hierancopolis - B Stupa
Great Engineer born in Memphis - stays there for group debate

189
Jew Mona @Thebes - Christ Mona
Library @Heliopolis - NE
B Temple@Giza - Forge
Jew Mona@Byblos - B Temple
WBoat @Asyut - WBoat

IBT
JC asks for ivory, I gift him gladly (always wanted to keep you happy, dear backstabber )

190
Library @Memphis - University
Knight @Elephantine - Islam Mona
AP vote to stop war against Shaka - yes please! We care for our brothers in faith.
Great Scientist born in Thebes - I sent him to Alexandria for Academy (2nd best science and culture pressure on China always welcome).
Buddhism spread in Asyut.

We have only one non-buddhist city, the newly built Abydos.
Two missionaries are en route to JC.
Gilgamesh may soon switch to Buddhism - I have now 'we simply don't like you enough sh**', so get him to Pleased and he's in the pocket

So, for the state of the world, our mainland :



No new settlement, though some cottage cities would fill nice our backlands. What do you think ?

And the isthmus, the sistine playground :



It won't be long...

To do list :

- don't forget to check if AI has Paper - none have it for the moment - liberate Liberalism if one get Paper

- get more Monasteries online to boost pre-Sci Meth research and allow us to cruise calmly spreading all religions to all our cities before the end

- get Buddhism to our latest city and to all JC cities asap

- JC & Shaka are 'Ho, ho, ho, we have musketman' - we should beeline something more powerful than the LBows...

Three Great People available ( and much more to come soon ):

- Great Prophet @Thebes - either we fire a GA or get a SuperSpecialist IMHO
- Great Engineer @Memphis - GA, Statue of Liberty as soon as available.. ?
- Great Scientist between Memphis and Alexandria - I would fire an Academy in Alexandria for above reasons

The rosting part :

1/ pawelo (played and set off a full 12-turns party time)
2/ r_rolo1 (UP to continue the golden years)
3/ zargon (on deck for more party - double GA someone?)
4/ TriviAl (waiting - rifle time?)
5/ pholkhero (waiting)
6/ stuge (waiting)

 

[r_rolo1]

Ok, got and will try to play today ( have the MLG to finish or else Ozbenno will shoot me... ).

P.S. What is our Lib goal? Demo or something Higher?

 

[pawelo]

Regarding Lib goal, I think about something as high as possible (Biology? )

Anyway, even if we don't bulb Democracy, we should research it asap for SoL reasons.

Side note : lucky you, your pick for the next MLG is more interesting than mine... ;p I got only the 7th...
Btw, pholk beats us all

 

[stuge]

Shouldn't we start using those prophets for shrines, or was that variant buried somewhere along the way?

Build cottages by all means, I see Byblos working an unimproved tile.

 

[pawelo]

I was reluctant about using prophets for shrines as I would like to avoid spreading unwanted religions before we get a serious grip with buddhism on everyone.

We can still put a GP on hold for a while, keeping him for a further shrine.

 

[Zargon]

I think we should use liberalism for democracy, even if none of the AIs make any further progress before democracy becomes available. Reason being we want democracy asap for it's good stuff, and if we research democracy and then one of the AIs picks up paper & education, we're stuck picking a lesser tech, like replaceable parts. Other reason being that liberalism opens up free speech - to really start culture crushing Rhodos, and clears the way for economics.

I see the stupas are almost ready to get whipped, and so those + free speech would up the culture output to 60 just a few turns into the next set. That oughta push it down to one tile in no time.

I think the best bet for the final two religion flips would be to use spies to do it. At least I think. They can influence civics, so they can influence religion too, right?

I think backfilling 2-4 cities, simply to cottage them over would be a good idea. With Versailles going up in the wine city, I'd say all the land behind us is fair game.

 

[TriviAl]

I think backfilling 2-4 cities, simply to cottage them over would be a good idea. With Versailles going up in the wine city, I'd say all the land behind us is fair game.

