Discussion in 'Civ4 - Modpacks' started by avain, Jan 29, 2008.
I like that.
@Sword_Of_Geddon: actually I'm following almost all mods out there, and I'm not afraid to 'borrow' good ideas.
Stone Age: this was something I wanted to do for quite some time now. The way I would like it would be sg like this:
- you start as a nomad tribe, so no cities, only unit generating camp of sorts (or you can build a single "city", community of sorts, but I really prefer the nomad tribe, because: )
- you could do some limited things: hunting and running from animals, popping some modified goody huts, "researching" some early techs(here I could even imagine some different teching than the beaker system seen in civ), etc.
- once you get to a certain tech/turn number, you can settle your first city, and start the 'real' game AND the map would once again be covered with shroud except for your city's surroundings, lose the Stone Age units and get some starting units based on your achievement
- the whole idea would be so that you are able to receive some, well balanced bonuses coming from the Stone Age based on your achievements, e.g. certain promotions for your starting unit(s), 1 or 2 prestige building(s), and of course the knowledge of your surroundings and perhaps the position of some early resources if you managed to 'tech' reveal them (it'd be a map in your own head, because the map would be shrouded again, e.g. simulating that in early history much knowledge was lost from times before settling)
So you could plan where to have your first city a bit better, plan ahead building your empire - but the new goody huts would still reward your scouts and you would not know where those are.
Major problems: AI. How to limit the AI in this first, "Stone Age" phase. The best would be to somehow delay them spawning until the point of settling.
Regeneration of goody huts, and different goody huts for the Stone Age.
Please don't include the Egyptian religion as "Amun-Ra". It's like listing the Greco-Roman pantheon as "Zeus"/"Jupiter" or the Norse pantheon as "Odin".
I guess this is mostly a question of what you want, to play Civ BTS, or to play an entirely different game with the same engine that may be good as well, but definitely not BTS.
More diverse unit graphics, various time saving screens, prestige units like the Red Baron, and non-cost-effective abilities like forest planting and terraforming do not fundamentally change the game. Revolutions do, but subtly, encouraging mostly the same behavior as the base game, but in a more nuanced way.
Completely reworked tech trees and unit/ability progressions in the early and mid game fundamentally change the game, and not at all subtly. Obviously, this is avain's mod, but I would be disappointed if he takes this path. There are more than enough mods that do this already.
I cannot perform ranged bombardment with battleships in v4.5. Is it fix in v5.0?
I would suggest to add more national and world wonders in the modern and future era. Maybe a second sort of "Versaille" wonder. You might wanna add the wonders from BtS "Extra" actually.
@Avain, so like a mini-game before the real game starts? It would be fun if the focus be hunting, maybe start with 2 or 3 stone age units. You'd have to target weaker animals first until you pick up the hunting promotions. You could then keep those upgraded units once you settle the first city + plus have some explored map in your "head", like you said.
I would guess that the AI could not be programmed to particpate in this mini-game? How do you plan on balancing the start for the AI so the human player does not have an advantage?
Agree. One thing QC does very well is open up new playing experiences without altering the default playing experience any great deal. I have all these new toys to play with, yet the Strategy and Tips forum remains relevant.
I would like to see some new UN resolutions, something like "ban biological weapons" and "ban cloning" (can not build clones, automates and cyborgs).
Also, following the "hunting mod" mechanics, I would so appreciate if you could implement a "prisoner of war" mod. At each kill, a player could have a very small chance to make a POW. Each POW could automatically gives some intelligence points or boost production in a random city.
Just throwing out some ideas, can’t help it.
P.S.- Can terraforming be slightly less costly? Global warming is a pain in the late game...
Well I think a couple of missing link units wouldnt hurt the overall game. Just add some flavor and epicness to the middle eras. Basicly, its so you don't have horsemen from the age of the babylonians until the arrival of the knight, you have something cool that existed in between those things.
Also Avain if you check out the newest notes for the extra mod, he had a good idea with the advent of the Hover units. You might want to check it out.
We could have a more epic game featuring an expanded past, and then a more developed future era.
The thing id love the most is if we could get a future age city set, and music for the era.
More UN resolutions would be nice, I agree.
I'm aware of how the game balance is intended in the early game, and I'm sure avain is even more aware of it. I repeat that I am in no way suggesting an overhaul of the early game. It's been pointed out there are many mods that do this already (and I often don't care for them because I feel they go too far). I disagree that realism and game balance are mutually exclusive ends. Trying to do both is much harder than trying to do one or the other, but just because something is hard doesn't mean it cannot or should not be attempted.
Also, I never said anything about pushing road-building back, or in fact making any changes to when roads become available in the game. Perhaps I didn't elucidate enough, but regardless of what tech is what, the ultimate effect of my second example would be little more than pushing chariots back a very small amount, if any.
To be more specific, imagine "The Wheel" is just called something else, like "Trade" or "Road Building," maybe make it a tiny bit cheaper (50 or 40 instead of 60). Then a different cheap tech called "The Wheel" is added to the tech-tree just after Animal Husbandry, which gives chariots and maybe some other benefits. This "new" Wheel tech, rather than being required by certain techs which wouldn't realistically require it, is only required by those that would (and by Catapults, which currently can actually be built without knowledge of The Wheel ). By the time you've researched Animal Husbandry to find horses, built a pasture, and hooked up some roads, you've probably already finished researching the "new" Wheel tech, and the only real change to the game was the fact that you made the strategic decision to research said Wheel tech because of those conveniently located horses, while some other civ without horses might not have.
+1 for future era cityset
your mod is the first one I cannot even load. CTD while loading. 3.19, xp, no problems with other mods for 3.19, Sid Meier's Civilization 4\Beyond the Sword\Mods\Quot Capita ...
I'm really enjoying playing this mod, thanks for your hard work! I was wondering, was it intentional to give Japanese axemen dual katanas? Thanks again.
Just checked, battleships and also destroyers cannot perform ranged bombardment in 5.0. Other ships are working fine.
Don't know if this means anything, but iDCMBombAccuracy for both units are set to different values in ModernEra_4VD_Water_CIV4UnitInfos.xml and Civ4UnitInfos.xml.
I agree that a future era cityset would look good, so I'll look into the issue. (I'm mostly aiming for the sets seen in Planetfall)
@Cybah: try installing only the base mod (without the additional leaders), I've got other reports that some rigs cannot handle all those graphics.
@riddleofsteel: it's Danrell's work, it came with his new Jap. set. I too was thinking if this is appropriate, but currently yes, it is the Jap. axeman.
@Martin79, sourdiesel:I will check the battleship issue, thanks for reporting.
@all: thanks for the suggestions and discussions! I'm checking the mods here on CFC, Extra is of course one of those, but most notably Thomas' War has some really neat mechanics, python scripted wonders and amazing graphical events - I hope I'll be able to incorporate some of those.
Also, you will not see a massive rework of the earlier eras - I kinda like it's balance and progression and the overall feel - I'm even worried about adding wonders. (but the first wonder I decided to include for sure is Leonardo's Workshop)
Please, please be very selective of python scripted stuff because thkey SLLOOWWW down the game based on my experiences so far.
I will, don't worry.
I think it might be a good idea to be able to win by Conquest/Domination victory OR Mastery victory. Basically, if I can conquer the world, I should be the winner. If I can't, then the victory should be judged at the end of the game according to the Mastery victory rules.
I just can't see the point to wait until the end of time to see if I win when all rival Civilizations are my vassals or dead.
BTW Avian, a suggestion; could you please incorporate the "New Sentry Actions" modcomp in the next version? This strikes me as a VERY useful addition.
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