Agree with the other things you said - and I think this is a particularly excellent idea - with Emancipation those would start to pay off in almost no time - just need enough workers to get them firing on all cylinders?

The other upside to emancipation is it would further slow the other civs with the happy penalty - and IIRC, would channel them down a peaceful line of research - which is a double win for us?

Side note : lucky you, your pick for the next MLG is more interesting than mine... ;p I got only the 7th...
Btw, pholk beats us all

16th pick. Will I be stuck with Shaka?

 

[r_rolo1]

^^No.... maybe with boudica

 

[r_rolo1]

I've played my turnset.....

Not much to say: got Demo from Lib ( I agreed with Zargon ), made some monasteries, got Gunpowder and RP and I'm beelining Rifles. Gilga is a budhist, two more Roman cites are budhist ( tried to pick the biggest ) and Mao is with hands full and in Theo ( not good ). Got SoL and we are in a second GA, with 2 more shrines ( hindu and Jew ). Our money is skyrocketing and we are ages away from the AI. Changed civics to FS and Emancipation ( ) and have a pending AP vote for the pope chair vs Alex ( that is culturally backfiring in sushi area )

Save below, and proper report tomorrow ( I'm sleepy.... tried to finish MLG before this ( not yet, but justinian is toast ..... ) )

 

[Zargon]

Time to play hardball with JC. I'm going to reallocate all our espionage to him so we can flip him to buddism with a spy. It'll cost 330 EPs, with a success chance around 75% if I remember correctly, and we are generating 31 EPs per turn now. But a few jails & security bureaus will multiply that number a couple times over. Although, if I can get a spy there fast enough, I'll just push the espionage slider for what I need.

I'll probably research economics, corporations, chemistry, steam power.

Also, wow we have a lot of money. After wall street goes up, we will have to rush buy buildings one after the other. Or we can gift it away to AIs we want to be friendly with.

Is anybody else extremely worried about the pope vote? Alex is friendly with 3 civs we are cautious towards.

edit: just checked the victory conditions page, and it looks like we have enough votes to block a religious win by Alex. With this crazy amount of money we have floating around, I'll put down a bunch more cities just to make sure we don't get blindsided by a diplomatic loss now, or in the future. Also cottages.

edit edit: Also, I think I'll start sabotaging the theater in Rhodos. Wouldn't want Alex running any pesky artists.]

edit edit edit: I'll play tomorrow evening to give anybody who cares time to add input on my expected course.

edit edit edit edit: Actually, a cultural victory is all set to fall into our laps. Our first two cities will hit legendary culture with no/minimal work, and I'm sure we could work the first seafood city or the wine city into a legendary city easily as well, so perhaps we ought to refrain from founding more cities in favor of fulfilling the remaining victory conditions.

 

[r_rolo1]

Now the proper report:

First we finished PP and finished the ongoing wars:

Spoiler :

.....
Got some stupid requests ( violations of our Decalogue )

Spoiler :

Used the ongoing missionaries to Roman cities..... JC still doesn't like us enough to us to bribe him to budhism.

Got our Lib quest done ( we could have delayed it ad infinitum ( in the end of the turnset no one still had Paper ), but I agree with Zargon that Demo is good enough....) and of course started SoL ( burned our GE in it )

Spoiler :

Also changed civics:

Spoiler :

FS to put more pressure in Sushi area and Emancipation to put our dear friends unhappy

Got another GP... him and the inherited on made the capitol shrines ( more spreaded religions + Bank = $ )

Spoiler :

Used the inherited GS to more 12 turns of GA... it looked to me as the better choice ( we need to build more stuff ATM )

Finished Versailles.... not much of effect ( IMHO we should had not build it, but..... )

Spoiler :

It was all looking well until I noticed this:

Spoiler :

Not good.... I started some muskets and next player should do a couple of rifles too, just in case. Some turns at 0% for mass upgrades would be nice as well

A little later I got the big star of my turnset:

Spoiler :

A AP vote ( a cookie to the first one that discover my vote option )

Spoiler :

And a last pic... this one is full of intel:

Spoiler :

Some issues:

There are some missionaries en route , including a islamic one to one of the border cities with Alex sushi city. We should pile religions in both cities and do some religious buildings.
there is a settler in Alexandria for backfilling issues. Suggestions for settling place are welcomed.
I negleted lumbermills for now, but maybe we should spread them, except in the N .Park city ( do we have one planned? ).
We should use the GA to pile advanced units ( I'm thinking rifles ) and the last monasteries ( we should aim for sushi.... for that we need SciMet ). Maybe Mao is thinking on Stalin, but we should not take chances

P.S. Sorry for the rushed report, but I have my nephew in home ( he's got a cold )

 

[TriviAl]

Nice turns! SoL and more GA action is fantastic stuff!

Hope the nephew is feeling better.

Shame about Mao - did anyone find out if you can directly espionage the state religion away?

Rifles would mean he won't be getting anywhere into our territory. A sqaubble between him and Stalin wouldn't do much harm - keeps them both occupied?

 

[pawelo]

Very nice paty time, ain't it r_rolo1 ?
I just love those MoM GA

Anyway, seems we have to keep our power rating the same as Mao. It won't hurt us much as we have big egyptian £££. Still, it slows other areas of us.

We can afford 4-5 cottage backfilling cities, so we should start planting them on nice spots in our lands. I would prioritize the west coast cities, to limit the risk of Mao or some other guy stucking the city on our lands.

Btw, Rhodes-$hit seems resisting better than thought. Good idea with multiple religions in those two cities and sabotaging the theatre.

Sorry for short reply, I spent the whole day out and am burned out.

Good luck to Zargon for this evening, your plans look very well.

 

[Zargon]

turn 0: shifting stuff around. shifting spies. shifting build priorities. shifting EP priorities.
Rhodes: 68%

turn 1:
Rhodes: 64%

turn 2: We get another great prophet. I'll save him for the moment, since the 4 religions without shrines aren't at all widespread.
Rhodes: 61%

turn 3:
Rhodos: 58%

turn 4: economics is in, sleep the merchant (presumably for sushi). flip to free market, pick up 46 beakers.
Avaris is founded
Rhodos: 55%

Spoiler :

turn 5:
Rhodos: 53%

turn 6: Rhodos starts to feel the pressure... 51%

Spoiler :

turn 7: Squish.
49%

Spoiler :

turn 8: revolt action. And they moved in a 3rd defender, which will make it harder to flip.
47%

Spoiler :

turn 9: Great merchant is born. Hmm.
Also, more revolts.
45%

Spoiler :

turn 10:
not much

An overall boring turnset. Built a crapload of missionaries, but we still need so many more. Got the spy in position, but don't have the EPs to flip JC yet. Need to build more jails + security bureaus.

Mao is attacking somebody else, so I didn't build any more military.

to do list:
1) Keep laughing at Rhodos. Actually we got crazy lucky with the first revolt there at only 47% with 3 defenders.
2) Buddist buildings in the new city.
3) More jails + SBs
4) More missionaries. Make sure none of the religions fall behind. When we have 6 religions in lots of cities, we want the missing religion to be as varied as possible, since it will take so many tries to get the last one in. We don't want 6 cities waiting on Confucianism, because we can only have 3 of those missionaries out at once and that will be a bottleneck.
5) More lumber mills
6) More universities for Oxford (check this, it just hit me that I didn't build oxford or see the option to, this is probably why but I didn't check)

questions:
1) we have 2 great merchants hanging around. One can stay for sushitown, and the second.... golden age? Probably. We'll probably get another crappy great person in due time.
2) I spread a lot of taoism this round, pretty much having the northwest city spam taoist missionaries most of the turn set. Tao shrine could go up in wondercity, and wondercity is getting a bank (need 6 banks for wall street, I think they're all building).
3) Keep Mao's city when it eventually flips to us, or disband it?